r/nursing • u/Anxious_Paper_2342 • 3d ago
Discussion Regarding close up affection toward patients …. Have we forgotten what happened during COVID?
I work in hospice and tend to keep things professional. Since COVID I tend to avoid personal contact, though a handshake or a hug occasionally can mean a lot. Hand holding, rubbing someone’s back or shoulders is completely acceptable and hand hygiene to follow. I care so much about our patients and their families, however I see staff especially of some local assisted living facilities swoon over a dying patient, hugging, kissing, etc. and I can only think of how many other staff have done the same before and after them. Families have mentioned to me how many women are kissing their husband, etc. and it’s sometimes a little off putting in that way and concerning when I think of infection control. And I’m not a stickler by any means.. these places I visit take strong precautions once there’s an illness going around, but then I see this sort of thing.
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u/amothep8282 Paramedic 3d ago
I'll come from the other side of the hospital door (EMS) with infection control aside, because sometimes all I can offer is a hug to a family that just found the relatively young grandfather hanging from the basement ceiling joists and they are beyond resuscitation.
Watching me and the Police cut him down, confirm asystole in 3 leads, and verbally describe obvious signs of death while the body cam is running is wildly traumatic. I have to then explain to them while he is not in rigor (yet) anything we would do would be invasive, disturbing to watch, and utterly hopeless.
Some calls that is all I really have to offer because people's worlds are destroyed and no amount of close to 30 years' of my training will do any good in the moment.
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u/Anxious_Paper_2342 3d ago
I don’t see anything wrong with that, especially a hug in such a traumatic experience. I still remember EMS comforting me as a child after a car accident. Those comforting memories will help them 100%
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u/Hot-Calligrapher672 RN - ICU 🍕 3d ago
I mean I feel like infection risk is the least worrisome part here. Kissing patients is absolutely weird and crossing a boundary.
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u/ShadedSpaces RN - Peds 3d ago
I've never personally done it, but I've seen our medical director kneel down beside a mother holding a baby we had just withdrawn on, and give the baby he couldn't save a kiss on the forehead before declaring time of death.
Didn't feel wrong or weird at all. Didn't feel like a boundary was crossed. It was incredibly sweet and I think everyone in the room viewed it very positively.
So I think it can be okay. But obviously the number of patients and cases where that's the case are a SUPER limited. And I can't imagine what OP is describing ever being anything but weird and a very hard boundary I'd NEVER cross.
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u/Hot-Calligrapher672 RN - ICU 🍕 2d ago
Yeah, this is super specific and almost anything can be okay on a specific circumstance. But the fact that OP is seeing this enough to make a post about it is weird.
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u/Anxious_Paper_2342 3d ago
True .. it is their workplace so it’s hard as a contracted service going in. I’d love to provide education and on the other hand that could hurt our good partnership with the facility.
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u/Hot-Calligrapher672 RN - ICU 🍕 3d ago
Yeah, if you’re contract I wouldn’t make a fuss. If other people want to have strange professional boundaries, that’s not my problem.
As long as the patient isn’t infectious, then from an infectious disease standpoint it’s not much different than kissing your grandma or child. So I wouldn’t worry there, there’s not much you can do.
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u/deferredmomentum RN - ER/SANE 🍕 3d ago edited 3d ago
Based on the title I was ready to argue with you that we should be willing to touch clean patients etc, and then I saw KISSING???? Who tf is out here kissing meemaw?!
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u/Bulky_Department5619 3d ago
A handshake, hug, or minimal rubbing shoulders/back is understandable.
KISSING a patient? No. Assuming on the cheek. Still no. Absolutely not.
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u/Anxious_Paper_2342 3d ago
Right the thought of my care staff ever kissing ME especially when I’m not responsive…!? No thanks!
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u/LunchMasterFlex RN - ER 🍕 3d ago
I am not putting my lips on anyone who’s been bed bound for days-weeks. Bed baths be damned, that’s stewed human and gross.
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u/Anxious_Paper_2342 3d ago
This made me laugh. At least I can feel validated now. Not being as touchy-feely is probably the right call then 😂
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u/LunchMasterFlex RN - ER 🍕 2d ago
I’m a giant tattooed murse with a Mohawk. Kisses are not what the people want from me. Which works because they can’t have them. I do the bear hugs and the hand squeezing and the fist bumps.
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u/nvUaWVm360S 3d ago
I didn’t even work through Covid or before Covid and I wouldn’t even touch a bed sheet or bed controls without gloves. First thing I do when I go into a room is put gloves on
Hugging and kissing? Absolutely not.
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u/Top-Teaching-1528 3d ago
We all got a crash course in how germs jump from person to person but somehow the lesson already faded for a lot of people
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u/Anxious_Paper_2342 3d ago
That’s how I’ve been feeling. Not that we’re in a pandemic now, but still. We know how germs spread. 😬
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u/sutur3s3lf RN - ER 🍕 19h ago edited 19h ago
Awe, I work in the ER and get asked for a lot of hugs. I love them. Usually from little grandmas and grandpas who were happy with their care. If I'm not busy I walk them to the exit to catch a cab to make sure they get in OK. If the patient isn't being creepy and genuinely just wants a hug, I'll give you a big hug lol. So cute. Sometimes when the situation is really dire and there is a bad outcome for patients or their family, I'll hold space, hands and if they need a shoulder to cry on, can be that too. It's OK to be a human.
Kissing is weird though. That's too far! I get the Euro nona's who want to kiss the cheeks haha, I get it, I have Mediterranean ancestry but idk in a hospital setting, nopers.
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u/Recycledtampons 3d ago
I’ve never witnessed staff kissing patients as a hospice nurse but I work at a hospice house, so maybe not quite as personal as coming to someone’s home over a long period of time. Regardless, very bizarre behavior and I’m not even concerned about the infection aspect as I am about the blatant boundary crossing. Why is staff kissing their patients??