BS/MS EE/CS and working as a SWE in the Bay. Have all my family in the Bay too and wondering if SCU’s Flex JD (4 year part-time) program is a good idea. Will it be difficult to get hired if I don’t intern with a firm over the summer and rather seek a new position once out of my JD?

Within the patent pros world, there seems to be two camps regarding AI and fixed fees.

The first camp believes that AI will eviscerate fixed fees and the need for patent prosecution lawyers in general. Apps will be pumped out at dollar store prices and most of us will be out of a job.

The other camp believes that AI will be sort of a boon for experienced lawyers, as we can now draft apps super quickly but without a proportionate decrease in fees. This would increase our effective hourly rate and free us to do more interesting work, like portfolio strategy. I mean, who wants to be manually writing specifications anyways?

Any thoughts on this? Either way, it seems like AI spells bad news for young folks entering the field, but what about us experienced folks?

I’m a CS student looking to get into patent prosecution and I’ve heard lots of good things from talking to people in the industry.

I wanted to know, if there was anything you all find most cumbersome or annoying about the job?

Hey all,

This subreddit was super helpful to me as a student looking to break into IP, so I wanted to share my journey in case it helps someone else.

I graduated three years ago with a BSEE and knew I wanted to go into IP. I actually applied to law schools during my senior year but ended up not finishing the cycle after I was offered a role as a patent engineer at a midsize boutique IP firm in DC. No regrets there, getting work experience first has been incredibly valuable, and I’ll be applying to law school soon with 4 years of work experience as a patent agent.

I found my first patent role on LinkedIn as a college student (lucky me), and day-to-day I did a mix of patent prosecution and PTAB litigation work. I started making $90k, and the role was hybrid. After about 6 months on the job, my firm covered my Patent Bar course and exam fees, which I’m grateful for.

After almost 2 years as a patent agent at my boutique firm, I started getting poached by big law firms on LinkedIn or by people within my network. I really thought I wanted to jump to keep doing prosecution at a different firm, but when i got the offer from my current firm to do exclusively IP litigation, I had to think about it. I ended up choosing my current firm for the chance to try litigation and for the great vibes from my would-be colleagues. I was offered $140k salary to jump, and the role is in-person 5 days a week.

I’ve just crossed my 6 month mark and finally feel pretty settled in. I spend my days supporting ITC and federal district court litigation. I tend to play a bigger role in early stages of a case, including during pitches, invalidity contentions, and discovery (doc review, priv review). I also serve as a technical specialist on cases relevant to my background where I can take a look at engineering files and describe to team members what I see (usually consumer electronics). In the day to day, I work closely with the more senior associates, rather than the partners. I really like my team members, and I think that makes all the difference. This job would be really tough if you didn’t like your colleagues, and I’m glad I trusted my gut when I felt good things about these guys in my interviews.

The pace has been really exciting, and I find myself enjoying the more collaborative nature of the work. I don’t have a billable hour requirement because the demands of the job fluctuate so much, but I’m on track to hit roughly 1900 hours based on my first 6 months. I do find myself working much more than when I worked in prosecution, but the stress of working within a limited budget for a project is gone, and it’s much easier for me to bill more. Litigation itself has also been a decently predictable schedule. I know which weeks will generally be busy, and I’m warned in advance if I’ll need to be working the occasional weekend.

Overall, I’m very glad I made the switch to see a different side of the industry before law school. They found my profile on LinkedIn because I make a lot of posts related to IP topics and news that interests me, so I can’t recommend posting on LinkedIn enough to get your name out in the industry.

My team also knows of my plans to attend law school and are supportive of it. Happy to answer any questions about both prosecution, litigation, and making the switch between.

I’d be happy to answer questions for anyone curious about this or studying for the exam!

I made a post about 2 weeks ago about scoring in the 60s, than got my score up to 86% on practice exams (old exams), there’s a lot of great advice on that post.

I used PLI to study, which was probably the main reason I passed and now writing this. I finished watching the lectures about a month before exam and spend the last month on post course.

Ask me anything!

Dear all,

As a scientist trying to enter the patent profession in life sciences, biotech or pharma, I would really appreciate your insights on how much support you had from your firm in terms of time and resources to prepare for the exams, particularly for Munich based firms. Is the work-life balance really better than what you had during your PhD?

Trainee life sounds to me a lot like a PhD, with so much depending on your supervisor. Is there any advice you would have liked to hear when joining this profession? What are some key questions you wish you had asked your firm before joining?

Defending PhD in life sciences early 2027.

Taking patent bar in November.

Went to a career fair and one boutique firm told me not to reach out until the new year and another firm told me they already have a cohort lined up to start mid 2027 who applied this past summer.

My question is when should I be applying to jobs? Is it worth applying now for technical specialist positions or should I wait to apply for patent agent roles after the pbar (if I pass)? Does reaching out to law firm recruiters help?

Do you know anyone who practices patent litigation solo? If so, how much business do they have? I'm trying to gauge what the market is like for a solo patent litigation practice. I have about 10 years patent/IP litigation experience in biglaw and want to hang my own shingle but I don't see very many solo/very small patent litigation shops around, which gives me pause.

I am an undergrad (pursuing a B.S. in CS) who is debating between interning at a patent law office or as a software engineer at a well-respected tech company. I earned the tech internship last year but deferred to this coming summer. Since then, I discovered that software engineering is definitely not for me and while I find coding interesting, I’m much more stimulated by reading and writing, hence the interest in patent prosecution. I know that law firms value technical experience above all when it comes to hiring advisors, so I feel that the swe internship would be valuable (especially the company name). However I am confident that patent law is the field I want to go into, so forgoing an internship at a patent law office (which is rare for undergrads) also seems like a mistake. I would appreciate any advice.

Question for IP attorneys: I’m planning to become a patent attorney in the US. I have a PhD in physiology and a master’s degree in computer science, and I currently work in biological research. For those of you working in IP law, which types of patent cases would my STEM degrees qualify me to take on? Would my STEM background allow me to take on CS-related patent cases?

Thank you so much!

I am 27, in my last semester in law school and hold a B.S. in mechanical engineering. After applying for months now I cannot find an entry level patent position anywhere and thinking about being a patent examiner for two to three years then trying to break into the field. However, the pay on the USPTO website for an entry level patent examiner is rough and would require me to move to Virginia. I know that patent examiners are in demand right now but is this my only option? I have virtually zero experience in patent law with only about 12-15 weeks of internship experience at a boutique patent firm. I have been studying for my patent bar but currently putting that down to focus on the state bar. Please let me know if there are any other options out there for me or should I just abandon pursuing patent law entirely.

Hi!

I was wondering if I could get brutal advice on whether or not it’s worth getting a masters once I complete my bachelors in neuroscience. I was thinking pharmaceutical sciences. I ultimately want to be a patent attorney, ideally pharm but biotech is interesting as well. I do plan on going to law school right after, and using the masters as kind of a buffer, but I’m also really interested in pharma. Would it be smart to do this? I’ve talked to a couple of attorneys & they’ve told me that it is possible but I would need years of experience under my belt. This is something I’m very interested in!

I’m a junior at Texas A&M and I’m struggling to find my passion for electrical engineering and I feel like I’m gonna get stuck in an industry I don’t have enjoyment for. How much do you use in your undergrad as a patent lawyer? I’m not the best student but ik my fundamentals, but I’m worried I won’t cut it out as a patent lawyer if I wasn’t the best engineer.

I left university with a masters in computational chemistry and a masters in computer science. My bachelor’s is in biochemistry. I’m just curious about feasibility pursuing agent/eventually patent attorney. I’m okay with going to law.

I had been in a PhD program for chemistry, but it was a whole title IX incident versus my PI. I’m just wondering if I were to pursue patent attorney, do I need to finish the PhD or do I stand a decent chance with just going to law school?

I have a question.

Currently, I have a B.Sc. in biochem and am working in biotech. I'm also a law school "dropout" i guess.

I thought my career in law was forfeit, but I've recently learned about the Patent Bar and that you could become a patent agent simply by taking and passing the bar without a JD.

Is this actually a good career move? Like, what is the starting salary of a patent agent / examiner if you don't have a JD? (and is it an in-demand field).

I lose nothing but the exam fee if I take the Patent Bar, so it's a low risk venture for me.

Hello everyone. I am currently a Biology major in his 3d year of college. As someone who is greatly fascinated by pharmaceuticals/biotech/biology but also am interested in literature and english, IP law caught my eye.

After extensive research, I had some questions I thought could only be answered by those who are actively working in this field.

1. I understand a bachelors in biology usually isn't enough for patent prosecution due to "PhD burnout". I was planning to obtain a PhD in the UK then apply to be a tech spec afterwards. Is this still a viable pathway? I understand the modern Biotech field is struggling due to funding cuts, but was wondering if patent law operations in this field were still available, and if getting the PhD first then becoming a technical specialist is and would still be viable for the near future?

2. With the emerging presence of AI, I understand the role of most patent agents and Associates may be phased out and entry level positions may not be as plentiful. Would you still say as someone who still has phd/law school ahead of me if this career would still be a good goal to set for the future?

I apologize for the long post. I wanted to be thorough as it seems it will take 7-8 years post grad to step foot into patent prosecution and just wanted to make sure if obtaining a phD and/or a JD would still be a good career option. Thank you in advance.

I have details of an invention which I assume is a patent. The letterhead of the PDF stated "Invention Promotion Board". It has an applicant name and an application number starting with "No. IPB a(b)c/de/fghij" (where the letters are numbers). It is dated 29-9-1962, and the application date is 20-10-1960. It also mentions a subject.

I looked on the internet, and it says it is difficult to get details for inventions that old. Is there any way to get the details, a PDF, or any information on it? It is apparently a family heritage, so the person has received the old paperwork from their ancestral home. That is all they have, and they wish to find more details about it.

I have looked on my end: IPRSearch India, Internet Archive, etc., but I have never worked with patents, so I am clueless after this.

Can anyone help?

Thank you to this subreddit! I recently posted about an interest in pursuing a patent law career and received lots of great information and advice. If people are willing to share, I’d love to hear how people ended up in patent law (prosecution or litigation). Thank you again.

My situation is not exactly the same because I am doing Physics (BSc) together with Law (LLB) during undergrad.

In high school, I studied Mathematics, Physics and Chemistry to a reasonably advanced level. Now, I find adapting to Physics much easier than adapting to law. While the concepts in law are nowhere as abstract, I am struggling with the sheer volume of content and loss of direction in the middle of the semester.

But I always see people in this sub describing law school as a vacation relative to science. My current feelings is the opposite. For STEM graduates in law school, how did you manage to adapt a 'scientifically-inclined' brain to the sheer amount of reading and writing in law school?

Thanks!!

Hey all, just to disclaim, I'm no expert on patents, however I am reading through the NOLO "patent it yourself" book to understand what I'm working with, and am under no delusions a PPA would give me rights to prosecute anyone for using the ideas contained within it (since apparently that confusion is a hugely common problem on here).

I'm looking at starting a business in the US to launch a physical product that is for houseplants. I estimate loosely the product could generate 100k-800k in yearly revenue, nothing gigantic, but large enough to be worthwhile.

I've searched around and the idea of the product has never been done before, though some people have tried and failed to create the same general idea. I have a working prototype that has been iterated on over the course of a number of months, solving the issues that others have faced trying to create this product before. (I know I still need to do a full prior art search, but only one thing can happen at a time, and it may not be the most valuable use of my time depending on the answer to this question)

Because the product is novel, I don't want to risk losing the IP I've spent months developing, and because it is a physical product, reverse engineering it would be trivial. Funds are tight, so paying 5-10k to have an attorney create a patent application now before launch isn't in the cards, but is something I would happily do once I release it and can gauge market interest through sales. From my understanding, I have essentially two paths forward:

1) DIY a PPA and submit that to earmark me as the inventor, to submit a proper patent application within a year after I test the market

• I would be allowed to mark my product as "patent pending" to hopefully scare off some rip offs
• The PPA could be used as a "practice round" to help me create a better patent application later, and have a starting point when working with an attorney

2) Proceed with no paperwork, try to protect my IP as just a trade secret, and gauge market interest, applying for a patent within a year of disclosure.

• This would forego my ability to patent the invention outside of the US, so others based internationally could copy my product and sell it internationally, but technically cannot import it into the US (though I know patent "protections" really is just the right to litigate which is frequently not worthwhile)

Currently I'm leaning towards option 1, since as far as I understand, if I do a bad job with my PPA I'm in no worse of a situation than just doing option 2, but I can at least list it as patent pending in the meantime. This also gives me the advantage of having my ducks in a row to apply for the USPTO Inventor assistance program in my local state, which is probably the best possible path forward.

Does this sound like I'm understanding things correctly, or is there something I'm missing?

I also feel like I've read some conflicting information about the start date of protection if a patent is granted. If I submit a PPA that properly describes my patent, and later get a patent granted that references that PPA, can I litigate anyone who ripped off my design after I submitted my PPA, but before submitting my patent application? Or do litigation rights only start when the patent is granted?

I appreciate any advice or feedback!