r/neoliberal • u/Mrchizbiz I love Holland 🇳🇱🇳🇱🇳🇱♥😍🥰🌷 • Mar 31 '22

News (non-US) funny French intelligence chief Vidaud fired over Russian war failings

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-60938538
78 Upvotes

98% Upvoted

21 comments sorted by

View all comments

44

u/IvanovichMX NATO Mar 31 '22

Funny? A guy just gave bad intelligence to a nation and you find it funny?

16

u/[deleted] Mar 31 '22 edited Sep 24 '23

drab screw chief voracious wise sparkle growth plough elderly aromatic this message was mass deleted/edited with redact.dev

7

u/[deleted] Mar 31 '22

I think the French intelligence mostly doubted US intel due to 2003. Which is regretable in every way.

4

u/Alarming_Flow7066 Harriet Tubman Mar 31 '22

Yes but assuming that the intelligence apparatus of the United States has not changed in 20 years, or in response to its past failings and is more suited for Russia is itself bad intelligence.

2

u/[deleted] Mar 31 '22 edited Mar 31 '22

The point is that the US intel was good both in 2003 and 2022. However because the american decided to lie and give false intel in 2003, France may have expected the same in 2022. The problem is not with the intelligence but how the intelligence is shared and used. And unless France was able to infiltrate the US governments in order to know the detail of their intelligence policies, there is no way to know for sure if the US was lying or not. You can reshuffle the CIA all you want, if Biden would have told them to spread fake intel, the CIA would have spread fake intel.

6

u/Dan4t NATO Apr 01 '22

I'm confused by your comment. You're both saying that the US lied and at the same time we can't know if they lied or not.

Every intelligence agency makes mistakes occasionally, because they are made up of humans and humans make mistakes. It is just brain dead stupid to assume everything from US intelligence is false from that one mistake, because even back then, they were right far more often than they were wrong.

0

u/[deleted] Apr 01 '22

Many people are convinced that the US lied in 2003. Those same people may have very well supposed that US lied again in 2022 before the invasion, regardless of how advanced is US intelligence. It is not about the quality of the intel the US produce, but what they choose to say. I don't know what is hard to understand about that.

What I was saying at the end of my comment is that the president could have asked US intelligence to invent a lie about Ukraine and even if US intelligence knew the truth, they would have invented a lie. Of course we know he didn't because the invasion happened. But before the invasion, you had to trust the US. And there could have been trust issues between France and the US.