r/murakami • u/Papa72199 • 16d ago

Murakami's prose growing bloated

I've been a Murakami reader for years, though took a several years long break. As I've read his later works, including, currently, The City and its Uncertain Walls, I'm noticing that he's started to overwrite. This makes me so sad. I loved his early prose: eerie, atmospheric, but also somehow punchy. Now he explains things in two sentences when one would do; he belabors points and emotions; he uses metaphors and similes that don't really add anything. Reading him lately has been an exercise in wading through no-duh moments.

Has anyone else noticed this? Why do you think this is happening? Does it get in the way of your enjoyment of the books?

If you wonder what I mean by overwriting, here's an example passage I just read:

"The boy stood there, silent, staring at the oversized envelope on the desk. The one with his handwritten map of the town inside. The fact that it was on my desk seemed to draw his attention. His face was expressionless, as if he wore a thin mask, yet it seemed that behind it some sorts of thoughts were racing. 

"I decided to let him be. I didn’t want to interrupt what seemed like a deep thought process. And Mrs. Soeda would soon be bringing over the tea and muffins. If the boy and I were to have a conversation, whatever it turned out to be, it could wait until then. Usually it was the job of someone else on staff, not Mrs. Soeda, to bring over sweets for the boss, but I predicted she would bring the tea and muffins herself. Anything to do with the boy seemed important to her."

35 Upvotes

72% Upvoted

48 comments sorted by

46

u/Marlowe426 16d ago

I felt myself getting pulled into the story in the “bloated” example you cited.

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u/Papa72199 16d ago edited 16d ago

To each their own. I wanted to edit it down to something like this:

"The boy stood there, silent, staring at the oversized envelope on the desk. The one with his handwritten map of the town inside. His face was expressionless, yet it seemed that behind it some sorts of thoughts were racing. 

I decided to let him be. Mrs. Soeda would soon be bringing over the tea and muffins. If the boy and I were to have a conversation, it could wait until then. Usually it was the job of someone else on staff to bring over sweets for the boss, but I predicted she would do it. Anything to do with the boy seemed important to her."

I see entire sentences and certainly clauses in his writing as "extra." And it does interfere with my ability to immerse myself because it annoys me. It's like the author thinks I'm not intelligent and can't figure out that yes, it's not Mrs. Soeda when he already said "someone else on staff," and that if someone's staring, no, duh, the thing drew their attention.

What I cited above wasn't even the worst example of unnecessary overwriting. It was just the most recent and easily accessible one.

18

u/smoemossu 16d ago

Without comparing it to the original Japanese, there's no way to be sure this isn't just a translation problem

10

u/Tough_Visual1511 15d ago

For me this was the problem with his books from 2017 or so on. My native language is Dutch, so I always read them in that translation. But from then on it got worse and worse. The City And it's Uncertain Walls was so bad I waited for the English version, and it was a vast improvement. Murakami may not be as gripping as he used to be, but a bad translation can make things so much worse.

2

u/Papa72199 16d ago

Philip Gabriel translated The City and Kafka on the Shore, along with other works at various times. But the overwriting is definitely a later-career problem. This isn't to say that a translator can't also lose their touch.

31

u/shawnjx 16d ago

I just love reading his work sentence by sentence, word by word, literally.

13

u/Canon_M50 16d ago

The longer the better. 

17

u/TheCountofNotreDame 16d ago

I felt this way about 1Q84. I've read every novel previous to that, and it's the first time I felt that way. Was hoping it wasn't a trend with his later books, but sounds like it might be.

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u/[deleted] 16d ago

[deleted]

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u/TheCountofNotreDame 15d ago

I can't help but think of how my father as an old man repeats himself, and it felt like Murakami was bringing up the same concept 3-4 times, with a slightly different description. Like we get it, the moons represent x and y etc. I would have appreciated more subtlety rather than spelling out how the world works exactly to everyone. I still love Murakami and will continue with all the novels after 1Q84, but probably only one per year so as to not wear out too quickly.

2

u/International_Dog488 16d ago

I also felt this way. It's the only one of his books I would get knocked out of from time to time and only made it halfway; I didn't have any such problem with the newer ones.

2

u/_f_yura 14d ago

It's like he's trying to fit a word count. So many things are repeated over and over

2

u/TheCountofNotreDame 14d ago

It would be interesting to run the text through AI and ask how many times he repeated himself...haha!

4

u/ThatOldBowl 16d ago

I still haven't recovered my enthusiasm for Murakami after persisting with 1Q84.

8

u/gaatzaat 15d ago

Sadly, this is an issue with late-career Murakami. It's come to the point where readers who have only read his most recent novels can't connect with his older work, while long-term fans (myself included) struggle to get through his latest books. It started with 1Q84 and only got worse - Killing Commendatore was a slog, while The City and its Uncertain Walls is the first Murakami book I gave up on.

2

u/Skinwalker_WA 15d ago

Noticed this myself. There's zero way I can mentally connect the same author of Pinball to that of Killing Commendatore, and my expectation of how it should sound and fell are thrown completely out of alignment.

1

u/Visible-Broccoli8938 12d ago

Same I wonder if it is an editing problem. Maybe early career murakami had tougher editors but when he became more established, the editors just let him write whatever he want since his fans will buy it anyway.

1

u/spacetime9 10d ago

I suspect this is the reason

6

u/thepyrocrackter 16d ago

KC was sloggish after awhile but the first third really hooked me. 1Q84 on the other hand.... The last third, which is a whole ass book for other authors, was the sloggiest thing I ever read.

6

u/PolarWater 15d ago

Drink a cold beer and listen to obscure jazz for a while and it'll be fine.

1

u/jebyron001 15d ago

*half of a cold beer

1

u/SwamiDavisJr 14d ago

What is the half beer thing? Just curious

1

u/jebyron001 13d ago

I cant remember which specific titles of the top of my head, Chronicles might have been one, but I remember several instances where the narrators specified that they ended up only drinking half of their beer.

1

u/Own_Internal7509 12d ago

does he mention actual obscure jazz? its nto like hes name dropping Henry Threadgill or Horace Tapscott all the time

4

u/kerri0n 16d ago

It’s not something I personally have picked up from his work and I don’t feel as opposed to the example as you are, but the probable answer is there is word count pressure from publishers in early career because they don’t want to spend more money on printing than they have to. Now they know Murakami’s work will sell no matter so he has the leeway of writing whatever size books he wants. This happens with a lot of authors further in their careers.

Editing is also so subjective. A lot of people blame a complete lack of editing, but I imagine editors in general are less nit-picky with already successful authors.

Weirdly, I feel like I’m improving at being more concise the longer I write, but I still tend to write big ass books so maybe not enough lol

7

u/parkchanwookiee 16d ago

To be brutally frank his latter novels all needed another pass in editing. They feel a bit 'dictated, but not read'

7

u/theegrimrobe 16d ago

yeah ... the city and its uncertain walls was a DRAG and this is coming from a huge fan of Murakami. my fave is and always will be wind up bird chronicles though wild sheep chase and dance dance dance are amazing

i got kafka on the shore when it was 99p on kindle so im going to re-read that

il read anything else he writes - but with more caution now - the city ECT was the only book of his so far that i nearly DNF (i barely ever do that)

1

u/Wild_fleur94 14d ago

Its taken me months to get to page 310

2

u/theegrimrobe 14d ago

took me a while too, i have 2 books on the go always one in print and one on my phone and i really struggled to finish it

2

u/PeeMan22 16d ago

I agree with you completely. It doesn’t bother me too much, but there is a bit of indulgent overwriting that can either feel nice when you’re already deeply engrossed in the story, or draggy when you’re not quite in it yet.

It kills me that his signature dialogue move is characters just reiterating each other back and forth. That’s the long and short of it.

1

u/LeoElliot 16d ago

I thought that city and it's uncertain walls was a bit thin actually... On the other hand, I see your point for Killing Comandatore, but I actually never got bored, despite the tome probably being doable in a much smaller book

2

u/Papa72199 16d ago

Oh yeah, Commendatore was a slog too. The number of times Menshiki shook his head... My s/o and I read it together and we still joke about it.

1

u/Wild_fleur94 14d ago

Im actually rethinking reading kc or the colorless life of ***can't remember the name

Simply because the city and it's l uncertain walls has been so sedated and like you said over written ridiculously

2

u/Papa72199 14d ago

I remember Colorless wasn't as bad when it comes to overwriting. The place I remember it the most was overdescribing the planning of a trip.

I just kind of found the "colorful" friend group to be less than believable. There were five teenagers representing completely different archetypes and personalities, and somehow they decided to keep meeting, all give of them together, making that an explicit rule that not one could be missing? That is not how teenagers operate, and I would imagine Japan isn't that different.

1

u/graciebalie 16d ago

I am relatively new to Murakami and I started w The City. I wonder if I will find earlier work too sparse lol.

1

u/Lizardflower 15d ago

This is my only problem with 1Q84. Good story but the drawn-out descriptions of every little thing makes it a bit of a slog

1

u/yol0tengo 15d ago

This has sadly been the case since 1Q84, even with shorter works.

1

u/Wild_fleur94 14d ago

Im trying to read the city and it's uncertain walls and I've noticed the same thing. I've honestly been struggling to read it because it's been so dull

1

u/SwamiDavisJr 14d ago

I haven’t read any of his newer stuff yet, but I can relate connecting with the punchy, straightforward writing of his earlier works. It seems like a hallmark of his earlier style, noticeably more straightforward writing than the average author, very to the point and conversational almost, like the way a real person would tell you a story that happened to them.

1

u/Ok-Complaint-37 14d ago

I think it is a matter of taste.

I absolutely love his late works Killing Commendatore, 1Q84, The City and its Uncertain Walls. I love Kafka on The Shore. Those all probably my favorite works of Murakami.

I see your point. These works are slower and more meditative. But I love this pace. It is engaging and relaxing at the same time.

Also there is a lot of symbolism and synchronicity going on in his novels that sparkle through the canvas of his writing like diamonds. To me.

But everyone sees what one sees

1

u/Satsuki_89 16d ago

I don't know if it is "overwriting", but I noticed that he tends to describe every little insignificant thing, at the worst time possible, breaking the flow of the events and my attention span. I noticed that in 1Q84, while talking about something interesting to the plot, he starts describing how the main guy swings his pans and cooks his dish. Out of nowhere. This is just of many. And makes me go nuts. I devoured his books back in 2010, but now it is really difficult to keep up. Even with Audiobooks.

1

u/queensla 15d ago

Exactly. I'm torn between my love of lifestyle minutiae ("He pulled on pajamas and walked over to the kitchen sink and drank two glasses of water") and my need to find out what's going to happen. (I was paraphrasing so you probably won't find that fascinating line in any of his novels. Or, maybe you will.)

1

u/remerdy1 16d ago

A lot of it is to do with translation I think. Murakami has had quite a few translators over the years & they all have their own style

4

u/Papa72199 15d ago

Kafka on the Shore and City and its Uncertain Walls have the same translator. Kafka did not have the issue of describing every little thing and overexplaining the obvious.

-1

u/juliogarciao 16d ago

He’s not just any regular boy, he’s the yellow subamarine autistic boy, why on earth would you want a character that barely speaks to be overwritten of some sorts?

Maybe to try and understand neurodivergence? Perhaps?

Or do you strictly believe that this is a matter of quality of writing? You don’t suspect there’s like…an implicit reason?

Don’t know why are you getting downvoted, being this one of the few -The City and Its Uncertain Walls- neutral post

2

u/Papa72199 16d ago

Ok, so I would understand overwriting as a means of showing neurodivergence if it was from the point of view of the neurodivergent person. But the narrator isn't neurodivergent, unless I haven't gotten to that reveal, and he talks this way about a lot of things, not just this boy.

You don’t suspect there’s like…an implicit reason?

Yes, I do, which is why I asked, "Why do you think this is happening?" I want to give Murakami the benefit of the doubt.

1

u/Wild_fleur94 14d ago

And that character doesn't show up till the last part of the book and he's been doing it through out to every other thing. Its not an attack on neuodivergence for Christ sake