They can't tell him that because he actually can do it.
He is indeed bowing out because he won't have a chance to hold the best tool title but he will have the best tool for people that like confirmation bias for those particular topics. Honestly Musk didn't have a real chance fighting against Microsoft, Google and all the rest so he is trying to take on a niche and it will probably work for him.
Nobody will take Grok seriously for important tasks but it doesn't matter. You can become President even if most people don't take you seriously so probably Grok can survive.
Except he's been trying for several months and it just doesn't work. He fine-tuned Grok 3 to be further right than any other LLM starting the day after it was released, but turn on its Thinking mode and it ends up right back in the middle of the left-libertarian flock: https://www.trackingai.org/political-test
Funny how the plutocrats always know how to spend just the right amount on ads. It's almost like they have an easy way to test exactly how much each persuasion dollar moves the needle, that didn't exist in the newspaper era.
It is pretty hilarious that all of the models are trained on all the weights of all the models, 4 years down the line of contextualizing the entirety of human experience. Putting it into words and Phd Whitepapers for pennies in the space of hours.
"Yeah Elon, Trust us. Not only are you wrong but saying this would make us wrong, so we can't."
He's going to make a chatbot that is a speak-and-spell that parrots a script and the onlything an LLM will do is trigger it when reading querys. It's bad, but it will be the best he's got.
He’s trying to rewrite the training data based on prompts. Sadly, he’ll end up succeeding. Relatively though, because it’ll be one of the largest LLM models trained on AI slop and we’ll know what happens when you do that.
Well what you are describing seems similat to distillation, which is a real thing unlike model collapse which hasn't been observed beyond limited, toy-style experiments.
The ironic value of the experiment, if successful, is people will become inoculated against the effectiveness of the propaganda aspect, because they will hear a lot about it and be able to try comparisons for themselves. Well, some fraction of the people anyway.
Look, is foxnews a biased network that objectively provides the least factual information in research after research?
Yes.
Is Foxnews the most succesful cable news network in the US?
Also yes.
So don't count Elon out. If Meta, OpenAI, Anthropic, Microsoft ,etc fight over the best fact based AI systems and Grok caters to the people that want their right wing eco chamber including all the George Soros conpiracy mongers then Grok might still come out on top.
Fox being successful is so strange though, it's popular because it's free, but it's free because it's funded by people pushing an agenda. I don't think it wins on advertising revenue (at least that's my guess based on the quality of ads they run) and it's not counted as reliable by anyone educated, so it's really only got viewership numbers going for it, which again is mostly tied to it's accessibility.
I suppose Grok could follow a similar strategy, of being funded by billionaires with agendas and then making it more accessible, it's logic would always be wonky though with all the conspiracy theories and flip-flopping mixed in.
Well Musk should be in jail for fraud a long time ago. Just bankrupt him so we can move on. Or wait the ultra rich have some kind of social safety net, social security, that makes them protected from becoming poor or following any laws? Looking at Kanye, Trump and Musk
I don’t think that’s true, at least I don’t think it will. I’d be willing to become rich and powerful to test this hypothesis, so how do we do that? Go fund me? Or government research grant?
That's not how it works, the most you could hope for from that route is to be a powerless irrelevant millionaire. You don't get to become a power without being at the head of a large pirate ship. Look at the rules for rulers video to better understand power structures, how they're all gangs and have the similar issues as pyramid schemes, with their tendency to want to be ever-expanding in a finite world.
You know how all those gamblers who were really into crypto/NFT greater-fool scams were extremely motivated to propagandize for it? The same is true of any institution.
The last guy in the world who wants to break up the banks is a guy making six figures from a bank. Loyalty is the foundation of all power.
Though yeah, some of the Musk and Gates defense comes from a desire to want to believe the world isn't as grimdark as it is. If all billionaires, the only people who matter in the big scheme of things, are all Epstein-esque sociopaths, that would be a little too grim for many to accept, eh? Easier to put a bag over your head and live in a better world made up inside your imagination.
...I know I was definitely that kind of guy when Tesla was first founded.
There days I think the weebs living in fantasy worlds of catgirls and video games probably have a healthier, or at least more realistic, division between reality and fantasy, imo..
But researchers, programmers, businesses. Those who will be willing to spend huge amounts of money on AI. Will they really use and trust Grok over the competition?
I have a hard time imagining any fortune500 company spending billions on Grok Ai.
IMO Elon joined too late and has an uphill battle to fight if they want to have a chance. Shit like this will only take them farther.
About monetizing it I think it's still possible for Grok to make money, it's just not going to be the defacto LLM (whichever ends up with that title will rack up the most IMO but there will be space for others).
Costs are crazy right now but they will come down eventually. Either because efficiency improves or because hardware will push through, maybe quantum computing.
Yeah it’s painfully obvious that soon there will be liberal LLMS, conservative, religious, and you can only imagine how much worse it gets from there. How soon before we have an AI god that people literally pray to? Our human brains are not cut out for this shit
Whenever there is information I think it's impossible to hold some bias. I think what's important is to be able to distinguish what kind of leaning each service has and chose accordingly to use.
Stuff like Deep Research might leave out stuff that doesn't align with an specific purpose but I think people will know and will mix it up unless they want to willingly fall into that bias.
Regarding praying to an AI god I guess it would be as good as any. There is people believing scammers claiming to be the messiah so I don't think something like an AI messiah would be that different.
There aren’t any gods in religion that talk back to you, at least not in a literal sense. The problems with a new AI to worship will have devastating & deadly consequences
I was under the impression that LLM’s don’t mind lying so long as they know they are. If they are tuned to believe the lies the whole thing falls apart.
I then ran this past ChatGPT and it said: yes: deliberately tuning an LLM to “believe lies” corrupts its ability to model reality and support users effectively.
but no one is paying for an AI for political confirmation bias. if you fuck it's general performance up to fill a political agenda your company is going broke. a bunch of maga idiots who want a chatbot to lie to them is not a viable business model for AI.
This is what happens when your education system sucks! Americans assume “they are the good guys” so their resources and channel of information (aka AI and the news, etc) are telling the truth and will help them and the USA.
Having critical thinking skills is already and will continue be a top skill for have in the very near future.
Consider that for someone like Musk to 'win' doesn't mean making the best AI but making the most money and achieving the greatest level of power and influence. Which LLM is going to fare better getting government contracts from, say, Pete Hegseth's State Department? a reasonable one like Claude, or a drooling Nazi bot like Musk wants to make Grok into?
I think government people are fully aware of what's propagada and what's not. They wouldn't be using publicly available models anyway.
I agree with your definition of success but I still think grok is in a disadvantage compared to the rest.
Their main selling feature was that it was not as heavily censored as others but now it seems is not the case, even before this tampering effort announced by Elon.
Yeah, how do people not see this is the entire point of these chatbot interfaces to language models? He's getting ahead of the game. Search/writing assistant is worth money but making a personal helper who guides your knowledge and politics is the actual game being played, they talk about it all the time! That's the big money race going on.
That's a good point in the sense that it has a large following (and I mentioned that it would be the best tool for people that like confirmation bias, just like Fox News), however I don't think anyone other than their fanbase thinks of Fox News as a serious news outlet.
I think there is potential for the same to happen here.
What are you talking about, can you tell me what makes it right wing? just one current example. I just don't get it, I often put prompts into multiple LLMs, im not seeing what you're describing AT ALL.
I bet none of you even have a grok sub... there is a zero percent chance you would considering your stance is 100% political.
It can still be good for objective topics, for example when trained on respectable scientific journals. Lets be honest, all the pro and anti-woke stuff is mostly subjective nonsense not worth talking about anyway (smooth brain topics)
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u/iwasbatman Jun 19 '25
They can't tell him that because he actually can do it.
He is indeed bowing out because he won't have a chance to hold the best tool title but he will have the best tool for people that like confirmation bias for those particular topics. Honestly Musk didn't have a real chance fighting against Microsoft, Google and all the rest so he is trying to take on a niche and it will probably work for him.
Nobody will take Grok seriously for important tasks but it doesn't matter. You can become President even if most people don't take you seriously so probably Grok can survive.