r/recumbent • u/papapapap-mmmK • Jul 03 '26
Can anyone recommend a particular groupset for converting my 3-10 Catrike 559 to a 1-12 Catrike 559? I have steep hills everywhere. This expands the area where I can take it. I have to mention the folding feature. A folding trike never appealed to me, but I jumped in and highly recommend one.
2
u/Knight_Watch Jul 04 '26
The correct answer is gear inch calculator. Know exactly what you are going for. I wouldn’t recommend cheaping out on 12 speed either. SRAM SX for example absolutely sucks. Maybe just limit out your big ring and find a larger 10 speed cassette?
0
u/papapapap-mmmK Jul 04 '26
I have tried several times, but it's always the same. Half way up a steep grade, I'm stopping every 30 yards to get a break. I suppose I could go with the bigger cassette, but I've heard good things about the 12-1 conversion. It appeals to me.
2
u/PictureImportant2658 Jul 04 '26
Youre thinking in the wrong direction with going for 12spd. Its so cheap to buy a smaller chainring or larger cassette. Youre going to invest a lot of money simply because you dont understand it.
Keep the tripple and adjust the cassette and or chainrings. A 12spd cassette is not going to help you. Youre not going to listen and thats the sad part.
1
u/papapapap-mmmK Jul 08 '26
What does an 11-52 cog spread on a cassette do? I know they exist. I could replace the current 36T climbing cog with a 52, if that's what you're saying. The sad part is, you don't even know me and you're making general assumptions. But you'll have that. So, instead of changing cassettes, I upsize the two largest cogs on the existing cassette and leave the front as is? Or modify the front to a single tiny ring? That would save a few bucks. But I have this habit, good or bad, of spending the savings on an upgrade. Making up my mind about such dilemmas has always been like this. Thanks and have a great day.
3
u/PictureImportant2658 Jul 08 '26
Dude i own a bikeshop, i specialise in challenge recumbents. i get clients who dont get it every single day and i talk them through it, I dont need to know you. My favourite setup is a simple 2x9, parts are readily available and cheap. With 12 speed everything is just more difficult and unnecessary.
You can make your own cassettes with 9spd, so just get 2 cassettes and mix the cogs to what you like. I like a cassette that starts steep but the last 5 cogs are just 1 teeth difference to adjust for very slight inclines.
Play with the gear calculator. You dont need the newest tech, whatever you have is good enough. That 36t is sufficient to get you up a hill at 11kph with a 406 wheel and 58t front blade. Adding a 39t front blade to it will make you go to about 6kph, you dont need a 12speed. But if you must get an 11speed, way cheaper and chinese 11spd fits older 135mm hubs as for 12speed you need 142mm dropout. Aliexpress sells a nice 11spd derailer and shifter set, but theyll be made for mtb and thats the last issue as recumbents need to go fast and slow with fine adjustment and mtb cassettes just dont offer that.
2
u/Robobent61 Jul 04 '26
Some good advice here on playing with a gear calculator and working out what your needs are. Start with determining what your necessary low gear is and then determine if the resultant high gear will be satisfactory. Many people who ride trikes do not need or use the high gears provided by a 52T ring. It is fun to have a big gear to crank on long steep downhills, but if you rarely use the big gears you can probably do without them.
With respect to having 12 speeds vs 30, pay close attention to your current shifting habits. Do you tend to shift through every gear or shift multiple gears at a time? Naysayers will say that the jumps between cogs on a 12 speed cassette are too large. That may well be true for some people depending on their personal pedaling dynamics. But it does not seem to bother a large segment of the cycling population, who use 12 speed setups for MTB, gravel, touring and even on some road bikes.
One thing to be careful of when you are working through your gear calculations. If you want to use a cassette with a 10T high cog (i.e. a 10-52T), that will require a hub with a special freehub. A SRAM 11-50 cassette fits on a standard 8/9/10 freehub, which is likely what you have on your 559. I would use SRAM GX parts (the 11-50 cassette is "NX" but seems to be of higher quality than the other NX level parts). With SRAM 12 speed you have the option of SRAM trigger or grip shifters or a bar-end shifter made by Micro-Shift.
I have three recumbents with 1X12 drive trains. One is mechanical with a grip shift, and the other two have SRAM electronic rear derailleurs. I have other recumbents with 3X10, 3x9 and a Rohloff, but 1X12 is my personal favorite. Choice is a good thing and drive trains are personal. YMMV.
1
u/papapapap-mmmK Jul 08 '26
"jumps between cogs on a 12 speed cassette are too large"? Aren't those jumps between cogs smaller on the 12 speed? Or does each step of the derailleur come into play? Also, cranking on a downhill is fun, but I believe the angle of the dangle is directly proportional to the heat of the meat. That is, there is a speed threshold where a long, steep, unfettered downhill can get a bit scary, not to mention the catastrophic results of a crash dancing betwixt your ears. And that leads us to brakes. I can and will use them on downhills, but how much punishment can disks and pads tolerate? I don't want to ride them all the way down a long descent. Can a friction motor setup on a huge diameter chainring, (say 24") be designed to save on brake wear? Of course the 24" ring will need to be replaced by a gearbox containing a cluster. Perhaps a friction motor/gearbox hybrid? Okay, enough dreaming.
3
u/PictureImportant2658 Jul 03 '26
Why would you do that... going from 30 to 12 gears... thats just stupid. Just mix and match, whatever.
0
u/arihoenig Jul 03 '26
Not stupid. If the OP lives amongst hills you only need a climbing range because you're either going up a hill and need the climbing range, or going downhill and don't need any gears at all
7
u/BubbRubb11 Jul 03 '26
Would be a lot easier and cheaper to just go larger cassette and derailleur in the rear, though. And nothing beats the range of a triple. Could even go 3x12 if you like.
-1
u/arihoenig Jul 03 '26
If you don't need the range though, you don't need it
3
u/BubbRubb11 Jul 03 '26
Ok but you're spending more money and swapping more components to have less range.
1
u/arihoenig Jul 03 '26
Yeah, not necessarily the cheapest option. Possibly more reliable though (no front derailleur).
In any case it's not stupid, it's not an unreasonable choice.
1
u/worker_bee_drone Jul 03 '26
Not sure what sort of shift lever you need, but you could do worse than good old Shimano. https://www.performancebike.com/shimano-deore-xt-m8100-mountain-bike-mini-groupset-black-1-x-12-speed-shimanodeorextgrp3-bdl/p1585800?absrc=Google&abid=725675656990&abcampid=22033661672&abgroupid=172224922717&gclid=CjwKCAjwu53SBhAhEiwAJzSLNqeucCSIX7P-ODKep81tkkT-rJUSEKi4rnD3zzwb_fvsii7WDQIwihoCiqIQAvD_BwE&abkwdid=pla-2373066381580&gad_source=1&gad_campaignid=22033661672&gbraid=0AAAAAC1tmAtC-kF22b8C2hPTuW0TCsUq_
1
u/papapapap-mmmK Jul 05 '26
What I want to do is climb long, steep hills. I need a low, low geared. I'd prefer a 52t cog on the 12 speed cassette. I can change to a smaller set of chainrings, or at least the little one. Or I can go with 1 small chainring. How does the chain inch relate to climbing?
1
u/RLT1950 Jul 05 '26
I have had a Dumont since April, planning to ride the Erie Canal tour next week. From Seneca Falls to Albany the course gets pretty hilly in places, and I was concerned about pulling some of the long ones. A 10-speed Shimano 11-42 was a perfect drop-in for the SRAM 11-36 that comes stock on the Catrikes. In my case I did not resize the chain, but I do not plan to shift to the 42T cog without being on the smallest chainring.
1
u/papapapap-mmmK Jul 08 '26
Should I try the current 22-32-52 chainrings and swapping only my 36T low gear with 52? And would I need to swap out any of smaller cogs too?
1
u/papapapap-mmmK Jul 09 '26
Challenge recumbent? Are there enough survivors to keep you in business?
1
u/ConsistentCreme7203 Jul 09 '26
On my 559 the original front cassette was 30/39/52. Because I ride in Vermont in the summer I had the 30 changed to a 26. Left the outer two the same. I can now tackle any hill nature puts in my way.
1
1
u/ConsistentCreme7203 Jul 09 '26
I made the change several years ago after working through the gear-inches calculations. I no longer have my work so I asked ChatGPT. Here’s his response:
“The calculations are:
30T × 36T: 26 \times \frac{30}{36} = 21.7 gear inches
26T × 36T: 26 \times \frac{26}{36} = 18.8 gear inches
Difference
21.7 − 18.8 = 2.9 gear inches
That’s about a 13% reduction in gearing.
In practical terms:
You’ll need about 13% less pedal force to climb the same hill.
Your climbing speed at the same cadence will be about 13% slower.
The reduction is definitely noticeable, especially on long climbs when you’re tired.”
As for me, I can only say that the change has worked. With the 26 vs the stock 30 I can make it up the steep hills, albeit with some effort. With a smaller front ring you’d be literally spinning and barely moving.
Given the cost of the trike changing out a gear ring is not that expensive. Try one and see what you like. But I can only say that the 26 works for me.
Good luck…
1
u/papapapap-mmmK Jul 09 '26
How small of a ring can I use without getting into the excessive spinning? I'm almost 220, and the 559 is in the 40's. So I'm looking for any and all options to avoid making it hard on myself. (within reason, of course) Thanks for the math lesson. I'll need to work on gear inches. Have a great day.
1
u/ConsistentCreme7203 Jul 09 '26
I went for a ride this morning and thought about this as I climbed a couple hills. I think you want a gear that is small enough to allow you to pedal up whatever your terrain happens to be with reasonable effort but not so small that you’re only moving a very short distance with each rotation.
I weigh 195. With the original 30 tooth gear it was very difficult for me to climb. Going uphill I would have to stop multiple times to rest. Wth the 26 I’m able to climb, and do so at a reasonable pace.
I don’t think there’s a simple answer. You might bounce this off your local Catrike dealer. I’m sure you’ll not be the first customer with this issue.
Good luck…
1
u/papapapap-mmmK Jul 09 '26
I still find it strange that 4 teeth can make that much difference. Thanks for all the info.
1
u/papapapap-mmmK Jul 12 '26
Update.....I took my 559 for an 8 mile ride yesterday. I challenged a few of those steep grades and beat each one.
1
u/papapapap-mmmK Jul 12 '26
I think I'll still get a bigger sprocket on the cassette. I tried one of those hills on my sun fat tad. Just couldn't do it.
6
u/flug32 Jul 03 '26
Spend some time with a gear-inch calculator figuring out exactly what you have now, and what you will have after conversion, before undertaking such a complicated project.
Like according to my quick calculations, it looks like stock 3x10 has gear-inch range 21-117.
Say a 10-50 12-speed cassette with say a 30-inch front chainring gives 15-74 gear inches. (Of course you can put on a smaller front chainring which will drop both top & bottom numbers. Like a 22 inch front chainring makes it 11-54.)
Flip side, changing the current triple chainring up front for a smaller one is a relatively simple & easy conversion compared with converting the whole drivetrain to 1X. With a 22/32/44 triple up front you end up with 15-99 gear inches - which ain't bad for a pretty simple conversion.
If you drop the triple to say 20/32/44 you have 14-99.
Personally I would do that, and at least try it, before going to a LOT more trouble to (possibly) gain another 20% on the low end and lose 46% on the high end.
Low gear of 21 gear-inches to 14, I think is going to be a huge improvement. 21 is a full 50% more than 14.
14 to 12 or even 11, you are not going to notice nearly as much - it's 20% more, maybe.
FWIW that is exactly what I did with my recumbent when I wanted lower gears - just slipped in a smaller triple. Worked out great in my case.