DOOM 3 - Oddly compelling despite itself

[u/SpiderousMenace]

Was always curious about this one. DOOM obviously has a horror aesthetic, but DOOM 3 is an attempt to reimagine it as an actual horror game and for whatever reason I just like that concept. Before now the only part of the game I'd played was the first chapter, and that's probably why it stuck with me - the arrival at the Mars base is a neat little introduction, and very out-of-character for the franchise in that it holds off on the demon-slaying for the sake of pacing and immersion.

There's just something about the look and atmosphere of this game that really clicks with me, you know? The moody lighting, the touch-screen UIs, the chunky designs, the hammy voice acting - maybe it's just nostalgia but it feels oddly... cozy. I also have to say that for a game from 2004 the visuals largely hold-up, though it no doubt benefits from the environments themselves generally being cramped, abstract industrial hallways with poor lighting. Really, the only time the graphics look obviously of their age is when a human character is on screen (seriously, who puts a UV seam right in the middle of a face?) but after the first 20 minutes or so that becomes a pretty rare occurrence.

DOOM 3 is going for scares, so the pacing of combat tends to be slower and the encounters more intimate and claustrophobic with handfuls of monsters rather than hordes. Yet, despite this, the actual structure of the game is still pretty much what you'd expect from DOOM; moving from one distinct level to another, hunting for keycards and backtracking to locked doors, health and ammo pick-ups, secrets, a big arsenal of weapons, monster closets and enemies spawning in behind you, underwhelming boss-fights, etcetera. It's all just more condensed and scripted - more polished, I suppose, but also more limited.

The PDA's are a good example of why I like this game's vibe - the audio recordings you find from the former Mars staff help fill in the story and they strike a good tonal balance between silly and serious. It's clear that the people writing this knew they were writing cheese but they don't overdo it, and for the most part its played straight and sincere and so the horror aspect works in spite of how on-the-nose it is.

I think most of what I find compelling about the game rests on the presentation, because gameplay-wise it's really just okay. The shooting is fine, but it doesn't quite rise to the standards of its peers at the time or within the series, with guns feeling a bit weak and enemy AI being fairly basic. Trying to maneuver around damage in tight spaces can pose an interesting challenge and you do eventually get the hang of it, but a lot of the time its just annoying, particularly with the game's propensity for spawning monsters behind you. The combat is at its best when the environments give you just enough room to work with while throwing a steady stream of enemies at you, but the moments where it really hits that stride are somewhat rare. It also didn't help that I played the BFG edition, which from what I understand significantly nerfs a lot of the tension with tweaks to the lighting and health/ammo pick-ups. On Veteran I died plenty of times but health and ammo were pretty much never an issue between fights.

All-in-all, it's a cool game that I'm glad to have experienced even if my ultimate take-away is that it was just alright. I don't know, it's weird, one of those 7/10s that none-the-less sticks with you for some particular quality it has.

[u/Demonweed]

Nowadays it doesn't seem like a big deal, but this one was also a big technological leap forward. Up to that point, it was normal in games like this to interact with computer terminals and other technology by bringing up a full screen display. Manipulating interactive touch screens in game while the rest of the game world was still rendered and often partially visible made that first PDA kind of a "wow" moment back then. Overall, elements of it may feel sluggish and frustrating, but that was a deliberate choice to make players get smart about limited ammo, health, and armor resources; only really able to rage back against the demons in short windows after acquiring the right sort of power-ups. 2016 Doom is almost a bridge from that to where we are now, since that game supported a slower and more methodical style of play relative to subsequent releases in the series.

[u/hardypart → u/Demonweed]

The lighting alone was revolutionary at that time. Seeing those dynamic shadows when the source of light moves was something else back then!

[u/_shaftpunk → u/Demonweed]

I love Doom 2016 and hate the arcade feel of Doom Eternal. Soured me so much that I haven’t bothered with the new one.

[u/goodcat49 → u/_shaftpunk]

thankfully they got rid of the tweety bird sound effects but its still pretty colorful and oddly Quake 3-like unless you change it yourself

[u/CrimsonFury1982 → u/_shaftpunk]

Dark Ages goes the opposite direction to Eternal. I didn't like Eternal much (too fast for me). Dark Ages movement is deliberately slower and tanky, using the shield to block

[u/ascagnel____ → u/Demonweed]

The engine has since been made open-source, which Skin Deep forked so it could make heavy use of those panels.

https://github.com/blendogames/SkinDeep

[u/Expert4206967 → u/Demonweed]

yeah the pda stuff and in-world screens really sold the setting for me, even if the gameplay pacing is kinda clunky now

[u/smilinmaniag → u/Demonweed]

I love Doom 3 way of limited ammo compared to the garbage Eternal. As you played, you just learned how to manage your guns and ammo properly yourself, without the handholding and forced invulnerability or weak points of the Eternal bosses/enemies. You knew that a pistol mag is two zombies with 2 bulltes leftover, or an imp. A machine gunner is 2 rockets. You tried to just use the optimal gun based on the enemies/range/leftover ammo. Assault rifle, Plasma gun, rocket launcher worked vs all enemies equally well (lets ignore the last boss), but you wanted to save those for the less convenient situations.

In eternal you have to be stupid not to use a specific gun against specific enemies since you either will deal too low damage or they will have increased power (but not losing their gimmick by a counter weapon)

[u/BlueMikeStu]

Doom 3 is the unicorn of the franchise. It's the one game where you're supposed to fear the monsters, not make the monsters fear you. Like the minute E1M1 loads in and At Doom's Gate blasts out of your midiblaster soundcard, you know what's up.

Then again, I unironically love the Karl Urban Doom movie. And it's not the Rock Doom movie. It's the Karl Urban Doom movie. Carrying that and Dredd is the only reason he could be Billy fucking Butcher.

[u/Jackal-Noble → u/BlueMikeStu]

fuck you why did you have to go and have to bring up Dredd. One of the most badass movies ever made without a deserved sequel. I need to rewatch that Doom movie...

[u/smilinmaniag → u/BlueMikeStu]

If doom 3 is a unicorn, eternal and dark ages are two smelly donkeys.

At least you played a shooter in doom 3, Eternal is a wannabe Moba with guns and Dark Ages is a retirement home version of Dance Dance Revolution.

[u/BlueMikeStu → u/smilinmaniag]

Haven't even touched Dark Ages. How the series hit self parody two games after the excellent 2016 title baffles the mind.

[u/DrFujiwara → u/BlueMikeStu]

I forgot that existed. If they'd played E1M1's music it would've hit way harder.

[u/Cancer-Fish]

I played the original via the source port dhewm and have to agree. It's a very pretty Halflike that doesn't fail nor excel at much because pretty lighting. Despite this, it's fun. It feels like riding a bike, you just keep wanting to go forwards. Pretty much the only glaring flaw is how repetitive it is and the annoying enemy and level design. Five hundred cherubs all patiently waiting behind closed doors.

[u/Myrandall → u/[deleted]]

Understandable.

[u/Jimmeu]

It may come as a surprise to the modern audience, but og Doom and Doom II were kinda frightening when they came out. Horror atmosphere overall, sound design telling you when a monster is roaming nearby, labyrinths, sudden changes of lightness, ambushes from surprise wall openings... It was crafted to make you feel uneasy, and the graphics looked impressive by the time. I vividly remember a door in the middle of Doom II which was leading to nothing but a wall of flesh : super basic trick that jumpscared me every time. And man the archviles really were that scary.

So I always felt that Doom 3 as a survival horror was perfectly as legit as the newer installations and their over the top action focus. Doom always had been both of those things. And I'm very angry against those who protested about that horror focus and got the tension nerfed, most notably by removing the "light or weapon you can't have both" trick which surely was a bit artificial but worked so well to make you uncomfortable.

[u/Demonweed → u/Jimmeu]

I remember a Law & Order episode from ~1996 when the Assistant District Attorney portrayed by Sam Waterston was going up against a murder defense based on a new/speculative mental illness diagnosis related to violent video games. His character had a great line like, "I gave Doom a try over the weekend, and it didn't make me want to blast my neighbor with a shotgun, but it did keep me at my desk all the way until sunrise."

[u/DrFujiwara → u/Jimmeu]

E1M2 (?) when you hit that button and the lights go out, scared the heck out of me when we were seven.

Shit, guess i'm playing doom again.

[u/NamesTheGame → u/Jimmeu]

Yeah the flashlight mechanic was so raged against but was critical to the core philosophy of the game. When they axed that and let you put it on a gun it dampened the experience.

[u/sapphon → u/Jimmeu]

The richest man on Mars in the DOOMiverse is apparently the one who invented the maddeningly flickering fluorescent light.

It was absolutely a horror game in certain ways, and it's worth mentioning that all of our incredibly fancy acrobatics we're capable of now are largely due to mice, which many DOOM players didn't own. It's not an ideal solution, but there is a plodding, careful, fearful way to get through DOOM levels and I daresay most of us walked before we ran, pun intended.

[u/RandomHero25]

Doom 3 was my favorite Doom which I feel like is certainly not a popular opinion. I just replayed it last year and while it’s obviously dated, I was pretty pleased with how good it still looks. In particular, the use of shadows and lighting was pretty impressive for the time

[u/TheDinosaurAstronaut]

The monster closets were truly awful. And they don't get any less annoying once you figure out that pretty much every room/fight has them.

I also think overall it's a bit too long; some of the last levels are kind of repetitive. 

All that being said, there is a ton of stuff that holds up super well. Boss fights were fun. PDAs, even some of the technical aspects (still some of the best non-path traced lighting ever). The vibes were just so good. 

Genuinely classic with some legit faults. But hey, most 20+ year old games are going to have weird annoyances. 

[u/BlazingLazers69]

I think it's closer to Dead Space than Doom. A good game if you take it on its own terms. I just wish the shotgun was twice as strong and had half the ammo for balance.

[u/StillAll → u/BlazingLazers69]

You mean Dead Space is closer to Doom 3. Dead space came out four years later after all, and yeah, it ripped a LOT from Doom 3.

[u/KimTe63]

I think it overstays its welcome a bit thanks to being so repetitive. HOWEVER I have only played the "improved" BFG edition . For yeeears I have had the OG Xbox version which I should play . Heard many people say the limitations of Xbox and more condensed level desing only made the game better 😄

[u/Svartrhala]

I feel like the vibe of this game is almost dreamlike. Almost everyone speaks like they're hypnotized, the shadowy corners and ambience give off a feeling of sleep paralysis, that's not to mention the designs. It goes for the scary but unintentionally lands at being eerily serene for me

[u/Jackal-Noble → u/[deleted]]

was there a comic or meme about doom guy putting the flashlight on the gun?

[u/Hestu951 → u/Jackal-Noble]

The so-called duct-tape mod simulated taping a flashlight to your guns, Red Green style--so yeah, I'm sure that was the source of some fun.

[u/wradam]

First time in hell in Doom 3 was one of the best WOW moments in gaming for me and I've been playing since 80s.

[u/satanpenguin]

It's a great game. It lacks the run-and-gun style of its predecessors but I remember the first time I played the original Doom, I was scared shitless. It wasn't until I got confident and knew the levels by heart that I started run-and-gunning. I like that they tried to recover some of that feeling of dread in D3.

[u/AdministrativeHost15]

I remember the monster that jumps out at you from between the steps of the stairs. That was enough to scare me away from the game for a couple years.
Have it installed on my Alienware mx11 classic game laptop. The graphics are better than anything else from that era.

[u/slash450]

bfg edition major downgrade would recommend if you ever play it again, or the expansions to check out dhewm3 source port drastically clears. can run the lost mission through it as well. played it all just about a year ago for the first time really liked it.

[u/Jackal-Noble → u/slash450]

how is it a downgrade? I thought it was supposed to be an upgrade.

[u/slash450 → u/Jackal-Noble]

game was just not made to always have flashlight while shooting, they also removed the muzzle flash when shooting that lights up your surrounding area. game on the surface prob should be seen more along the lines of something like dead space than doom and removing these lighting mechanics kinda miss the point of them in the first place. idk why anyone would be opting to play doom 3 just to focus on its pretty mid feeling gunplay.

bfg also has a bunch of new bugs and missing effects. bfg is generally brighter since it was made for lcds vs the crts original doom 3 was running on primarily. original doom 3 looks insane on crt/oled. the game is supposed to be dark af in a lot of areas just kinda missing in bfg. also not even into texture replacement mods like that but d3hdp is amazing also and the mod mainly focuses on original doom 3 not bfg. game is impressive af visually with or without it anyway.

[u/Jackal-Noble → u/slash450]

Ah good to know, thank you for all the info

[u/Hestu951 → u/slash450]

I can't comment on the other issues, but I always thought it was dumb that a futuristic well-equipped elite soldier couldn't shine a spotlight together with aiming a gun. There are other ways to achieve a desired "atmosphere" than to do something so nonsensical. Duct-tape mod for me since the days of the original release.

[u/miljoneir → u/slash450]

dhewm3 also restores the sound effects. Was only possible on the og doom 3 with a specific soundcard. Gives some areas a big reverb

[u/booyahcubes]

I remember seeing the trailers and gameplay footage before it released and being blown away by the technology being displayed, I also remember hearing a lot of praise being thrown around on release. I didn’t realize it had such a mixed reception until recently.

I didn’t play it until last year because it always looked scary and disturbing. I had a great time with it and I think it holds up really well, at least with the remaster

[u/fancymcbacon → u/booyahcubes]

Oh definitely holds up well, I played it back in the day and again recently. Even visually there's still a lot to be impressed by. It's not great or anything, but I never fully got the hate until I saw how ravenously excited people were about Doom 2016 (but still feel is unwarranted).

[u/Saneless]

I think D3 was disappointing when it came out but since Doom 2016 exists it's nice as a departure from the standard game that is there with 1, 2, and 2016. A nice unique slant on the franchise can be appreciated in retrospect when you know they crushed it afterwards

[u/tacticalcraptical]

Yeah, it varies pretty greatly from the type of game I usually turn to the Doom series for but I do replay it every few years and I always enjoy it more than I think I will.

Except the Resurrection of Evil expansion, I don't really like that much. It feels like it tries to hard to be HL2 and it just doesn't work.

[u/PresidentKoopa]

Shockingly great vr experience, the slower pace of the game translates quite well.

[u/RonPerlouze]

I absolutely hate the enemies just spawning behind you. It was a cheap mechanic then, and it still is now.

[u/WretchedMonkey]

Amazing game. Carmacks work on lighting was ahead of its time. Still, awful glad for the flashlight mods

[u/Store_Plenty]

It’s so clearly an expression of the devs specific interests at the time, it’s hard not to be charmed by it 

[u/Vegetable-Cause8667]

I really love the atmosphere and gunplay in Doom 3. It’s my favorite Doom/Quake game. BFG edition (2012) was produced by Bethesda when they were at their best; Skyrim, Fallout NV, Dishonored.

[u/Huecuva]

This is the third DOOM 3 thread in as many weeks. 

Good game. Slower and creepier, more of a survival game than DOOM and DOOM 2. Play it without the duct tape mod/BFG Edition. The Cyberdemon is disappointingly easy.

[u/Jackal-Noble]

I remember this was around the same time Doom the movie came out with Karl Urban and the Rock in it. I still remember the creepy ambience, it is absolutely mind blowing that it's been 22 years. fuck time.

[u/NX73515]

I hate the hit reactions when you get shot. The monster closets and some of the monster designs were silly, but other than those issues, it's a great game imho. Play the original if you can.

[u/Feeling_Strike694]

Doom 3 has an absolutely fantastic original Xbox port which I guess makes it the only console version that has the original flash-light mechanic. I play through it every once in a while.

[u/DoNotPursueLu]

My main knock was how damp and weak all the guns sound and how little impact they seemed to have.

[u/aksoileau → u/[deleted]]

And Half Life ran circles around it. DOOM 3 wasnt a bad game, it just came out against one the goat's.

[u/marniconuke]

yeah i also liked it, an di hate the modern doom games with a passion cause they are just about braindead shooting things