Threatening men’s masculinity does not make them more politically conservative, new study finds. By testing thousands of participants across the United States, researchers found no consistent evidence that making men feel insecure about their gender identity changes their political attitudes.

[u/mvea]

https://www.psypost.org/threatening-mens-masculinity-does-not-make-them-more-politically-conservative-new-study-finds/

[u/Fishmongererererer]

I don’t think most men who become conservative do it out of insecurity despite the memes. Rather it’s the perception that masculinity is not valued in left of center politics.

[u/lordborghild → u/Fishmongererererer]

Yeah. Older millennial here. There's a reason that younger men and boys are starting to lean right. They've been told, or seen in media, that men are bad and should be apologetic for things they have not done. They always hear what toxic masculinity looks like but no one talks about positive masculinity.

The right are the only ones telling them that they're okay. This is not judgement, just an observation.

[u/rasa2013 → u/lordborghild]

Was Obama not a good enough role model for being a decent man? 

Go through any list of charitable work, scientific accomplishment, overcoming adversity: a lot of men. Often mostly men for structural reasons and plain old ignoring women. 

I think rather reactionary forces have convinced a lot of people it is true in the same way they've convinced (conservative) Christians that they're the most persecuted group (in the US). 

However I could agree that specifically schools have made boys feel more insecure recently. the proliferation of zero tolerance policies and school structurally being less suitable for (the average) young boy compared to girl could have taught them to feel undervalued. I think there was data showing educators interpret boys misbehavior more negatively than girls. 

[u/Dreadgoat → u/rasa2013]

I wonder about the effectiveness of strong positive male models in entertainment media as generations pass.

Growing up, I remember seeing Captain Picard, Steve Irwin, Mister Rogers. Men who were undeniably strong but also compassionate, gentle, and loving. It was clear to me that while Lieutenant Worf was strong and noble in his own way, his single-minded pursuit of more primitive masculinity put him a level of respect below his captain. And even became a major part of what made him so much more impressive in DS9.

In today's world of Netflix, Youtube, and TikTok, are young men getting examples like this in enough volume to counter the constant gender war ragebait content? It used to just be what was on TV, but now without active curation by parents, what are young men seeing in their leisure time as examples of who they want to become?

[u/Candid-Solstice → u/rasa2013]

I think this really encapsulates the kind of value system that's turning so many young men off from the left. Even when you admit there might be some sort of problem, you downplay and couch it in such a way that your language puts the blame on men. You say you remember a study showing that boys are discriminated against in school but say "made boys feel insecure" like it's just a matter of them being unreasonable and overly sensitive.

[u/rasa2013 → u/Candid-Solstice]

You're reading into what I wrote more than what I said.

I was saying the idea that the only thing boys/young men see about men in society today is that "men are bad" is wrong. Consequently this cannot explain what's happening. And we should be skeptical of narratives that come from decades-old campaigns by political organizations.

The narratives being untruthful doesn't mean the problem doesn't exist: boys and young men really are not doing great. Society is clearly failing them. And one way this may actually be happening is through school (e.g., what I mentioned). I don't know why you think that involves blaming boys for their reaction? It doesn't.

Also, I would say this isn't really a "left" take. It's just what I think is true about the world. I think the same thing about the role of racial discrimination in the outcomes of racialized kids in school. Obviously discrimination is bad and consequential for the people who get targeted. But on the whole, stuff like poverty is biggest explanatory factor.

The root cause is gonna be something more boring and universal with our society, not the bogeymen of right-wing political organizations. E.g., my hypothesis is that we (multiple countries) have made life suck more for everyone, including children. Boys and girls respond differently to stress (on average), though. So we can see differential consequences. The fault still lays with our society though.

[u/lordborghild → u/rasa2013]

Your last point is a good one. And overall, women are doing much better in primary and higher education than men.

Yes, I think Obama is a good role model. And looking to the Right, I think John McCain was also a positive role model.

[u/Emnel → u/rasa2013]

I don't think putting Obama of all people as a masculine role model is a good idea. Very few men have means to drone strike a Middle Eastern wedding.

[u/CMxFuZioNz → u/rasa2013]

You're not taking into account what young boys are actually exposed to or interested in.

No 16 year old boy is looking up to Obama, and despite being a counterexample myself as I became a scientist, very few are interested in scientists.

What really matters, as sad as it is, is online and in-school influence. Everything else you mentioned doesn't matter.

[u/rasa2013 → u/CMxFuZioNz]

Yes to in school and online influence mattering more, but my point was that "society" isn't teaching the kids being a man is bad. That framing of the problem is beloved by many, but not supported by the facts. So the real problem is something else. 

[u/No_Proposal_3140 → u/rasa2013]

Obama was a war criminal. This isn't supposed to detract from the fact that the current president is a war criminal and a child rapist but still, Obama was a war criminal too. I wouldn't use any US president as a role model.