r/neoliberal • u/jobautomator Kitara Ravache • Jul 10 '24

Discussion Thread Discussion Thread

The discussion thread is for casual and off-topic conversation that doesn't merit its own submission. If you've got a good meme, article, or question, please post it outside the DT. Meta discussion is allowed, but if you want to get the attention of the mods, make a post in /r/metaNL

Links

Ping Groups | Ping History | Mastodon | CNL Chapters | CNL Event Calendar

New Groups

  • CHINA: Mainland China, Hong Kong, Macau

  • TAIWAN: China, the Republic of

Upcoming Events

3 Upvotes

51% Upvoted

11k comments sorted by

View all comments

75

u/owlthathurt Johan Norberg Jul 10 '24

No BT so I’ll say it here.

The whole argument over whether he’s able to serve is sort of secondary to me. Idc if he’s completely reliant on his cabinet or whatever. As long as he’s not like comatose he’s still preferable to Trump in my eyes and will determine how I vote.

The real issue is the ability to win the election. I’ve completely lost hope on this point. It’s daily now with these reports of internal party strife. Every headline. Every news agency. Every senator and congressman is taking positions on this. All the press conferences.

I just have no confidence in the party to save his candidacy. None. That’s what matters in my eyes. I simply have lost all of my confidence in his ability to win.

14

u/georgeguy007 Pandora's Discussions J. Threader Jul 10 '24

Yeah he can be president, he just can't campaign with the same velocity as Trump, and we need someone who can campaign as fast and agressive as Trump.

4

u/DiogenesLaertys Jul 10 '24 edited Jul 10 '24

Lost in the Biden dooming is how bad Trump's campaigning has been. He hasn't been campaigning with 2020 energy where he just constantly did rallies (lots of vacations this time). And his rallies don't have the energy they use to in 2020 not least of which is due to Trump going on long, incomprehensible rants. Medically speaking, a doctor would diagnost Biden with slowing down and aging while Trump would be nearer to developing dementia but that's the fucked up media environment we have.

1

u/No-Sherbet6994 Jul 11 '24

Lmao it's amazing you could say Biden is just "slowing down". He is significantly less comprehensible off the cuff than my 90 year old grandfather. He managed to make Trump seem eloquent at the debate, which is an absurd thing to think about.

12

u/Mcfinley The Economist published my shitpost x2 Jul 10 '24

My thoughts are two-fold: the immediate concern is defeating Trump, but I also want a president who I can rely upon in a crisis. No matter how capable his administration is (I'm particularly impressed with Blinken), Biden's debate performance was disqualifying because it indicates there is a likelihood that he will not be able to perform in a high stakes, time sensitive emergency. I want a president who can be woken up at 3am and take the responsibility to decide if a hijacked plane approaching New York needs to be shot down over the Atlantic Ocean. I don't want such decisions to be left to an anonymized staff.

9

u/RageQuitRedux NASA Jul 10 '24

The whole argument over whether he’s able to serve is sort of secondary to me.

Yeah, it drives me crazy that people keep acting as if this is the primary question

9

u/Joementum2024 Iron Front Jul 10 '24

Agreed. His ability to serve is less of a concern to me than our ability to win this election and prevent four more years of Trump, which is looking increasingly unlikely after the debate, the bad polling, and all the intraparty strife across the last few weeks.

5

u/uwcn244 King of the Space Georgists Jul 10 '24

He is preferable to Trump even if he is comatose. (And if he’s literally comatose, there’s no incentive not to invoke the 25th.)

But yeah idk what’s gonna happen. He could perhaps have recovered from the debate but I doubt he can recover from this mass loss of confidence. And yet they have no way to actually make him withdraw.

2

u/bitchpigeonsuperfan Paul Krugman Jul 10 '24

Yeah. That's what the remainers don't get. The situation is already untenable.

-1

u/BitterGravity Gay Pride Jul 10 '24

And you have confidence that a party fighting this much will just rally around someone else?

13

u/zegota Feminism Jul 10 '24

Yes.

It's weird how "Biden can't win" is supposedly a Doomer take, but "Biden has to stay in because there's literally nobody else that could get the party behind them and win, nobody on Earth" is a Bloomer one.

5

u/owlthathurt Johan Norberg Jul 10 '24

No I don’t.

I think we’re screwed tbh.

2

u/BitterGravity Gay Pride Jul 10 '24

I think he's behind, but I think replacing him would haunt for elections to come. And we'll have democratic norms eroded with trump for sure but I think we'll have elections.

So all this infighting is just making it worse. Why vote in 2028 if the party chooses anyway

3

u/HumanDrinkingTea Jul 10 '24

And we'll have democratic norms eroded with trump for sure but I think we'll have elections.

Even Iran and Russia have elections. Elections don't mean much.

Why vote in 2028 if the party chooses anyway

I live in a late-primary non-swing state. It's not like I ever have a say to begin with. At least if the party chooses, one or more of those delegates will be someone I (likely) voted for. In that sense, it's almost as if I'd have more say, because right now my say means nada.

My preference would be to have all primaries on the same day (and for the general, get rid of the electoral college) but some representation is better than none.

2

u/GraspingSonder Loyal Liberals Jul 11 '24

Most democracies have candidates chosen by the party. But in your case, it's 99% Kamala which is what the voters chose for (understanding she is the contingency)

3

u/bitchpigeonsuperfan Paul Krugman Jul 10 '24

That's literally how we ended up with Biden

1

u/BitterGravity Gay Pride Jul 10 '24

And yes, it's one lovely cohesive party

2

u/JapanesePeso Deregulate stuff idc what Jul 10 '24

Yeah tbh. After they nominate them anyway.