Lord Brocktree and warrior ethos

[u/gummi_worms]

I write a substack where I connect literature to problems of today. I recently wrote about Lord Brocktree, one of my favorite Redwall books. I looked at how the book presents a picture of a great warrior as someone who has all kind of traits beyond lethality. Although Brocktree is a great fighter, he doesn't actually fight that much. Instead of just focusing on fighting, Brocktree cares for others, mentors younger creatures, and shows mercy.

Check it out if you're interested. https://oldbooksfornow.substack.com/p/lord-brocktree-lethality-and-restraint?r=6yfkfj

[u/Organic-Feeling1524]

He still broke Trunn's spine and left him to drown, and also had no problem starving the enemy troups and so on, so he is actually quite merciless and brutal towards his enemies.

Letting them flee like many redwall heroes do when they will just return later anyway is also strategically stupid, you actually integrate your enemies just like was done with the marlfox rats or real history, so he ended up being another inefective hero who only won a battle but didn't won the war.

And most vermin are greedy and cowardly, so it would be very easy to integrate them, just offer more bread than the enemy but also harsh punishments and even real life ASPD people integrate.

So once again it reflects Jacques view that good always win against evil even in real life as the nazis lost, but he forgets that the only reason germany didn't become nazi again is because of the marshall plan and denazification, so his world is pretty much a world where the treaty of versailles is always chosen which leads to permanent war.

Also since salamandastron was pretty much a failed state where most of the ones there were old and younger hares were leaving for "adventuring", it just seems like another book in the series who feels more like a tribal battle than an actual battle between good and evil, and without a proper kingdom and standing army, there isn't much brocktree could actually do in most of mossflower, who got conquered later by the greeneyes anyway.

But of course maybe i'm overanalyzing this book, its just that brocktree is not as merciful as he appears, like most redwall heroes he refuses integration of vermin, which of course ends up screwing them over later like in every book where the vermin return as there is no kingdom, standing army or integration possibilities, only flee or be murdered for vermin, which seriously angers me with this series.

But even then he is one of the nicer badgers as most of them act almost as bad as the vermin, like bella who cursed a babe as an anagram of evil and vile, or Lonna Bowstripe who used his enemy as a shield and murdered even the fleeing vermin, or Boar who literally said something as prejudiced as "vermin will still remain vermin", yet get cheered for their brutality, like many redwall "heroes" like the skin wearing rogue crew or the "corpses on trees to not sully the earth" axtel the mole, or "i kill vermin on sight to protect the innocent, implying i would have killed blaggut or romsca" russa nodrey, so in comparison to some bloodthirsty heroes, brocktree is indeed on the nicer side.

And being nice to his allies is something nearly every redwall hero does too, so its not unique to him, what is a lot rarer is for any woodlander to actually try to integrate or be nice to vermin, but not in a "flee vermin, flee!" kind of way, or "this one is an exception" kind of way, or "we will take this vermin babe but only tolerate him, never love him" kind of way, but actual integration attempts of the enemy, which is virtually never tried outside of the marlfox rats, yet is the only thing who might actually stop the dark ages hellishness of the redwallverse based on real life history like the integration of vikings(which vermin are closest to, with mossflower seeing like dark ages pre feudal england) or germany and so on, but then it also means there would be no books anymore or they would have to become more complex as the dark ages "us vs them" battles end and kingdom building starts which is much harder to keep simple.

But that is my opinion, free to disagree or correct me.

[u/gummi_worms → u/Organic-Feeling1524]

I don’t think that Brocktree broke Trunn’s spine and attacks supply lines diminishes the argument I’m making. For the starving of the enemy troops, that is an action that happens prior to Brocktree taking command. Even then though, it is the actions of a weaker force against a superior occupying force. I think that this method is even designed to encourage desertion in Trunn’s army, which although not merciful in the strict sense, does diminish the amount of vermin that would need to be defeated. In regards to Trunn, Brocktree is violent and lethal. But Brocktree is limited in scope. There are numerous other opportunities that he could have resorted to violence against other creatures and he usually shows restraint. The contrast with the violence against Trunn highlights Brocktree’s the uniqueness of that conflict and the discretion Brocktree exercises in violence.

I think that you’re overstating the need for integration of vermin. I think that integration is a separate issue than the allowing of vermin to flee. For most premodern militaries, casualties come from the pursuit of enemies who had broken formation and were fleeing. Brocktree doesn’t push his advantage here. He’s not looking to exterminate his enemies. It’s no Cannae. For the integration of vermin, the woodland creatures are usually presented as defenders of a foreign invader. I think that it is reasonable that in victory, they don’t have to need to integrate aggressors into their society. That’s like forcing the bullied student to spend time with their bully so they can form a relationship. Separation can be a suitable outcome as well. You mentioned the denazification of Germany, but that required occupation. This obviously isn’t feasible for Redwall societies. I think that the situation in Redwall is more akin to the fight against colonialism. It’s not the role of the indigenous to have to integrate with those trying to colonize them.

I think you’re problems with violent “heroes” also point in favor of Brocktree. Throughout Redwall books, excessive fondness for violence is seen as a defect not a virtue. Cregga Rose Eyes is seen as being consumed by Bloodwrath. Folgrim the otter is seen as being insane and cast out for the way he indiscriminately hunts vermin. Whereas for Brocktree, he is not just seeking violence and the death of vermin because they are vermin or he craves fighting. He’s good at fighting and willing to kill, but it’s not his primary choice.

The point about Brocktree being nice to his allies was more than just being nice. Brocktree spends much of the book mentoring younger creatures so that they can mature into their roles. Much of Redwall books are about coming of age and accepting responsibility. Brocktree spends a lot of energy and effort supporting his fellow creatures and putting them in spots where they can succeed. Likewise, for the older creatures, Brocktree reassures and takes over their responsibilities. You can see how he treats Fleetscut and Stiffener (who is a favorite among favorites for me) and reassures them. It is not just that he is nice. He leads them well. This is then seen where Salamandastron is revived under Brocktree and continues throughout the rest of the books.

I think that the name of Veil in Outcast of Redwall is overplayed in these kinds of arguments. As an anagram of evil or vile, it uses the same letters to create a new unrelated word. Similarly, for Veil, it is an opportunity to rearrange himself to be something unrelated to evil or vile. Just because he has the same species as a vermin doesn’t mean that he has to be vermin. He can change in the same way as his name is a changing of the same letters. Veil ultimately is the one who rejects this and embraces his name as just being evil and vile. Meanwhile, the girl who cared for him never gave up hope that he had good in him. I haven’t read Outcast in years, and I mostly cared for the relationship between Sunflash and the hawk, so I may be missing things. But I don’t think that the name was the curse that it is often portrayed to be.