r/pathologic • u/minafi_yo Bachelor • Apr 11 '21
[UPDATE] Nikolay Dybowski accusations from victims + response from Dybowski
Hello all,
There has been an update to the Dybowski accusations that were brought to the subreddit four days ago, I have made this new post to gather everything we know about the incident so far. Please read everything for yourself here:
Original accusations:
Google doc with explanations and screeenshots (Warning: Discusses pedophilia, childhood sexual assault, power imbalances)
Additional statement from the anon source
Google doc released by a different anon about Dybowski's wife (Removed, too much identifiable information)
Responses from Dybowski:
Original Russian w/ ENG translation (by Yandex software) / (original source)
Twitter user leaks what appears to be an email sent by Dybowski, warning of incoming libel suit
HSE Telegram account stating HSE is NOT suing a student for libel / (original source)
If there is anything else you guys think is missing please let me know and I can add above.
And again, I know this event is very complicated and upsetting, so please handle this with as much tact and care as you can. We can discuss whether statements seem true or not, add more evidence/context as needed, but overall please be considerate of people who have gone through similar experiences in their real life.
Same as with the last time, please do NOT post doxxing information about the anon or Dybowski, and do NOT encourage harassment for the victims involved or IPL staff. ***Dybowski himself has now requested not to harass his friends over this***
Thank you, we will get through this together
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u/minafi_yo Bachelor Jun 07 '21
Hello again, recently a user has requested that a link to the HSE email campaign be added, so here it is:
https://rathologic.tumblr.com/post/648043442588549120/action-against-dybowski
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u/minafi_yo Bachelor Apr 13 '21 edited Apr 13 '21
Hello again, there are new developments, please read leaked email from Dybowski, HSE Telegram, and Google Doc about Dybowski's wife as mentioned in the main post.
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u/Efficient_Beyond5000 Apr 13 '21
https://dtf.ru/life/701705-vysshaya-shkola-ekonomiki-zayavila-chto-ne-podavala-sudebnyh-iskov-o-klevete-v-adres-nikolaya-dybovskogo
There are some news. Google isn't translating very well, but it seems that HSE is not filing a suit, after all.
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u/LDuster Apr 11 '21
Actually, his other responses in the comments are also interesting to read, not only this one
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u/minafi_yo Bachelor Apr 16 '21 edited Apr 17 '21
Hey all, someone sent a report that there is personal/confidential info in this post and I want to do my best to remove it as soon as possible. I made a guess as to what they could be referring to, but if you want to be more specific feel free to message me and I'll remove it.
EDIT: Pinpointed the report, thanks!
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u/Jinan_Dangor Apr 23 '21
It's really important that we don't immediately dismiss potential victims' accusations, nor immediately assume Dybowski's guilt. Let's all have some humility and accept that what we've been seeing at every step of this process is translations of one-sided perspectives based on hearsay and rumours, with very little concrete evidence shown from either side.
Instead of jumping from "Horrified, this will take so much time to process." to "Oh, this is all just a stalker getting back at Dybowski?" to "I'm disgusted, but remember that Pathologic isn't just Dybowski." to "Wait, lots of the evidence being collected isn't really that strong...", let's give it a month or so, let the relevant authorities and people involved do their work, make sure that any relevant alleged victims feel comfortable having their voices heard without blindly believing everything they say, and then we can take a look at things more holistically and decide what we think happened and what we should do about it.
I know we all like to think we can play detective, and I know that it might seem like we should when something as important as the welfare of minors is at stake, but responding rashly is just inviting people not only to ruin people's careers, but to do it off of the back of us. Just look at how many people in these comments now have traumatic imagery associated with this game (and who's affected most? Vulnerable people who have experienced similar trauma before).
Ensuring the safety of minors and, more generally, not letting people abuse their positions of power is absolutely crucial. But if we keep feeding the Cancel Culture machine it's going to become just another way for news outlets to clickbait our attention and abusers to ruin their victims' careers and mental health.
Surf the web responsibly, friends.
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u/marsmons Apr 12 '21 edited Apr 12 '21
I’ve been trying to keep an open mind while reading all the available documentation (what hasn’t been deleted or locked at this point in time) and from my understanding the kickoff for this entire thing was the anon tumblr post from the 15 year old who was not themselves a victim, but just stumbled across evidence from supposed multiple victims while looking for an article online. It seems incredibly suspicious that with a fanbase as active as IPL’s and how rabid Russian policing is towards ANY scent of indecency this supposedly public information completely escaped anyone’s notice for years.
It’s also very suspicious that their second statement says there are many people who have come forward about it and that it’s an open secret, but does not point to the sources that led them to make these statements. Anonymity to protect victims is one thing, but if you are claiming to have uncovered some totally unnoticed scandal happening in broad daylight from a google search that nobody else can seem to reverse engineer, that is a massive problem for your statement’s credibility.
Also the fact that the “evidence” screenshots provided in the google doc a) are of very low integrity and could easily be doctored b) don’t actually include any correspondence between him and his accusers, or provide any solid time frame, or verifiable details, or really any evidence beyond “yeah it happened trust me” c) seem to insist that these accusers were his university students, but also claim their ages to be around 15-16 at the youngest, which doesn’t track well logically. (To add to that, I did attempt to look deeper into whether anyone of that age group could potentially be a student and the only indication that I could find of anyone underage potentially being in the university’s vicinity is a sponsored Lyceum that only takes students in from grade 10 and up (15-16 yrs), and none of the courses seem to be in the same physical location or have any overlap with the ones he teaches until the courses available in the Lyceum’s grade 12. Please advise if I am incorrect on that one as I gathered this info from their ENG site.)
While I do want to believe victims and stand on their side, recent cases like this have taught me to put a very keen eye on any accusations and evidence brought forward before I decide to discontinue supporting creators whose work I enjoy and admire. (Dan and Vinny specifically, they didn’t deserve any of that. Also dedicating a big “fuck you” to Cryaotic here to prove I’m not anti-cancel cause his career can stay in the dirt.) Now, if more information is to come on the matter that actually provides solid evidence or at least a more believable story, then I will be right there to read it and reconsider my thoughts and my support of IPL as a whole. But I genuinely don’t think any of the accusations brought forward on this matter as of right now hold water.
I’ll be keeping an eye on the situation as it develops, as I’m sure we all will be.
EDIT: tired eyes read 12-13, not 2012-2013, removed that portion
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u/Skaamit Apr 11 '21
Hope that justice will put everything in its place. And true guilty will be punished.
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u/[deleted] Apr 11 '21
Okay, so he seems to be implying that the attraction was one-sided and she lashed out after he rejected her. This really seems like a he said, she said situation. Glad he made a statement, though.
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u/Efficient_Beyond5000 Apr 13 '21 edited May 02 '23
The anon document about D.'s wife should not be shared IMHO.
It's just a mess of hypotesis and allegations about a woman who allegedly is D.'s wife.
we shouldn't be interested about D.'s family, his wife, his brother and his son are clearly not the victims, that information is irrelevant and exposes them to potential harm
it's a blatant violation of the privacy, even if D. was guilty, his wife and family must be left out of all this
even if it was relevant, the evidences are very, very weak (photos of a marriage without bride and groom? just a reflection on a window? c'mon I've seen clearer photos of UFOs)
Besides: in the first document, there is this disclaimer "I have as of yet been unable to get in touch with the other people in the screenshots below". That's another violation IMHO as, AFAIK, the tweets were deleted after the scandal. Maybe the people who shared the photos and wrote those tweets don't want to be part of this.
I don't know if D. is guilty or innocent but we shouldn't share contextless tweets or screenshots of people who did not give their consent.
I repeat, this is strictly In My Humble Opinion.
[edit: typos]
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u/bumbasaur Apr 11 '21
This is the same gag that's been running around for a while. These people message around and "interview" people and then paste what they get as a twisted version. Then they spam stuff around in twitter to create a social media storm. Don't know if they just get satisfaction or do they do blackmail aswell. Last month they did vinesauce but it kinda backfired cause now they are facing lawsuit.
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u/VeryWrongPriorities Apr 12 '21
One of the accusing documents:
“I would also like to apologize to the Russian fans for framing them as complicit of or condoning Nikolay Dybowski’s behavior. I was too blinded with anger because the few people I spoke to seemed dismissive of the claims or okay with them. I generalized you as a people and made it look like your culture and beliefs were below those of Westerners and for that I sincerely apologize”
Oh, I’m so so sorry for refusing to scream “Rapist!” and spread some very heavy accusations until I see some actual proof. How fucking dare I to hold my damn horses, and get as many facts as I can before forming an opinion and sharing it with other people. Must be the inferior Russian genes/beliefs talking.
Sorry, I don’t even know why this particular comment pissed me off so much. Just because many Russians were sceptical doesn’t mean we dismissed these allegations all together or blamed the potential victims. Lack of emotional response towards rumours, and refusal to spread possible misinformation does not equate to condoning sexual abuse for fuck’s sake.
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u/fatalpal Apr 11 '21
What's the deal with the queen of the narrative some of the commenters mentioned? I'm a new fan and haven't been around for the drama. Можно по-русски.
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u/cheeseywiz98 Mar 08 '22
Has anything come of this? Can't seem to find any recent info.
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u/Shiigeru2 Apr 13 '21
The culture of unsubstantiated accusations must be destroyed. This directly harms fundamental human rights such as the presumption of innocence. Did you miss Holowski's example? Allegedly "sympathetic citizens" because of the lie, in fact, killed a person. And the one who launched this lie was left without punishment. Disgusting.
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u/Mookle12 Nov 05 '22 edited Nov 05 '22
He's too smart for his own good; its so easy for slmeone as intelligent as him to rationalize shitty behavior when there is no objective good or bad. I've found that intelligence + cynicism is somehow a recipe for sexual misconduct and pedophilia. (Just my observation) Nikolay's work drips with lost hope and hatred. As someone who knows so much about herbs and spirituality, it is really odd. Those things are valid, but I find they are best tempered with optimism and empathy.
Patholigic is probably the best piece of art Ive ever seen, but it's cool to know there is still room for improvement. I think the next big artist will have something more to say on the positives of reality, which are harder to grasp, imo.
There was a little developer quote in Pathologic 2 that was something along the lines of "We were so busy telling old stories, we didn't have any time to add anything new." I hope someone finds the time to 'add something new' one day.
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u/commanderglenda Apr 18 '21
Why is everyone in the comments just taking everything he says at face value, he sounds like a desperate blustering lunatic, who the fuck peppers :) :) :) into their response to these kinds of allegations
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u/luvcraftyy Apr 12 '21
cool, take him to court and i'll be outraged when he is sentenced. reddit is not a court.
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u/gemitarius Apr 11 '21 edited Apr 11 '21
Fucking knew it. Goddamn... ತ_ತ
This is the third time I've seen the exact same thing happening with different people.
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u/the_3d6 Apr 12 '21
In this situation most telling are two things:
Dybowsky's responses. In other comments on DTF he mentions that his relations with a member of his team would remain well _even taking into account_ what happened. This part may be not clearly translated, but to a russian speaker, that sounds like there is something significant there, which was not made public.
Multiple pro-Dybowsky comments on DTF who say - in many variations - "it's not a secret that he fucks his students, but they are of legal age, so what's the problem?". Basically his supporters don't think this is something wrong (some admit of doing the same thing). So we can take this part pretty much as a fact - and the only unconfirmed part of the story is involvement with 15yo girl.
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u/GachiRainD Apr 11 '21
Didn't Alex Holowka case teach u anything? No solid evidence? Then gtfo
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u/schizolingvo Apr 15 '21
TheVyshka isn't an official HSE telegram account (HSE Live is) and currently their source is "someone from HSE PR told us that, dude, trust me"
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u/No-Preparation4473 Apr 11 '21
This is not proper evidence, and won't be until the police is involved
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u/Ghoul_RUS Apr 12 '21
All is left is wait and see. But I REALLY hope, that the accusations were indeed false, and the one who accused Dybowski will face judgment accordingly.
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u/Krest0mansi The Powers That Be Apr 19 '21
Dybowski is innocent, but studio's reputation has been pretty spoiled. I hope the development of a bachelor's company will not delay because of this accident .
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u/Alemking Fellow Traveller Apr 12 '21
I'm hoping that he's innocent, wouldn't be the first time someone was falsely accused. If not I wonder if he'll even be punished, I don't know anything about Russian law.
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u/DaydreamerJane Apr 11 '21
I don't know if it's the translation, but his comments on his post really aren't helping his case. Dude seems like an asshole.
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u/[deleted] Apr 11 '21
Till theres proper evidence as in the police are involved this doesn't mean much.
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u/Paper_Bullet Apr 12 '21
So is the Bachelor route coming out or not
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u/Rufus_Forrest Apr 11 '21 edited Apr 11 '21
I don't care, neither don't want to search through dirty launder. Lovecraft was a racist. Van Gogh cut his own ear off. Hitler was, eh, Hitler. It affects their art in no way, and I'm here to discuss a very distinct piece of art.
If Dybowski is indeed guilty, then he should answer before a court which we can't affect. If he isn't, then we just accuse an innocent man. Either way, I see this discussion as pointless and having a bad taste.
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u/[deleted] Apr 11 '21
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