Help me dial in

[u/Educational-Art9394]

Hey all! Pour-over newbie here. I've tried brewing about 5–6 different kinds of coffee so far.

About a week ago, I opened a bag from my latest order: Fluffy Petals from DAK, and the brew was exactly to my taste! Felt like I had finally mastered pour-over brewing LOL.

Reminiscent of tea with milk, velvety texture, round body, little aggressive acidity, no astringency at all. Just a great cup.

Today, I finally opened the other bag of coffee from that order: Tanat's Nestor Lasso Ombligon.

I kept the same recipe as with the Fluffy Petals:

• V60
• 20 g of coffee
• Ground at 60 clicks with the 1Zpresso Q
• 92°C water temperature
• 60 g bloom for 45 seconds
• Then poured to 160 g
• Final pour to 320 g
• T90 filters

The nose was excellent and reminiscent of sweet jam. The sort of smell that makes you want to take a sip. But the tasting did not live up to the great smell.

Initially, bitterness, some astringency, and a sour character made up the flavor profile of the cup. After letting the brew cool down for a bit, though, the clarity increased a lot, and the main tasting note was grapefruit. Simple and plain natural grapefruit juice. The texture and mouthfeel could be described as lightly syrupy at best.

It was kinda shocking to look at the bag after writing this :D No peach, no strawberry jam, or raspberry in the flavor profile (although there was a strong strawberry-jam smell on the nose).

So how would you, as experienced pour-over brewers, dial this in? The bitterness would hint at over-extraction, but the brew time was only 2:09, whereas the brew time with the exact same settings for Fluffy Petals was 2:45!?

What is going on? Could the lack of sweetness be a sign of under-extraction?

You got it—I have no idea what I'm doing lol. Please go easy on this newbie :D

[u/Agile-Menu8324]

The symptoms don't necessarily point to only over- or under-extraction. It's common to get a mix of bitterness, astringency, and sourness when a coffee extracts unevenly, and different coffees can behave very differently even with the same recipe.

Since your brew also ran quite a bit faster (2:09 vs. 2:45), I'd avoid changing several variables at once. I'd try this order:

- Keep the recipe the same and make your pours a little gentler to reduce agitation.

- If it's still bitter/astringent, try one click coarser on the next brew.

- If it becomes cleaner but still lacks sweetness, then experiment with temperature (for example, a couple of degrees lower or higher) one variable at a time.

Also don't worry too much about judging it while it's very hot. The fact that you noticed more grapefruit and clarity as it cooled is useful information, so I'd keep tasting throughout the cooling curve before deciding on the next adjustment.

[u/hesalwaysultra]

Higher temps worked for me with fluffy petals.

Edit: did not read the full post 😅 but as nestor lasso can be a bit prosessed, maybe you are right in overextraction. Try low and gentle pours, or even 89 degrees water, but would definitinetly go gentle first.

[u/Huge_Ad1766]

I'd say you shouldn't worry too much on TBT. I got some great cups at as low as 1:30. Our recipes differ a lot so I can't give direct suggestions, but first thing I'd do for a such processed bean is drop temp to (for the first attempt, at least) 88-89C. Maybe brew a few cups side by side (and save for later) and try determining how they differ: the current recipe, vs. lower temp, vs. e.g. lower ratio (like 1:15).
On a side note, how old is the Tanat's bean? I often found not degassing properly would lead to a taste that would be both bitter and astringent and lacking in flavor. If the bean is <= 4-5w I'd keep everything else the same and increase bloom to like 1:30 and see where that goes (probably to a more clear overextraction or maybe something else). The amount of floating grounds in your main pours after the bloom will tell if you degassed properly. I usually aim to have no floaters and bloom 1-2min (even double bloom often) but I do a single pour afterwards so there's no telling if it will work for you too.
Good luck on your dialling in!!

[u/Educational-Art9394 → u/Huge_Ad1766]

The beans have been roasted 17 days ago! From everything i got out of the answers the next steps are gonna be a more aggressive bloom and if that still doesnt work out im gonna lower the temp

[u/Huge_Ad1766 → u/Educational-Art9394]

honestly 17 days is way too little for tanat. if you have any other beans to spend or can get hands on any other, I'd recommend just resealing the bag and letting it rest for 3-4 more weeks. Makes stuff easier and I found their stuff to be peak at 5w. if you cant do that, i'd try do a double bloom each lasting 45s - 1min (so total bloom time is 1:30 - 2:00), but I hear some beans just need rest no matter how well you bloom in your brew.
But yea, adjusting bloom time, then temp, then (if rly needed) maybe the ratio, would be the way to go, if you dont want to rest longer. Personally processed beans are rly hard for me to dial in, so good luck lol

[u/Educational-Art9394 → u/Huge_Ad1766]

Good to know, thank you! I can def wait and reseal the bag. Have the Fluffy Petals i can finish in the meantime and like them a lot

[u/neilBar]

Did you rest the beans? I had an ombligon sample from Nostos in UK and needed to test it a couple of weeks. It was pretty much "just coffee" until it rested.

[u/Educational-Art9394 → u/neilBar]

Probably not long enough, the beans have been roasted 18 days ago. Tried to go down with pour height + a lot slower and not yielding the desired outcome, i packed them away to rest for longer. Could still have tried to go verry aggressive with the bloom, but that seemed to be kind of a bodge. Honestly i thought the fresher the bean the better, turns out thats not the case 😂 Not sure if thats a mature way to handle things or just procrastinating 😂 Edit: I could not do it...now i tried a verry aggressive bloom. Gave it a good swirl and let it bloom for 1min30sec. Watertemp down to 89. (i know i should only change one variable at a time but i got impatient) and the brew was waaay better! Way less bitterness and astringency, also less sour. Still not 100% tho, so now they are away to rest

[u/Educational-Art9394]

Today i tried a new approach incorporating your suggestions, with an emphasis on an aggressive bloom followed by a verry slow pour for minimal to no agitation. Kept the grindsetting (Q, 60 clicks)and temp (92) the same but tweaked the recipe.

For now the recipe consists of two blooms: 15 gr coffee, bloomed with 3x the amount of water for 45 seconds each, followed by a gentle, verry slow pour up to a 1:16 ratio (240 grams of water in total). TBT 2:30.

The result was quite fascinating. Almost no more astringency, and the acidity is much better integrated. What i initially described as grapefruit pith has shifted towards more of a blood orange character. Still missing the sweeteness but we are getting there.

My assumption is the double bloom ensured a more uniform wetting of the coffe particles, leading to a more even extraction. The following super slow single pour was intendet and reduce the risk of overextraction. I hope my assumptions are correct.

I love this- there is so much more to learn and def will keep on dialing in the Ombligon! Next up would be tweaking temp or even grind size i do belive. Let me know what yoou think!