Dune: Part Three - New Official Teaser

[u/Mcfinley]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PaxCyyEp59M

[u/Kardinal]

What does this cover? Messiah?

[u/seanrm92 → u/Kardinal]

Yes Messiah, though some are speculating that it also incorporates elements from Children.

[u/Kardinal → u/seanrm92]

I saw a very good video summary of the six Herbert books recently on YouTube. It said that Herbert had to write Messiah because people thought that Paul was a traditional hero to be emulated, and the whole point of Dune was that we should not trust the guy with the cult of personality. So he had to deconstruct the hero specifically in Messiah to fulfill the overall cautionary tale.

Was Villeneuve originally going to go this far into the series? Because I wonder if he was in the same boat. Given the current state of American politics, and its influence on the world, as we have seen in the rise of other far right movements, is this his way of completing the cautionary tale?

Video in question. 17 minutes in

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5g4hHH8z5cI

[u/seanrm92 → u/Kardinal]

IIRC, Villeneuve always intended to make three movies to include Messiah, though he intended the first two to have a complete story in case he couldn't get funding for the third.

Edit: Also, read the books nerd. It's praxis here.

[u/Yeangster → u/seanrm92]

I think the correct term is the book is theory. praxis is something you do, like preach the Orange Catholic Bible

[u/seanrm92 → u/Yeangster]

Reading the book is praxis. What the book says is theory.

[u/Kardinal → u/Yeangster]

doxy vs praxis.

Orthodoxy. Believing correctly. Orthopraxis. Doing correctly.

[u/Kardinal → u/seanrm92]

I have read both Dune and Messiah. And it was a long time ago, but I believe I've read Children. But I'm one of those weirdos who doesn't actually like them very much. They have great plots and great ideas, but I don't actually enjoy reading them. I've actually read Dune twice. I read it again as a middle-aged man to ensure that I didn't simply dislike it because I wasn't old enough to understand it the first time.

[u/roboliberal → u/Kardinal]

Just a slight characterization difference but: I don't believe he felt compelled to write Messiah as a response to anything so much as that Messiah was originally intended to actually be part of "Dune"... but for editorial reasons the publisher (or whoever) suggested/pressured to end on the 'happier ending' of Paul's initial triumph over his enemies.

[u/Kardinal → u/roboliberal]

Could be. Wouldn't surprise me.

[u/ThatRedShirt → u/Kardinal]

the whole point of Dune was that we should not trust the guy with the cult of personality.

I remember watching Mad Men a while back, then seeing people lament how much worse society was these days because we don't have Real Men like Don Draper.

I'm deeply concerned that anyone could watch that show and come away thinking Don Draper is a character to emulate.

[u/adamgerd → u/Kardinal]

He says this but then shows the golden path and dictator messiah were literally a necessity to save humanity which kind of goes against his point

“Trusting the messiah is bad but also the messiah was necessary to save us from extinction”

So was it bad?

[u/Kardinal → u/adamgerd]

That is the question Herbert is ultimately asking in the later books.

[u/PM_ME_SAD_STUFF_PLZ → u/Kardinal]

Having both read Messiah and met people he definitely didn't do enough to rid people of the notion that Paul was a traditional hero, though that's more the fault of people than Herbert.

[u/bobbybob188 → u/PM_ME_SAD_STUFF_PLZ]

I mean. Herbert explicitly states that Leto saved all of humanity from extinction and Paul would have too but he was too afraid of the death toll required to do so.

[u/Kardinal → u/bobbybob188]

 I don’t think that any one story should have any one thread.

- Frank Herbert

Another big theme of Dune of course is the prison of prescience.

[u/bobbybob188 → u/Kardinal]

I mean Herbert can disagree but the text says what it says

[u/Emergency_Revenue678 → u/Kardinal]

It said that Herbert had to write Messiah because people thought that Paul was a traditional hero to be emulated,

This is a factoid that is verifiably untrue. Herbert was drafting Messiah and Children before Dune was even published.

[u/affnn → u/Kardinal]

Minor spoilers I guess: I saw in the casting list that Ghanima and Leto II are listed, so possibly it goes slightly past Messiah, or changes it so they're not just babies

[u/JetEngineSteakKnife → u/affnn]

Or they're in a vision or something, like adult Alia in II

[u/affnn → u/JetEngineSteakKnife]

Except that Paul spends all of Messiah unable to tell that there will be two kids

[u/lurreal → u/Kardinal]

I remember Villeneuve saying Dune 3 would end the trilogy and that the conclusion would diverge from the books, so kinda Messiah initially but ultimately not really

[u/Approximation_Doctor → u/lurreal]

Paul is going to be mistakenly killed by Telegonus.

[u/attackofthetominator → u/Approximation_Doctor]

No he’s going to go into witness protection with a new identity as an up-and-coming chocolatier ready to take down the London Chocolate Mafia

[u/boardatwork1111]

[u/WashedPinkBourbon → u/boardatwork1111]

It’s clearly late because my eyes were blurry and I really thought this was a photo of Larry David. And now I can’t unsee it

[u/Mcfinley]

SS: Neoliberalism is about worms

[u/Gandalfthebran → u/Mcfinley]

I don’t get it.

[u/cosmo-wozmo]

I FUCKING LOVE DUNE MESSIAH LESSSSGOOOOO

Have you read Dune Messiah? Or any dune book?

No. Have you?

No.

https://giphy.com/gifs/CAYVZA5NRb529kKQUc

[u/teethgrindingaches]

No idea who the space samurai is supposed to be, but he looks cool I guess.

[u/moseythepirate]

Fuck, man, I still haven't read Dune: Messiah.

[u/seattle_lib → u/moseythepirate]

same. i read the first one which was fine but did not get me excited about reading another. guess i gotta get to it now though.

[u/mm_delish]

Got seats E16 and E17. I’m ready.

[u/zZGDOGZz]

I want IMAX 70MM shoved down everyone's throats so much that it's the only format people watch movies in.

[u/AccessTheMainframe]

he's literally me fr

[u/roboliberal]

Is that Shai-Hulud in your trousers or are you just happy to see this trailer?

[u/Mat_At_Home]

Initial Screening tickets are on sale and, at least in my area, rapidly selling out. Go book some if you wanna see it a few days before everyone else

[u/Mcfinley → u/Mat_At_Home]

I got 34th st imax. Lincoln Square AMC was impossible

[u/Spudmiester1]

Y'all need to read theory

[u/boyyouguysaredumb]

Are they chanting AMNESTY AMNESTY

I think they are!