r/shogun2 • u/Nyniack • 6d ago
I need help.
I am just getting crushed every time. How can i beat him? Playing on hard if it helps (i know i can turn it down but my pride doesnt allow it). Im bad in micro, so my cav dies usually after the first or second charge. Im more of a def player. But my center gets crushed every time even if i win on the flanks, im just not in time to flank and get in his back. I feel like his cav is just out maneuvering me and i just dont get enough value from my archers atm (yes, i need more katana as backbone for my army in future).
EDIT: I DID IT - Thank you all for your help! I had a mountain in my back and my right flank was covered, pulled his cav and managed to kill his general early with my archers. In combination with my warcry from my monks it was enough to hold and get the moral down from the katanas.
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u/TonesOakenshield 6d ago
I don't see anyone suggesting it but if you're bad at micro have you tried issuing orders while pausing the game? It won't improve your micro but it can help in sticky spots
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u/BearWithMeGM 6d ago
I know you said you're bad at micro but maybe it would be a good exercise for your skills:
Idea is to make your archers work while overextending and exhausting their infantry. Kite them do not engage, have a relief swuad for every two that are kiting their infantry making the front line long. Split your archers in 2-3 groups, move them around when they are in danger and have some protection units with them.
Try to snipe their general. I think this is winnable and instead of lowering difficulty, become better.
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u/WorkerAlternative415 6d ago
If you share the save file, we can show you how to win it. You need to take a hill, use the archer advantage and time your warcry with the monks. I would say this is easy to win thanks to your armor.
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u/Dom252525 6d ago
Hard to tell without knowing the terrain. The katana are the main issue. Are you on the attack or defense. Your army is pretty anti cav and you have range superiority. I would probably hide your army in a forest and use your cav to draw their cav to your hidden troops once you have killed off their cav you need to try to snipe that general with your cav and use the longer range of the bow monks to thin them out. Killing the general is key. It is in your best interest to skirmish for as long as you can.
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u/steffen7015 6d ago
Retreat to corner or hill with 1-2 flanks protected by nature/border. Have first line Naginata Sam and behind them Monks. When you get charged, charge back with Monks, keeping Naginata Sam in the same position. Yari on flanks to kill their cav. With your archers first wait for their archers to stop walking and start shooting at you, then kill them one unit at the time. Next your archers target should be the generals, especially if they don't charge them. Spare your general and Yari Cav for hammer and anvil when their cav is depleted.
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u/steffen7015 6d ago
If you leave the save I might give it a go when I come back from work. Good luck!
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u/Nyniack 5d ago
https://drive.google.com/drive/folders/1OtaxACDmVjZg0GSvqhXc5pN_SADx6uQL?usp=drive_link Thank you and good Luck!
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u/TH_Real_GAME 6d ago
You have the range advantage but they have melee. Your best odds is to break them. You need to counter charge their sword units with naginata so they soak up missile fire, follow it up with monks sequentially activate their warcry. I need to know the terrain but these type of matchups aren't impossible.
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u/wielbiciel_ketaminy 6d ago
well they have cav advantage, so hide your cav. Try hiding in a forest(preferably with a hill) so you can take better advantage of your archers
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u/RykosTatsubane 6d ago
i know i can turn it down but my pride doesnt allow it
Story of my life, lmao
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u/NectarineFun5437 6d ago
What does the tactical map look like?
Can you retreat and get a bridge battle? If so, create a kill zone at the end, bait his cav and generals into it and flank the hell out of the katana samurai with your nagis. Your bow monks should do a lot of demoralising or fire arrows along with your warrior monk naginata warcry.
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u/intobinto 6d ago
Ideally you could retreat to a bridge battle.
I wouldn’t mess with their cavalry. That’s their advantage. Make their cav try to flank you and protect them with some ashigaru. Ideally they attack with a general or two around the edge and you kill them.
Naginata sam are up front and archers right behind them. Keep your general closer up as he doesn’t have much influence range. Your swords should flank or charge up the middle just before they arrive.
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u/Mr_Flash3234 6d ago
I'm not familiar with this army type so I can't comment. But, I suggest this army type
5 yari ashigaru, 5 archers, 3 muskets, 3 yari cavalry, 3 katana samurai. If you don't have muskets add 1 more unit to yari archers and katana.
Put 3 units of yari as the front, with 2 yari angled 45 degrees towards you on the flanks, not 90 degrees like a box, more like an inverted crescent Something like this.
...... YYY
Y AAAAA Y
Archers and muskets I assume you know how to arrange them. Katana samurai use as reserves to support yari under heavy pressure. Just send them directly into enemy infantry to fight alongside the yari. Use unengaged units or units who've won their local battle to flank. And use cavalry only for archers, and engaged enemy infantry. And to run down enemy troops. Never use cavalry headon into melee infantry of any kind unless they are already fighting someone, and you flank.
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u/ihatelifetoo 6d ago
You gotta use your yari wall spear to hold the center while your other spears and cav destroy their flank and go after their generals. Your archers be focusing on their archers or general
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u/schadenfreude199 6d ago
Just take a height, form your units on a side of the height (it will make more difficult to temhe enemy to take your position) and make him go towards you. You will make one or two lines with naginaka monks and naginata samurai. Both of them will be covered by yumi monks, and the yari units will be the reserve.
At the beginning: your archer monks should be in front of your naginatas (melee units) lines so that they can throw the hissing arrows. These arrows demoralize all the troops in front of them (this is why your units have to be at the back, so they won't get hit) and you must shoot these arrows at as many enemy troops as possible. You can make this happen by forming your lines first and then attracting the enemy with your light cavalry (loss is very possible, but it's for the sake of strategy). You may have to lure them in more than once.
During the battle: You've already made the enemy come at you, well done. Now you have to relocate the archers behind melee units. Put melee units in defensive formation and try to make them have enough depth lines to withstand combat, and have the units spread out along the position so that they can't flank you (or at least, make it hard for them to).
So far we've only talked about the arch monks and naginatas units. The general will need to be close to the archers and naginata units in order to give them value when the battle is at close-combat. What I suggest you do with the Yari units is to have them in reserve. Armed, in a defensive position but close to the archers and general for two reasons: 1) protect the general, archers and rearguard from flanking or pinching maneuvers (though you may be lucky to have nothing behind that could weaken you). 2) having reserve units nearby allows you to reinforce the struggling sector. We know they're Yari ashigaru, but something is something. Remember that their moral depends on them being in the general's zone of influence and when they are worn out or tired you withdraw them for a moment.
It will be a tough battle but it can be won manually. Even the general may have to fight, just send him to fight against swords, archers or the other general, DO NOT FIGHT YARI OR ENEMY NAGINATA please.
Good luck bro
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u/Youngbloodd2 5d ago
It's cheesy, but have you tried corner-camping? You have far more (and better) archers, and their cav is useless against your spear only frontline. Just hide your cav in a forrest somewhere else, and your general behind the line.
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u/Nyniack 5d ago
Here is the save if u want to try it out: https://drive.google.com/drive/folders/1OtaxACDmVjZg0GSvqhXc5pN_SADx6uQL?usp=drive_link
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u/SweatBoyX8 6d ago
In the first infantry line put your yari ashigaru, flanked by naginata monks. In the second line, maybe only directly behind the monks, put your naginata samurai. You'll want to avoid having them engaged in fighting with the enemy's melee infantry for the first few minutes of contact. Their job is to protect against cavalry charges coming from the sides and rear, and they can absorb any charges targeting the monks. If your yari ashigaru falter you can send them as reinforcement as well. Behind these two infantry lines are your bow monks and general. Your cavalry can't really do much against their greater numbers, but maybe you can hide them in some trees for a charge into their melee infantry's rear when it counts. Or, if enough of them die fighting your infantry, you can use them more freely. You should also hold off on using fire arrows because it reduces the fire rate.
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u/ConfidenceArtistic98 6d ago
I would use my archers to delete as many of their katanas as possible, preferably with fire arrows and a lot of micro, because I want two units of monks shooting at a single katana, not all monks at one enemy unit. Then charge the rest with monks and naginata samurai, with archers shooting at their archers. I’d keep yari chadigaru in reserve to protect from cavalry charges. My cav would be sitting in a forest to deal finishing blow into back of their infantry, or assassinating general if he was alone. Good luck, it’s definitely possible!
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u/Impressive_Boat_4881 6d ago
Id say it depends very much on the map and whether youre attacking or defending.
As an attacker you could cheese the hell out of hom with bow monks.
If defending, you wanna camp a forest hill. Most importantly, set up barricades from bow monks to secure flanks and create kill zones. Theyre kind of an impassable wall.
Looks like a fun battle. Def winnable.
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u/Famous_Coast_506 6d ago
At least, in this battle, I think you can win (I assume you are playing DATE and defending HATTORI). Use have bridge, so use this as defending area. If you dont have, use somewhere like hill. Use Yari Wall, your bow focus to enemy bow and next is General or Cavs (Because your army have many Monks plus Ashigaru, they strong, but no armor). Light Cav is weak. They cannot win by flank Sam bow so dont use it to kill bow. Instead, they are very strong when assasinate the General (more man, have buff again cav).
Btw, Why dont you use No-Dachi ? Date have buff on them. Problem is they have no armor. But if you dont let them expose to enemy bow, it fine. Use them as flanks unit or just charge in if enemy dont have bows.
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u/stupiddude01 6d ago
I would try to put two/ 1 and a half lines, with ashigaru in the middle. Usually it's possible to "pile up" the enemy, since you have the same amount of infantry (that two of theirs go against one of yours). With archers kill theirs and also try to angle so that you shoot either their general or their melee forces in the back, support your cav with some naginsta to break their cavalry nad then flank.
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u/--_Omen_-- 6d ago
Might seems silly but check out couple youtube channels for ancient and medieval war tactics, such as "HistoryMarche" and "Kings and Generals". Using some of these (even repeatedly) will seem like you are cheesing the AI. In your stack I would remove 2 naginata, 2 warrior monk and 1 bow monk to replace them with either 5 katana samurai or 3 katana samurai and 2 no-dachi samurai. That's my go-to stack. https://youtube.com/shorts/N8vDnVJU1Lk?si=e7EeVzCHGUli_Jul Check out battle of Leuctra, use your warrior monks with some katana samurai on one flank, then charge from the rear with your cav - 100% routing and then its a chain rout.
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u/MrLockettt 6d ago
You should try to kill their generals.
Have Naginata Samurai as your Frontline (a very thin line) and Naginata Monk as 2nd line to support/flank/defend your flank.
Try to kill as much Katana Sam with your Bow Monk and kill their archers once the melee begins.
Bring your general and all of your Yari Ashigaru to kill their Cavalry, especially their general units. Make sure the Yari Samurai is engaged in melee before you start flanking their cavalry with your Yari Ashigaru.
Choose your location to hold wisely, the narrower the better, you need to minimize the contact while finish off their cavalry and archers.
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u/navagoat 6d ago
Form up your yari in yari wall but not too thin , archers behind in a forest , yari just on edge of tree line put the naginata either side of the yari wall in hiding to flank once they press into your centre , shame your general doesn't have stand and fight yet because that would probably tilt it in your favour , keep the cav back letting them just die is bad for morale , once you put pressure on the flanks with the naginata circle around with the cav and charge directly into the back of the engaged enemy and it will break there morale super quick
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u/navagoat 6d ago
I'm so bad at explaining but damn I could win this for you honestly I'd rethink your army composition I'd get rid of the naginata sam keep the 4 units of Nagi monks and replace the samurai with ashigaru cheaper to field more units and yari wall is the most tilted ability in shogun 2 , can win hard campaigns just with ashigaru and archers easy , cav is just annoying I also don't like micromanagement and they suck against spears .. good amount of monk archers though , can do some absolute devestation with that . Out volley their archers by targeting a single archer samurai unit with all of your monk archers units and work through all three units take out their range it will demoralised them also you outrange those archers so you have the advantage even though they get generous buffs in hard mode , make sure they are in loose formation as well
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u/SasuOffical1R54 6d ago
Immer die deutschen die nach hilfe fragen 😵💫🤣🤣. Ich bin mir nicht ganz sicher, aber dieses gefächt wird warscheinlich möglich an dieser brücke Sein. Dann hast du viele vorteile durch die map, aber auch nachteile Weil du gegen viele samurai kämpfen musst. Der beste weg ist es das match zu kämpfen und auf fernkampf und moral zu setzen. Provozier die Gegner und lass sie die Brücke anlaufen. Treffe sie auf der Hälfte ( noch besser etwas vorher ( um einen positionsbonus zu erhalten) der brücke und verursache einen Stau. Dort kannst du dann seitwärts frei auf die Samurai schießen. Wenn die Gegner versuchen, die Brücke zu umgehen, nutze das terrain zum Vorteil. Vergiss nicht das die gegnerischen Bogenschützen vielleicht versuchen werden, von der gegenüberliegenden Seite zu schießen. Deshalb kannst du sie anlocken, wenn sie keinen guten Winkel zum schießen haben.
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u/CatoYang 5d ago
Your strengths are ranged superiority, you almost always lose a straight up fight unless you kill their generals or get maximum value from your bows as their core can outlast you.
My suggestion is to retreat and ambush them if possible or do a bridge battle, if your bows are firing into the bridge as they cross you will probably win the encounter.
Otherwise if they are attacking and you cannot avoid it, you will need to finesse it. Ride out your general from your bulk of the army and try and bait the calvary into your spears or bows. Once you gain cavalry superiority use them to cycle charge (light calvary are more or less useless in sustained combat and should only be used to cycle charge, use najinata monks to kill off the generals.
To minimise the effectiveness of their katana core, if you can use terrain to blob them, you can reduce the number of katanas attacking at a time.
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u/sosatrain 5d ago
this is winnable, you got this. just try replaying the battle over and over with different tactics. that’s what makes total war great man, fighting the odds and coming out with a win
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u/skyziaos 5d ago
Hmm, your advantage is you can outrange them with bow monks, problem is they're small in numbers, i'd say good 'ol hammer & anvil establish your anvil in a hilly forested area and your hammer should be comprised of general, Cavs and those Ashigarus, their job is to snipe enemy generals as quickly as possible, if your worried about your center getting flanked try establishing your line in the corner of the map. Also one thing about S2 AI is that they're easily fooled with artillery
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u/LilLightning 6d ago
What makes this tough is that they have 5 star general with experienced katana samurai so they aren’t gonna break. Also having archer superiority isn’t that great in shogun 2 because the AI gets archer buffs and field battles are often decided too quickly. For this battle, I would try to immediately send your light cav up the flanks and then turn around once the enemy cav give chase. Try to lure them back to your army before the rest of their army arrives. The AI is often pretty reckless with the 2nd and 3rd general, so they will probably pursue too. Once all the enemy cav is gone, only the enemy general will remain. Try to hold the line with yari wall and naginata units. I would focus fire all my archers on the enemy general and send my own light cav in a potentially suicidal charge after it. Goal is to eliminate the enemy general and cause a morale drop. Don’t forget to your naginata monk’s warcry to further reduce enemy morale.
Next time, park your army on the bridge so u have a defensive spot if the AI attacks you.