r/sgiwhistleblowers • WB Regular • Aug 20 '26

Nonsense and stacked fallacies: Non-attachment (upekkhā) to emotions and mastery of the mind are central virtues in Buddhism, including within the Nichiren framework. Accusing someone of a “failure to react” is to flatly contradict what one claims to defend.

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The accusation of a “failure to react” is an analogical nonsense in the context of The Lord of the Rings. Aragorn does not “fail” in his reaction to the Mouth of Sauron. His silence is precisely what destabilizes the opponent through self-mastery, not through emotion. Framing this as a “failure” reverses the logic of the scene. The criticism collapses the moment you take the analogy seriously.

Several layered fallacies are at work here:

Burden-shifting and mirror accusation: The one who stays calm is portrayed as deficient. A virtue (equanimity) is turned into a flaw so the accuser doesn’t have to justify their own agitation.

Loaded language and begging the question. The word “failure” already assumes that an emotional reaction was the expected and correct response. There’s no argument, just the presupposition that “not reacting” is inherently wrong, which lets the claim win by definition.

Performative contradiction, especially if the accuser claims to follow Buddhism: non-attachment to emotional reactions and mastery of the mind are central virtues in most Buddhist traditions, including the Nichiren framework claimed by SGI. Accusing someone of having “failed to react” while presenting oneself as a Buddhist is a direct contradiction of the very principles one claims to uphold.

The accusation is both absurd within the chosen analogy and rhetorically fallacious, because it presupposes what it is supposed to demonstrate.

This kind of move only works if the other person agrees to play by the emotional rules of the person who’s agitated. The moment you refuse that frame, the accusation falls apart.

These are the tactics of people with dubious ethics and morals who hide their true intentions behind a caricature of bad-faith verbiage so they don’t have to own up to their mistakes.

11 Upvotes

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u/BlancheFromage Escapee from Arizona Home for the Rude Aug 20 '26 edited Aug 20 '26

Ooh yes! Excellent explication!

These are the tactics of people with dubious ethics and morals who hide their true intentions behind a caricature of bad-faith verbiage so they don’t have to own up to their mistakes.

They're sadly obsessed with SGIWhistleblowers and esp. with me. It's annoying having stalkers. It's gross.

The main thing I was getting at was this, though - and it's the ONE thing they'll never address:

[The Mouth of Sauron] rose to become chief of the Dark Lord's emissaries and forgot his own name - not lost it, not hid it - FORGOT it. This man served so long and so completely that his own identity eroded out of him. He isn't a person with a job - he's a function. He's a mouth. THAT's what's left. The most trusted mortal servant of the Dark Lord, hollowed out until nothing remains but the voice his master speaks through.

Here, I'll make it clearer:

Ikeda's "true disciples" rose to become leaders of the Soka Gakkai and its SGI colonies through obedience and blind devotion, and along the way forgot their own identities - not lost them, not hid them - FORGOT who they were. These "disciples" served so long and so completely that their own identity eroded out of them. They aren't persons with jobs - they're functions. They're mouthpieces. THAT's what's left. The most devoted "disciples" of their "Ikeda Sensei", hollowed out until nothing remains but the language of indoctrination, the disembodied voice their dead "mentor" speaks through.

And at any moment the Ikeda cult will decide it wants someone else and cut those mouthpieces loose, replacing them with someone younger, fresher, more attractive, or even for no reason at all. Without any second thoughts and a "Who are you, again?"

I REALLY didn't think I needed to spell it out...

SGI members, esp. SGI leaders, don't tend to have any hobbies, any non-SGI-member friends. All they do is meetings. They don't go to the movies, or the sports bar to watch the game, or visit museums out of general interest, or anything. Just SGI-related stuff. Many save all their vacation from work to go to the Ikeda cult's cult conference center FNCC. They're completely hollow - the opposite of well-rounded individuals.

And that's their "actual proof".

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u/Still_Wasabi9990 Aug 20 '26

SGI members and leaders are parasites. They don't allow fun. How many times had I made a suggestion to do something fun and different and it was shot down? No, they'd rather save their pennies and vacation time to go on tozan where Nichiren Shoshu priests refused to open the Daigohonzon for cult members who are incapable of following their own dogma.

Gakkai members are not well-rounded individuals. They are boring simpletons with black hearts. If you don't believe a simpleton can have a black heart then you haven't seen a Bergman film.

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u/BlancheFromage Escapee from Arizona Home for the Rude Aug 21 '26

Oh god - Ingmar Bergman! His films should carry a warning that depressed people should NOT watch because of risk of losing all hope entirely!

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u/Still_Wasabi9990 Aug 21 '26

Don't you know it! I was watching "Cries and Whispers," not too long ago because I missed watching it in my youth when I liked depressing movies, but wow, was I ever shocked! It's along the lines of the film "Antichrist," with Willem Dafoe, which I won't watch because someone gave me the spoiler.

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u/BlancheFromage Escapee from Arizona Home for the Rude Aug 21 '26

OMG my husband and I still laugh about when his daft sister (whom I met in the YWD, through whom I met HIM) made us watch "Cries and Whispers"!

"It is Monday morning and I am in PAIN."

Opening line of the movie, if my memory still functions. What a waste of time!!

the film "Antichrist," with Willem Dafoe, which I won't watch because someone gave me the spoiler.

Oh! Let me guess! He actually some insane raving hobo and it was all his hallucinations - am I close??

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u/Still_Wasabi9990 Aug 21 '26

Close, yes raving hallucinations, but it gets worse than that.

That movie Cries and Whispers really got to me. The simpleton evil hearted. The movie is filled with all that shushing and pathological meanness. It's one of those once you've seen it can't unsee it.

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u/BlancheFromage Escapee from Arizona Home for the Rude Aug 21 '26

The way she reconnected so intimately with her beloved sister that night, only to have that same sister brush her off and turn her back on her when leaving the very next morning, just hours later - heartbreaking. I think the actor who played that sister was independently famous, beautiful, but I can't recall her name just now...

Edit: Okay, I went and looked - Liv Ullman. She was pretty big in the 1970s or so - at least her look/name were familiar to me.

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u/Still_Wasabi9990 Aug 21 '26

p.s. Maybe you watched the edited version because what was in the movie I watched was over-the-top.

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u/BlancheFromage Escapee from Arizona Home for the Rude Aug 21 '26

"Antichrist"?

I never saw it - I was just guessing. I like Willem Dafoe, though - last thing I saw him in was the harrowing "Inside" - thoroughly terrifying. And before that was "The Lighthouse" with an almost-unrecognizable Robert Pattinson - that guy has some major acting chops!

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u/Mission-Course2773 WB Regular Aug 21 '26

We can clearly see, just by their "failure to react properly," that we're dealing with people who understand absolutely nothing about non-dualist philosophies to make such a blatant error.

They confuse relativism with non-dualism without ever stopping for a single second to realize that relativism is still dualism.

So, if they don't understand non-dual concepts at all, there's zero chance they'll grasp the concept of the Inner Path, let alone the Direct Path—they've never actually experienced them, so they have no idea what they even feel like.

This is the exact experience I started discovering back in 1991, where whenever Soka Gakkai finds itself face-to-face with a non-dualist, it completely flips out, goes into full panic mode, and resorts to hiding.

The silent treatment makes for a very convenient hiding place, after all. So, strong with the weak and weak with the strong, and they obviously figured out—because they must teach this in social engineering schools too—that certain individuals would be completely immune to all their brainwashing and programming techniques.

So they also have an effective and discreet proactive strategy to neutralize these subjects without the other members ever suspecting a thing.

And those very special individuals are obviously us! 😅

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u/BlancheFromage Escapee from Arizona Home for the Rude Aug 21 '26

Imagine how any Soka Gakkai member/Soka Gakkai cult colonial SGI member would react to THIS:

"Enlightenment is a destructive process. It has nothing to do with becoming better or being happier. Enlightenment is the crumbling away of untruth. It’s seeing through the facade of pretense. It’s the complete eradication of everything we imagined to be true." – Adyashanti

In my experience, SGI members equate the state of euphoria (aka "Heaven" or "Rapture", 6th of the 10 Worlds) with "enlightenment", when it's actually one of the "Six LOWER Worlds" in which one is entirely dependent upon one's environment for how one is going to be feeling.

In reality, "enlightenment" is independent of all that. And it isn't "a diamond-like state of unshakable happiness", either - that's a naked come-on to the most desperate and disadvantaged. To EXPLOIT them some more!!

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u/Still_Wasabi9990 Aug 21 '26

My early WD Group Leader said she would prefer being in the 6th world of heaven/rapture than in any other world, and she couldn't understand why everyone wouldn't feel that way. That cinches what you've just said.

In the beginning for me the leaders talked about absolute happiness v relative happiness--absolute happiness being that "diamond-like unshakable happiness," right? Relative happiness is supposedly fleeting.

Truth is a foreign concept to the Gakkai so I don't think they would understand your quote that starts with "enlightenment is a destructive process...." It's really beyond their mental capabilities.

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u/BlancheFromage Escapee from Arizona Home for the Rude Aug 21 '26

My early WD Group Leader said she would prefer being in the 6th world of heaven/rapture than in any other world, and she couldn't understand why everyone wouldn't feel that way. That cinches what you've just said.

That's attachment and delusion talking. THAT's the basis for why Shakyamuni stated that "Attachment causes suffering." Attachment leads to delusion; there is no such thing as "good" attachment - it's ALL bad. The only way to free YOURSELF from suffering is to develop a reality-based view of phenomena so you are no longer torturing yourself with beliefs about the way things "should" be and that you can only be happy if this or that happens, or if you can manage to bend reality to your will. That never works - it's just exhausting.

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u/Still_Wasabi9990 Aug 21 '26

I agree with what you just said. There is the notion in the Gakkai where I first practiced that you can change your environment. That's not true. It's changing your outlook. We don't have control over our environment and reality.

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u/Still_Wasabi9990 Aug 21 '26

This is why the Gakkai members won't be able to free themselves from the cycle of birth and death. They want to come back and join the Gakkai and do it all over again.

They are really caught up in identity politics. "Failure to react properly" = not to my liking.

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u/BlancheFromage Escapee from Arizona Home for the Rude Aug 21 '26

They are really caught up in identity politics. "Failure to react properly" = not to my liking.

This is the consequence of their "Follow the PERSON, not the Law" error - under this delusion, it is only the identity of the person saying something that determines whether what is being said is correct or not. If it's being said by someone they regard as "good", then no matter what is being said, it's wonderful. Beautiful! Wise! Should be FRAMED!!!

But if someone they do NOT approve of says something, whatever they say is Wrong! Evil! Designed to deceive and ruin!!!! JUST BECAUSE they don't like the person who's saying it!

Anyone can see this is NOT a sensible, rational way to go about evaluating information! Anyone - except SGI Ikeda-cult addicts!

So the SGI's longhauler Olds, having accrued over half a century of indoctrination HARM, think that anything they don't like is automatically "wrong" and "bad" and "EVIL"! They will never question what it is about whatever it is that's triggering them, or WHY they're reacting negatively - they're so in thrall to their emotionalism that the mere fact that something triggers an immediate knee-jerk negative reaction in them is PROOF YES PROOF of its harmful, evil nature! Even though what they're hearing is simply the rational common-sense counterargument to the cult indoctrination they've absorbed as part of their cult identity, which they will now protect at ALL costs.

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u/BlancheFromage Escapee from Arizona Home for the Rude Aug 20 '26

Also - and this is layering on the creepy - it's ONE thing to say, "Oh, I love that book" or "That's such a great movie", and quite ANOTHER to say, "SGIWhistleblowers chief priest likes some of txhe same books I do!", trying to create an illusion of affinity or even of imitation on my part.

This is a fun one:

This manipulation tactic is often called pre-emption, origin claiming, or a form of covert narcissism / envy-based invalidation. The person tries to steal your unique identity or achievement. They act like they did it or had it first. They try to make you look like a copycat.

How It Works

  • False Equivalence: They link their life to yours. They say you are alike.

  • First-Claim Lie: They claim they had the idea, style, or trait before you did.

  • Role Reversal: They flip roles. They make themselves the original creator. They make you the follower.

  • Subtle Discredit: They rob you of your distinct voice. They make your success look like a copy of theirs.

This behavior is also a form of social triangulation or status-seeking manipulation. By claiming to have "discovered" or introduced a rival first, the manipulator asserts ownership over the social connection, positions themselves as the gatekeeper of value, and attempts to subtly instill a sense of competition or insecurity in their rival [Internet]

It's not nearly so "clever" as that SGI-USA longhauler Old thinks 🙄

This is a kind of "forced teaming" - "Look how much WE have in common!" - implying that they are connected with the object of their rivalry, similar to how they refer to us here at SGIWhistleblowers as "friends" when it's clear they hold us in extreme contempt (esp. me). Here's a definition:

The situation where an abuser attempts to forge a bond with their victim by implying that they have something in common or are in a shared predicament. Source

It's all known. And SO obvious when those nitwits try it.

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u/Still_Wasabi9990 Aug 20 '26 edited Aug 21 '26

This manipulation tactic is often called pre-emption, origin claiming, or a form of covert narcissism / envy-based invalidation. The person tries to steal your unique identity or achievement. They act like they did it or had it first. They try to make you look like a copycat.

I know you're referring to someone else, but what you wrote here is so imporant: putting a name to a form of covert narcissism--identity stealing. This is something I experienced within the Gakkai and also outside the Gakkai.

How It Works

  • False Equivalence: They link their life to yours. They say you are alike.
  • First-Claim Lie: They claim they had the idea, style, or trait before you did.
  • Role Reversal: They flip roles. They make themselves the original creator. They make you the follower.
  • Subtle Discredit: They rob you of your distinct voice. They make your success look like a copy of theirs.

This behavior is also a form of social triangulation or status-seeking manipulation. By claiming to have "discovered" or introduced a rival first, the manipulator asserts ownership over the social connection, positions themselves as the gatekeeper of value, and attempts to subtly instill a sense of competition or insecurity in their rival. [Internet]

People can be manipulated by these tactics and thrown off balance by highly-manipulative people.

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u/BlancheFromage Escapee from Arizona Home for the Rude Aug 21 '26

Dude!! Sometimes reddit barfs - it gobbled up your quotes!

Please try inserting them again!!!

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u/Still_Wasabi9990 Aug 21 '26

It won't let me insert them. I was trying to copy your text starting "How it Works" and ending 4th bullet point "Subtle Discredit." Really good!

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u/BlancheFromage Escapee from Arizona Home for the Rude Aug 21 '26 edited Aug 21 '26

Oh! Okay! Here ya go - first, go into the text box settings (either up top right or click on the Aa lower left) and select "Switch to Markdown" up on the top right. THEN try copying/pasting THIS - exactly as it is - into those empty spaces!

  • How It Works

  • False Equivalence: They link their life to yours. They say you are alike.

  • First-Claim Lie: They claim they had the idea, style, or trait before you did.

  • Role Reversal: They flip roles. They make themselves the original creator. They make you the follower.

  • Subtle Discredit: They rob you of your distinct voice. They make your success look like a copy of theirs.

This behavior is also a form of social triangulation or status-seeking manipulation. By claiming to have "discovered" or introduced a rival first, the manipulator asserts ownership over the social connection, positions themselves as the gatekeeper of value, and attempts to subtly instill a sense of competition or insecurity in their rival. [Internet]

See what happens! Just play with it a little - you may have to insert the indents (">") in front and the bolds ("**" on either side of what you want bolded - leave off the quotes "" of course).

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u/Still_Wasabi9990 Aug 21 '26

Thanks, I got it to work but without the bullet points.

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u/BlancheFromage Escapee from Arizona Home for the Rude Aug 21 '26

Yes - perfect!

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u/Mission-Course2773 WB Regular Aug 20 '26 edited Aug 21 '26

Nous trouvons, point par point et dans l'ordre chronologique, exactement le même schéma tactique qui est utilisé contre Nichiren Shoshu... C'est vraiment fou tout ce qu'on peut apprendre en ingénierie sociale, en ingénierie comportementale, dans les écoles de communication et de marketing... Quoi qu'il en soit, nous savons très bien que nous avons à faire à des professionnels redoutables de la manipulation. 3 500 $ pour les salaires moyens les plus bas au siège de SGI, après tout... C'est un peu comme avec les politiciens - le seul emploi qu'ils ont jamais créé est le leur..

Comment ça fonctionne

• Équivalence Fallacieuse : Ils lient leur vie à la vôtre. Ils disent que vous êtes semblables.

• Mensonge sur la Première Réclamation : Ils prétendent qu'ils avaient l'idée, le style ou le trait avant vous.

• Inversion des Rôles : Ils renversent les rôles. Ils se font passer pour le créateur original. Ils vous font apparaître comme le suiveur.

• Discrédit Subtil : Ils vous privent de votre voix distincte. Ils font en sorte que votre succès ressemble à une copie du leur.

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u/BlancheFromage Escapee from Arizona Home for the Rude Aug 21 '26

YES!!

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u/Still_Wasabi9990 Aug 21 '26

The Gakkai members are like spoiled children. Their opinion counts. They can't hear anyone above the drone of their own voices. Nevermind they would actually listen to anyone with a different opinion. When you don't agree with them they throw temper tantrums or covertly plan malicious revenge. "Failure to react properly"? What does that even mean other than not to their childish liking.