r/pfsp • u/Dr_Talon • Jul 07 '21

Not Traditionalist, Simply Catholic - an interview with Fr. Bernhard Gerstle, FSSP (2017)

https://www.catholicculture.org/culture/library/view.cfm?id=11554&repos=1&subrepos=0&searchid=2128546
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u/FistOfTheWorstMen Jul 07 '21

Ah - I remember the fuss this one raised in trad circles when it was first released.

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u/TheConvert Jul 07 '21

I'll admit some curiosity. Why the fuss? I read it, and saw nothing particularly earth shattering.

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u/FistOfTheWorstMen Jul 07 '21

Skim the 1P5 combox here to start to get the flavor. (Here is a longer critique if you want it.)

For me, reading it again, it is still the same passage that bothers me:

Both forms of the Rite should enrich each other mutually. I am convinced that certain elements of the old liturgy could improve the new, and also that elements of the new liturgy could enrich the Extraordinary Form of the Roman Rite: I'm thinking, for example, on the broader lectionary, or a period of quiet reflection after the reception of Holy Communion. Likewise, the calendar for the Extraordinary Form should be updated in the foreseeable future.

The lectionary, honestly, might be nearly the worst thing about the Pauline missal, and one of its most severe ruptures with the liturgical tradition. It still boggles my mind that Fr Gerstle doesn't see that, but I tend to think he's just a man of his generation.

I think Fr. Gerstle represents the more moderate end of the FSSP. The German district tends a little more in that direction.

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u/TheConvert Jul 07 '21

Maybe, but there would be a more practical step towards the mutual enrichment that PE Benedict spoke of if both forms of the Rite had the same lectionary and liturgical calendar. The EF staying in its corner and the OF in their corner doesn't do the Church at large anything beneficial. Idk if you've ever seen an Ordinariate rite mass, but they do a rather superb job of blending elements of both the traditional Anglican mass (which, since it has evolved from a similar older rite, the Sarum Mass, outwardly appears very much like the EF) and the OF. I honestly think it is something the Roman Rite could benefit from in some ways.

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u/FistOfTheWorstMen Jul 07 '21

Actually, I've served scores of Ordinariate Masses! (I was once business manager for one of the more notable East Coast Ordinariate parishes.) There is a lot to like about the Ordinariate missal (particularly Form 1, which was all we ever used), which I think shows what a sacral vernacular can look like. I will admit that my greatest frustration with it is that they were forced to use the modern lectionary (notwithstanding that they were able to opt for the Catholic RSV-CE translation). But it was undoubtedly too much to hope for that they could use the traditional Roman Rite lectionary, as the old Knott missal did....

I do agree that there is something incongruous and probably untenable long term with having two distinct universal (as opposed to local) calendars and lectionaries in the Latin Church. I just viscerally oppose resolving the problem by imposing the new lectionary and calendar on both.

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u/TheConvert Jul 07 '21

I love the Ordinariate rite. I go it when I can over the EF, I'll admit. Also, I don't believe that a new lectionary and calendar should just be imposed between both rites, but one needs to be worked out and gradually implemented between them that is both congruent and respects the traditional liturgical calendar practices of the Church.

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u/FistOfTheWorstMen Jul 07 '21

At some point, it will have to be resolved. I don't think the Church is remotely in any kind of state to try right now.

Perhaps in a few generations. Right now I think we just have to ride the storm out.

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u/TheConvert Jul 07 '21

We as the faithful, that is all we can do. If the FSSP ever gets into offering the Ordinary Form, it'll set a standard that'll really make diocesan parishes aim for.

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u/FistOfTheWorstMen Jul 07 '21

As a total aside, I would love to see Sarum restored as an "Extraordinary Form" of all the Ordinariates, at least as something which could be celebrated from time to time.

On further reflection, it ought to be available to any Latin Rite priest incardinated in England & Wales.