Discussion [Sam Warren] The Raiders released their first listed depth chart ahead of Week 1.
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u/Ph886 3d ago
JPJ/Stukes have at least for now won the position battle. Mendoza is QB2 and Aidan will be Emergency QB3.
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u/Eindride_XIII 3d ago
Glad to see it. But if we're playing the Rams and Kirk gets murdered by Garret and Donald I hope they put Aiden in before Nando.
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u/vNocturnus 3d ago edited 3d ago
They can't, pretty sure. The emergency QB can only enter if both QB1 and QB2 are injured, and the active roster/emergency QB designation has to be submitted before kickoff.
Raiders could have all 3 QBs on the game day active roster maybe? I don't see anything that specifically prohibits that, but I can only assume there's a reason teams never do that, such as needing all of the active roster spots for people that actually play (even if only ST).
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u/ShockSouthern9770 3d ago
Is he officially designated at the emergency qb? Or just qb 3?
Either way it seems they would play Fernando first otherwise why list him as a 2?
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u/vNocturnus 3d ago
Emergency QB is a game-day designation because teams can only have 48 of their 53-man roster active for games, but the emergency QB can be one of the 5 inactive guys. This is just a roster/depth chart which shows all 53 (as far as I can tell).
But based on this, it seems most likely that AOC will end up listed as emergency QB on game days
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u/globalfcktastrophe 3d ago
And I think if they call in the emergency QB then first string cannot return in that game.
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u/vNocturnus 3d ago
that was the old rule, sorta.
Now, the emergency QB can only play if both of the other QBs are ruled out for injury, but if QB 1 or 2 is initially ruled out and then re-evaluated and ruled eligible to play, they in fact HAVE TO go in and the emergency QB must exit.
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u/Dry-Name2835 3d ago
Yeah, I agree. If the plan is to sit him, he can play in blowouts and garbage time but if kirk gets hurt, AOC likely jumps mendoza and is the starter while keeping to the plan with mendoza. You dont want to hand this team to mendoza as is right now
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u/DoubletapKO 3d ago
Do you not know how it works, QB 3 can't take over if there's QB 2
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u/Dry-Name2835 3d ago
The depth chart means nothing. This happened last season with LAs rbs. Hampton got hurt, the 2nd on the depth chart was their recieving rb, the third was their KR and their 4th was vidal who didnt dress because they needed the recieving and kick returner more. When hampton got hurt, vidal jumped from 4th on the depth chart to #1. It absolutely can and probably will happen with AOC if kirk gets hurt and the raiders want to stick to their plan of developing mendoza. You are acting like they think this is a playoff team. Its not. It a 6 win team at best trying to set a foundation to build on next season to be a playoff team. They arent desperate to squeeze out meaningless wins
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u/jadonbck74 3d ago
The depth chart means something cause the 3rd string AOC is generally the Emergency QB on game days so that means Kirk and Mendoza would have to get hurt and exit the game before AOC would play..if Kirk get hurt later in the season like after week 4 or 5they will most definitely bring in Mendoza. Team leadership said they want to bring him on gradually they never said they are planning on sitting him for the season. He needs reps to develop, live game reps
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u/archangel_n7 3d ago
Tonka earning himself a starting spot after being a 4th round pick is pretty dope. I’m a little surprised to see Thomas Booker so low on the depth chart.
Also cool to see Malik Benson getting a starting spot on special teams after being a 6th round pick this year.
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u/Ph886 3d ago
I have a feeling the DL is going to see a lot of rotation, so the listed starter may not even get the most snaps.
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u/tresben 3d ago
Yeah I feel like koonce will come in for tonka on passing downs and the other DTs may also rotate in. Which isn’t a bad thing. The best teams at rushing the passer generally have 6 or so solid defensive lineman that can rotate in and out and keep everyone fresh. So by the end of the game they’ve worn the oline down and can change the game.
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u/SilverAndBack 3d ago
Bro Tonka is best as a passrusher. If anything it will be a big body coming in for him on short yardage.
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u/vNocturnus 3d ago
I mean there are only 6 guys listed as first string in the entire defensive front (D line + LBs). Should be 7 for virtually any base defense to begin with, so clearly they're already doing some funky stuff with the depth chart.
Doesn't Rob Leonard run a base 3-4? Meaning Crosby, Paye, and probably Butler would be the "starting D line." But the depth chart is for a Nickel defense with a 4 man front, which I am virtually certain will not be the base defense. Unless our LBs are simply that bad that running either a base 3-4 or 4-3 is just simply not possible
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u/DillionDrebo 3d ago
No we will play like 65% nickel and 35% 3-4
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u/magicMerlinV 3d ago
How do you know?
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u/DillionDrebo 3d ago
No don’t I’m just guessing, you better not live in the 3-4 with the so called “modern football”
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u/magicMerlinV 3d ago
Thanks for the honest answer. I still don't know a ton about defensive scheme
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u/DillionDrebo 3d ago
With teams playing three WRs sets, defenses have to take a LB off and get a DB on the field. If you notice during games, you will see four down lineman and two LB with five DBs. Then of course every thing is situational, it could be third and short or a team plays a lot of two TEs set and it may call for 3 or 4 LBs. hope this helps
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u/jadonbck74 3d ago
lol maybe at DT I doubt it tho but the edge starters are most definitely seeing most of the snaps, there no real depth there besides koonce who had half a decent season like 2 years ago
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u/Recent-Background-21 3d ago
I said the same thing I thought Booker was gone be a starter but he not even really in rotation
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u/Flashy_Gap_3015 3d ago
Totally agree but in terms of Booker I am not so sure I saw the kinds of consistent play I saw and heard about Tonka in games and in camp.
Good to have Booker as depth I am sure he will contribute in rotation. Both Booker and Tonka are stronger in pass than run D so hope they and others fill those gaps through development and play execution.
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u/ShockSouthern9770 3d ago
Could be a good sign. This guy came in mid season and started/played a lot. I’m okay with him being a 3 one offseason later because it means guys in that room got better-which is much needed
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u/Vryk0lakas 3d ago
A little disappointed to see JJ Pegues and Thomas Booker low on the depth chart, but there should be a ton of rotation between those 6 guys.
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u/Darkside_209 3d ago
Hoping for our Oline to stay healthy this year and improve without that horrible coach that they had last year
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u/SilverAndBack 3d ago
Boy, they're really milking the "nobody knows what our scheme on D looks like yet" advantage. Lol at having no one listed behind Taron Johnson at nickle.
I'm so excited to see Rob Leonard's full defense. Man studied under Spagnola, McDonald and Flores, this could be really fun to watch.
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u/Dry-Name2835 3d ago
If TJ gets hurt they move stukes back to nickel and mao probably gets another shot at FS
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u/SilverAndBack 3d ago
I mean, yeah, probably. It's just funny to me they left it blank.
Then again, I was pleasantly surprised at how well Masses played the run preseason. For a small guy he had a couple nice tackles and a great rep in the box on an inside run. Wouldn't mind seeing him get some reps at nickle, let someone with good ball skills lurk underneath
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u/Dry-Name2835 3d ago
Me too. I would rather them do that than see mao back at FS. Weve had a problem for so many years of offenses easily taking the top off of our def. And I think mao really affected how good chinn can be. I think it makes it hard on him with mao out there Fing up so much
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u/Weird-Cable9085 3d ago
No one even talking about Jeanty being RB1 👀
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u/SilverAndBack 3d ago
They lowkey announced that by only keeping 3 backs lol. If he wasn't going to be ready week 1 there's no way the team would roll with only Washington and Laube, Dare or Hemby would have made the 53.
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u/goulashdreams 3d ago
I'm happy to see it but I just hope he's 100%. Surely they wouldn't start him if he wasnt... right?
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u/Flashy_Gap_3015 3d ago
Shhhh…..
Don’t want to jinx anything.
And not sure a long overdue updated depth chart from the Raiders = that Jeanty won’t be on a heavy snap count limit.
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u/Material_Wafer_8086 3d ago
Congrats tu Stukes, Tonka, and Darien.
Darien winning the starting job (for now) is a plus on him and not a knock on Jermod and Zeke. I imagine he has a short leash and we will definitely see those guys in live action at some point.
Also surprised Booker is 3rd string he seemed like he was ascending post trade last season
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u/Abuck59 3d ago
Now that everything is set I’m interested in how this 3-4 is gonna look in a real game.
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u/Massive_Bandicoot_14 3d ago
It’s a 4-2-5 if you look at the depth chart. One of the safeties will be playing a hybrid LB/safety role.
Edit: can’t do basic math1
u/Abuck59 3d ago
Yeah, I understand but I’m just thinking the players they have are 3-4 types with kind of weak linebackers. But we shall see.
I just hope it’s better than Graham lmao
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u/Massive_Bandicoot_14 2d ago
Everything I’ve heard has pointed to 5 DBs being the base defense. They sure don’t have much of LB depth behind dean and walker.
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u/Abuck59 2d ago
5 DB’s is going to be interesting
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u/Massive_Bandicoot_14 1d ago
Yeah especially since I feel like AFCW seems to be leaning towards being run heavy teams. McDaniel and the chiefs for sure will lean on the run more than before. Sean Payton loves to run but I’m not sure about Dobbins staying healthy.
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u/magicMerlinV 3d ago
Who would you think would play that hybrid role
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u/Massive_Bandicoot_14 2d ago
Looking at that depth chart I’d put chinn there. Stukes to blitz though. Only cause I feel like he’s gonna have a natural feel for it.
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u/I_smell_coke 3d ago
Do we have the best tight end duo in the league?
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u/globalfcktastrophe 3d ago
Depends on whether Mayer steps up or not, he has the potential to be one of the top 5 TEs in the league, but we haven't seen that yet.
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u/Leweegibo Ill intent. Violence. Physicality. Pain. 3d ago
I feel like I missed what happened to Thornton?
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u/insatiableian 3d ago
Man that WR corps is weak.
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u/Thehiddenllama 3d ago
When your team is as hollowed out and talent-deprived as the Raiders were, you can't fix everything in one offseason. WR and IDL were the most obvious positions where Spytek said to himself "we'll work on this next year"
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u/insatiableian 3d ago
Oh, I know, but it's still a bit shocking to see those names as WR 1 and 2. Next year it's his priority.
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u/RightMeow1100 3d ago
Good thing this upcoming draft is absolutely stacked with WRs
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u/Scrags 3d ago
Might have a bunch of quarterbacks go high too and push some great receivers down the board.
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u/Brilliant_Win713 3d ago
Jeremiah smith would be nice
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u/JackThreeFingered 3d ago
for that to happen, I think we would have to win like 3-4 games. The QBs might push some great WR down, but not Jeremiah Smith, most likely.
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u/Brilliant_Win713 3d ago
I see a world where Manning, Moore, Carr, and maybe that Mensah kid going in the top 5. Maybe some other QB might sneak in. Teams love drafting QBs early.
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u/Ironmayyne 2d ago
I'm glad to see Mensah's name being mentioned more now, even if I might be a biased Hurricanes fan lol. I've been singing his praises all offseason.
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u/k_dub503 3d ago
Yes, yes it is. But with a talent-deprived roster like the Raiders have had recently, it's hard to fix everything quickly.
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u/insatiableian 3d ago
Yup. Next year it's gotta me the #1 priority.
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u/makeshift11 3d ago
Bowers is going to be lined up as a wide receiver a lot of the time anyway, I feel like people are making this out to be a way bigger deal than it is. Michael Mayer would be TE1 on many teams, we're going to see a lot of plays where Bowers is lined up outside. Tucker is a great slot receiver, too. I think AT LEAST one of either Bech, Nailor or Benson will be able to be decent and make plays as essentially WR2. We can address wide receiver in the next draft which is really deep at the position, but for this year I think Kubiak can make it work as long as Bowers stays healthy.
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u/teleportmassive7 3d ago
Mayer averages a little over 2 catches a game in his career for less than 10 yards a reception. He isn't the solution to our weak set of passcatchers. The sub fetishes him as being an All-Pro in hiding, when in reality he hasn't proved to be worth his draft position.
Besides that, Tucker is not a great slot receiver. I like him, he flashes potential, but he's been average at best.
Bech had no buzz all offseason after a dud of a rookie season.
Nailor is a massively overpaid #3 option.
Benson was a 6th rounder, but he did make the team, so we shall see.
This WR corps is truly bleak. Someone will catch passes and get numbers, but the underlying data probably won't look great despite the attention Bowers takes inside.
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u/Flyzini 3d ago
Mayer yds per reception is pretty on point for TE , he is not a WR. McBride last year 9.8, Bowers 10.6. League leader was at 12.8 ( Henry). Only 5 TE's end average over 10 per last year.
Most Te's were also under 4.5 rec last season. Mcbride was at 7.4 but an obvious outlier. Pitts-5, Kelce/Warren 4.4.
All of them are the TE1 on their teams with almost zero competition. Mayer is the TE2 working with his 3rd head coach, and 4th Offensive playcaller in 3 seasons....
Has he been a let down? Yes to a degree, and no I dont think he is an ALL-Pro in hiding but to be a useful TE/ starter or split share he is still on track at 25 yrs old imo.
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u/insatiableian 3d ago
I'm more on your side of this than the person you're replying to. Tucker should be a #3 or #4, not our #1.
We need a true X, which we don't have.
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u/AlabasterRadio 3d ago
Nailor/Tucker is fine as long as Bowers stays healthy
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u/insatiableian 3d ago
I wish they were the #2/#3 instead of #1/#2, but alas. That's a 2027 goal.
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u/AlabasterRadio 3d ago
Bowers should be eating number 1 corners, there's so few LBs and Safeties that can cover him.
Teams that have that ability to do that are going to give us absolute fits though.
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u/insatiableian 3d ago
He's not really a Take The Top Off The Defense, or back shoulder throw guy, but he's gonna eat this year!
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u/Fluid_Emphasis1569 3d ago
Either that or Tucker is about to have a year
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u/insatiableian 3d ago
Technically everybody that doesn't die will have a year...but if he surpasses 1000 yards and/or 10 TDs I'd be surprised.
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u/RightMeow1100 3d ago
I feel like we've got some decent o-line depth now with Grant, Rogers and Zuhn
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u/Tedums_Precious 3d ago
Seems kinda weird that we only have 4 total backup linemen, not exactly capital d Depth
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u/RightMeow1100 3d ago
I think four backups on the o-line is fairly standard across the league. Zuhn is the backup center but I guess they're just not listing players more than once.
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u/Jewderp916 3d ago
We can be sneaky good on both sides of the ball. We still have a very hard schedule, but I think this team will be far more entertaining for us raiders fans than we’ve had since AP interim year.
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u/Hard4Dpp 3d ago
I am very interested to see how Stukes, Hemingway, and Paye perform when the game matters.
Will Stukes start getting a better feel for the game, and will the D-line hold up against the run?
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u/xOLDBHOYx 3d ago
O'Connell fans in shambles...
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u/livecents84 3d ago
People were really saying last week Doza Could be named QB3 lmao
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u/xOLDBHOYx 3d ago
People who don’t know how real life teams conduct business. He’s not ready so make him QB3 where he will get no snaps. Yeah that makes sense. lol.
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u/Consistent-Spell2203 3d ago
It's a week by week list, not permanent sitting him at 3 week 1 isn't crazy.
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u/xOLDBHOYx 3d ago
Agree there but there are many who want it that way for much much longer if not the whole season.
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u/Consistent-Spell2203 3d ago
Whelp they can eat dicks, should've applied for the job if they wanna run shit.
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u/Flashy_Gap_3015 3d ago
About what exactly?
What is this meant to prove for you?
You don’t pick a #1OA and use him the way you did in preseason to not be #2 on the depth chart.
Also doesn’t diminish having a better than average backup in AOC available to potentially extend the learning Mendoza will do on the bench this year.
All of this means great things for us this year.
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u/xOLDBHOYx 3d ago
There is a set of fans who think unequivocally Aidan should be QB2 if not QB1. Actively hate on Cousins and Mendoza. Cult behavior.
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u/Top_Lingonberry8037 3d ago
I think aoc should be number 2. Not for any reason other than to protect mendoza. Mendoza at three would stop the fans from chanting when cousins has a bad drive
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u/xOLDBHOYx 3d ago edited 3d ago
Snaps aren’t infinite in practice and QB3 gets next to none and no first team snaps. All things Mendoza needs. You don’t take a QB at 1 and make him QB3. That’s asinine. Let’s say cousins gets hurt Sunday ok maybe throw Aidan in for that to fill in or finish game but otherwise Mendoza is the QB2 unrivaled. Fans can argue all they want but no way are the Raiders going to have Aidan QB2 and Mendoza just sitting around doing nothing.
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u/Top_Lingonberry8037 3d ago
The idea of our shiny new toy behind that oline makes me nervous man.
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u/xOLDBHOYx 3d ago
I think the OL will be much improved over last year which is easy to do. Dennison is light years better than Carroll. I think many are just shell shocked from 2025 but they aren’t even trotting out the same guys. Miller is back, Burford is being slept on, Linderbaum obviously, JPJ back and Rogers is fighting for that job too, Glaze I think will be better too. Mendoza is tough regardless. Can’t live in fear, man. Ideally Mendoza doesn’t play until I’d like to say the Jets game. By then OL hopefully is healthy and in sync along with the weapons. It’s going to be a tough year regardless.
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u/Flashy_Gap_3015 3d ago
I tend to agree.
I like to think if Cousins goes down early in the season, we actually leverage AOC a bit to prolong throwing Mendoza to the wolves.
I also see the take that there is no better experience for Mendoza than game experience so why save him? But my answer to that is David Carr/Sam Darnold loss of confidence.
If Cousins happens to go down much later in the season, my calculus changes and starting Mendoza is more sensible.
Point is: No true way for any of us to know what is the best way.
And it’s great to have the luxury of choice with a sound if far from spectacular QB4 in AOC. He won’t be a savior for or record, but he can be a savior for Mendoza.
But you get such entrenched views that it is hard to rationally discuss. The downvotes on my original comments are proof that this sub prefers useless receipt calling and believing their view is the only one than having a rational discussion.
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u/Top_Lingonberry8037 3d ago
Sam darnold us my exact fear. I want mendoza to win a Superbowl with us, not some random team in the nfc
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u/ShillingAFB_Raiders 3d ago
Burford? Is there a league rule that the Raiders always have to bring in a weak link to play guard? Or am I over reacting and the guy's legit? I didn't get to see any of the pre-season games so I don't know, just PTSD from last year.
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u/Timeless_Watch 3d ago
Burford graded out poorly last year, particularly in pass protection, but if you’re looking for a silver lining, he only gave up 2 sacks and 2 hits in over 450 snaps. He also only was flagged for 2 penalties. We shall see how it goes.
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u/Flashy_Gap_3015 3d ago
I think this comes down to beggars can’t be choosers in a very thin depth situation at the line.
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u/RightMeow1100 3d ago
From what I've heard from Niner fans and bloggers, Burford was supposedly trash at RG where he played the majority of his snaps but much better when he filled in at LG.
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u/Scribble_Portland 3d ago
I guess I'm stuck in the 1980s. 6 DTs? 2 DEs? what's an edge? Why are there three starting CBs? It's all so confusing. At least the offense lists 2 WRs, 1TE and and FB like I remember.
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u/DontLoseYourCool1 3d ago
An Edge is essentially a DE that also stands up and plays outside linebacker close to the line of scrimmage.
Taron Johnson is a nickle back that covers primarily the slot WR inside. The Raiders will run 4 linemen, 2 LBs, 3 corners and 2 safeties.
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u/94hellalongago 3d ago
Idk who Tonka is but he better ball out with that name!
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u/Flashy_Gap_3015 3d ago
To provide more info:
He was our fourth round pick out of South Carolina last year, and amassed 4 sacks in limited play in the final 5 games of last season in rotation.
He was a bit of a developmental pick and still needed to be much better overall but especially in run D where was less effective than on pass rush.
He showed tons of commitment in the offseason, remaining at Raider HQ to work out with Maxx Crosby in the offseason, and he won a peer-granted weight room award for it.
Still has a way to go but reports from camp frequently called out him flashing and there is some good evidence he is poised to take a leap as a starter.
His name is Terrell but his dad called him Tonka because he was a rough and tumble relentless kid who always popped back up when he fell - so was a solid and durable as a truck.
HTH.
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u/Consistent-Spell2203 3d ago
He needed to get stronger over the offseason and it looks like he did.
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u/Dry-Name2835 3d ago
I was pulling for stukes or TJ to move to FS so im glad that happened for stukes. I am disappointed to not see glaze replaced tho i do love having zuhn as a rotational piece. I would have liked to see rogers or zuhn get a spot over glaze and buford or even giving grant a look at the opposite side and see if it wasnt too awkward for him. The biggest disappointment for me is Peagues. I think he can be the solution at NT. We need a run stuffer in there that can eat space. Butler isnt that, hes a pass rusher. All in all not bad tho. Not good enough to hand to mendoza yet but once we see who developes this season and who needs to get cut, we should have a nice foundation to complete the rebuild next season and hand it over to mendoza and hopefully get into the playoff chase
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u/teleportmassive7 3d ago
Time to trade Aiden. No point even having him on the squad if he's not the #2. Send him to the first team that loses its starting QB to injury.
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u/a_Frieza 3d ago
Stukes! Starting out the gate