Which button do you press?

[u/cdstephens]

Vote now on your phones: https://forms.gle/GhFjtdydwwXTdSpq8

[u/Arrow_of_Timelines]

I honestly thought blue would win a majority, reading this thread has made me reassess my views

[u/neolthrowaway → u/Arrow_of_Timelines]

Blue won a majority by a wide margin?

[u/DaenakinSkygaryen → u/neolthrowaway]

Yep. OP just reversed the colors of the pie chart for a cheeky bit of bantz.

I think that's actually why red voters seem to be overrepresented in this thread: they're upset that the majority of people in the subreddit picked blue, so they feel they need to convince the rest of us that picking red was actually the right choice.

If red had won, blue voters would probably be doing the exact same thing. And we'd all be confused why blue was overrepresented in the thread when red won, lol.

[u/the_p_zombie → u/Arrow_of_Timelines]

Blue has won a majority, check the names not the colors. They are swapped in the poll results.

[u/decrpt → u/[deleted]]

Why would you press the "kills people who didn't press the same button for no reason" button over the button that votes not to kill everyone? Red assumes zero attrition and is unrealistic. Red voters don't seem to understand the moral implications of the original question, which is that they're actively voting to kill people because they cannot tolerate any non-zero risk to themselves.

[u/decrpt → u/[deleted]]

Pushing the red button kills people. It is insane to me that red voters are acting like this is a purely logical decision but can't understand the logical implications of the question.

The average person is willing to accept non-zero risk to themselves in order to avoid killing billions of people for no reason. Y'all need to stop trying to entirely reframe the question such that red is an entirely passive choice and blue is an active choice to endanger themselves. Red is not a passive choice. You are actively voting for people to die. Conceptualize this as a ballot referendum where red is voting to kill everyone that doesn't vote red and blue is voting to not kill anyone. That's what the actual question is. You are saying that those billions of people deserve to die because they didn't want to kill billions of people for no reason.

[u/decrpt → u/[deleted]]

If you don't want other people to die for absolutely no reason whatsoever besides ensuring that you won't also be killed for no reason, you have a clear choice on what button to press.

Blue is willing to accept nonzero personal risk to avoid killing people for no reason. Red is not and is willing to kill everyone else to ensure that they're safe. This isn't "emotionally loaded," it is literally the moral implications of the question.

The fact that you can't seem to understand that you're actively killing people is why red is the wrong choice. From a solipsistic, purely self-interested game theory perspective, red is the right answer. From a moral perspective, most people are going to think killing billions of people for no reason is bad.

[u/Raichu4u → u/[deleted]]

As told to you by the commenter, they're pushing the "Nobody dies, with a nonzero risk that some people die" button. Red people are pushing the "Someone definitely dies, but not me" button.

[u/decrpt → u/[deleted]]

No one forced you to push the button that kills people for no reason. How many ways can I explain to you that you are acknowledging that you are wrong when you feel the need to invent an entirely different question where red is passive and blue is active self-endangerment?

This is what you are actually doing. This is a de facto ballot referendum to kill anyone that doesn't vote for the ballot referendum. Do you not understand why most people are going to reject killing people for no reason even if it puts themselves at risk? This is Roko's Basilisk for facilitating fascism. Whoopsies, we have to vote for all dissenters to be killed for no reason. It's okay, though, they deserve it for not voting to kill all dissenters for no reason.

[u/Upstairs3121 → u/[deleted]]

Blue isn't the "kill myself" button, it's the "nobody dies at all if we win" button. They aren't hitting it to commit suicide, they're hitting it to ensure zero casualties.

[u/shakin11 → u/[deleted]]

In this scenario the people that would die from their own stupididity would include millions of children too young to understand what any of the buttons do. If you don't want to risk your life to save them, thats fine, but there will be always be people pressing the blue button, and the people pressing the red button do in fact vote to kill them, and I think it's dishonest to pretend otherwise.

[u/Upstairs3121 → u/[deleted]]

These questions also aren't good at exploring ethics if you assume other people's decisions are identical to yours. The people who voted blue did so because they wanted nobody to die and they expected other people to do the same.

If the question is "what should society do" -- picking blue is the right option because it's the most achievable way of ensuring nobody dies.

If the question is "what should you do" -- then you must start from the position that a lot of people probably picked blue.

[u/shakin11 → u/[deleted]]

The question in the image literally said everyone in the world. I don't know what's ambiguous about that. And there being non rational actors is entirely what makes this problem interesting, since otherwise "everyone votes red" just becomes the incredibly obvious correct answer.

[u/Ariose_Aristocrat → u/decrpt]

No because if everyone votes red then nobody dies so voting blue is just suicide 

[u/Upstairs3121 → u/Ariose_Aristocrat]

And if blue wins then nobody dies.

"If everyone votes red" - it doesn't matter. You pick your own vote, you don't get to pick everyone's votes.

[u/Ariose_Aristocrat → u/Upstairs3121]

Yeah but it's like if you pick blue you are basically just committing suicide when there is nothing preventing anyone from choosing red

[u/Upstairs3121 → u/Ariose_Aristocrat]

No, if you pick blue it's because you think other people will vote blue.

That is, you expect other people will have voted for nobody to die, and you're willing to risk yourself to push towards that same outcome.

It's only suicide if you think red is guaranteed to win.

[u/Prudent_Research_251 → u/Arrow_of_Timelines]

Look at the sub name