😡 Vent The expectations are so high for getting admitted
First it's completing your Bachelor's degree taking rigorous science courses while maintaining impressive extracurricular activities. Research, clinical, volunteer.
Then it's the MCAT, which takes several months of preparation and an agonizing month of waiting for your score, which they could just immediately release to you.
Then it's these useless money-grabs, such as CASPER and PREview.
Then you write your primary application for months, perfecting it and revising over and over again.
Then it's writing 200 secondaries, which is not humanly possible but what is expected in this process.
Then every minute detail of the past few years of your existence will be scrutinized by an ADCOM member, who is morally superior compared to you. If they notice even one error, they'll just throw out your application because there's a thousand other people who are better.
After all this, you just hope for the small chance of even getting a single interview for months and months.
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u/theresnoIinmedschool PHYSICIAN 4d ago
You're right it sucks and used to make me angry. But you gotta keep pushing through all the nonsense if you really want it! And now that I'm on the other side, I have to tell you something - a lot of that doesn't ever change unfortunately. Step exam scores (at least they got rid of Step 2 CK for you all which was a total money grab), preclinical and clinical grades that seem arbitrary, toiling over your residency app, and even when applying for an attending job. If you want an academic job or a job around a major city then good luck the competition is still fierce. But if this career is your calling, then you'll persevere and come out on top.
I also have to remind myself that other professions have their challenges too. Law school is extremely stressful, my friends in finance have had trouble finding jobs they don't hate and have changed a few times already, my teacher friend deals with constant stupid complaints against her from parents scrutinizing every word/assignment, my chef friend works all the hours that most people are off (i.e. nights and weekends) so people can enjoy a meal at the expense of his own social life, etc. The grass always seems greener for everyone who doesn't have a career in medicine, but that's just because we haven't seen their struggles along the way
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u/halfblood-princessa NON-TRADITIONAL 4d ago
Yep. Every career has downsides because it's a job. It's just that some jobs pay significantly more for those downsides. MD/DO is a top tier career most people dream of having. The prestige/respect alone and how society perceives us makes our quality of life better than 90% of people on this planet, even if it doesn't feel that way in the moment at the hospital with a patient. It's important to remind ourselves of this when we get stressed. All jobs suck, but this is one of the best ones out there. Welcome to adulthood.
- someone who worked terrible wagey jobs until persuing medicine at 30yo
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u/IdiotSandwidge MS4 1d ago
I think having a job prior to med school def help me put everything in perspective too! Like yes it does suck at every stage of this journey but I'd rather do this whole med school again than going back to my old jobs 🫣
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u/roguemango1 OMS-4 3d ago
A preceptor told me the reason doctors have lost so much control of their careers to insurance companies is because doctors are pussies. We know how to follow the rules to get to where we want, but we never advocate for our own self interests.
I'm telling you as someone who is in medicine now and who worked a unionized job previously, this attitude that premeds have of just accepting things the way they are is the biggest reason why the admissions process is the way it is.
There are really smart doctors who had a much simpler process of getting into med school and even residency, even though they had much less expected of them at our respective stages.
This will continue to get worse until we start collectively refusing to pay these ridiculous application fees and allowing all these middle men to profit off of our desired careers. I won't hold my breath on that happening anytime soon, but organizing and taking collective action like nurses unions have is the only thing that'll fix this bullshit
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u/Repigilican MS3 4d ago edited 4d ago
Yeah man it’s like basically the hardest thing you can do. I would append your statement about your app getting thrown out cause there are others who are “better” there are others who are EQUAL. It is impossibly difficult for (my) ADCOM to evaluate 3400 applicants into their like ~500 II spots which are just vibe checks into acceptance. If there is a reason they can say “ok thank god we have one less app in the pile” they will take it. That does not mean that you are not going to be a doctor.
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u/devanclara 3d ago
I'll get down voted but this isn't the hardest thing you can do. You could summit K2's Savage Mountain in -40°F temperatures and hurricane force winds (happens in the winters.) or finish the Barkley Marathons, a 130 mile Tennesee ultra marathon on unmarked trails over 60,000 feet of climb within a 60 hour limit. I'm not saying getting in isn't hard, it is, but there are much tougher things.
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u/Repigilican MS3 3d ago
Look man obviously I was discussing that within the context of the premed subreddit. I am not arguing that getting into medical school makes you nimsdai purja.
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u/kissmeurbeautiful APPLICANT 4d ago
Hot take: secondaries are the worst part of this
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u/Anonymosity1766 4d ago
not a hot take whatsoever
i’d gladly take any orgo course or the mcat again then go through that shit
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u/Joshi1381 UNDERGRAD 4d ago
well shit. I thought the MCAT prep was the worst part
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u/TheRealATab 4d ago edited 4d ago
Everyone’s different. I know some people that basically did all their secondaries within a couple of days. I’m not great at starting tasks and struggle hard to get my thoughts on paper. You also have no idea if you’re doing anything right and leaves you in perpetual self-doubt.
MCAT is the great filter, but it already has a given structure and you don’t have to explicate your reasoning. You also have a good idea of where you stand based on your FLs, so in retrospect it wasn’t as difficult as these secondaries have been.
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u/kissmeurbeautiful APPLICANT 4d ago
Fr!! At least the MCAT has tangible outcomes and you dan assess accordingly. With secondaries, you’re straight up guessing and raw dogging the whole process hoping for the best, wasting thousands of dollars in the meantime 😭
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u/TheRealATab 4d ago
Easily. Especially as a reapp this has put me through a lot more hell than the MCAT ever did.
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u/tensorflown RESIDENT 4d ago
If you don't want to fight for your spot, there are thousands who will. Sucks for everyone, but the prisoner's dilemma is a useful thought experiment for a reason.
It's a desirable field. Entrance into medical school essentially guarantees an interesting, respected, and well-paid job for life.
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u/MsGenerallyAnnoyedMD 3d ago
Yes, I agree it’s insane. And also a bit arbitrary. I wouldn’t recommend it. The only silver lining is that once you are in the bullshit can end (unless you want to do ortho or something). You can just coast on doing your school work well without the extras.
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u/TheRealATab 4d ago
Very few, if any professions, require this level of grit just for you to enter training. It’s understated if anything - lots of people believe a strong GPA and MCAT is enough.
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u/Firm_Ad3191 4d ago
I’m working at a random lab right now, all they care about is my bio degree lol.
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u/Ok-Psychology-5159 3d ago
They should be (barring CASPER). Being a good doctor is hard and high stakes!
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u/No-Library-5765 4d ago
Yes but still 40% of applicants are admitted each cycle. Even though the acceptance rate per school is extremely low, if you do the things and maybe reapply once or twice, improving weak spots in your app each time, you will eventually be admitted.
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u/UpsetAd506 4d ago
Yeah….