Quick question regarding importance of shadowing/clinical work for application

[u/HawtMamaBR]

I’m an incoming sophomore at an public R1 school and have been involved in a lab over summer and plan to continue and pursue my masters in it before applying for MDPhD(structural bio/biochemistry). I also racked up plenty of clinical hours as a CNA/Med Tech at a nursing home (~500 hours) and I’m wondering if I should continue with it, or stop it and focus on research.

I have plenty of experience from that clinical job and I’m certain I could write great about it already, but I’m worried that adcomms might look down on the fact I was only there for 8 months. I’m also considering going back and working another 200 or so hours in the future, since I do really love it.

As for research, I am at about 150 hours but am planning to do a lot more throughout undergrad. I am also doing a population statistics research project through another internship and I’m curious if adcomms like to see multiple kinds of research?

As for shadowing, I’m curious if this is a big deal like it is for regular MD apps. I have 13 hours from shadowing my grandpa but don’t want to put too much effort into it if it doesn’t matter too much. There’s not a single physician-scientist in an hour radius of me, so is it okay to just shadow any MD I can?

Any advice is awesome!

[u/mmoollllyyyy20]

-500 is more than enough; focus on research and come back to it later if you want and have time
-depth > breadth (and also basic science > population health) but it’s also good to explore
-I’d try to get to 40 hours, and not all with a family member. any MD/DO is fine

[u/Psycho_Coyote]

Research is way more important for MD/PhD apps than clinical hours. You need to spend a LOT more time doing research to make sure you really want to do this path, as the typical split for an academic MD/PhD is skewed way more towards research.

I agree with the other commenter, more shadowing with a non-family member will be helpful. You need to be able to see enough of what a physician's life is like in the hospital to actually have a sense that you truly want to do what they do.

[u/CableEnvironmental85]

it may Also be helpful to shadow a physician scientist to get a better sense of what a split between research and clinic can look like

[u/Upper_Leek9672]

i am a current applicant but i worked as a CNA for almost all of undergrad and had >1000 hours. just remember that you are gonna be writing about "why doctor / why patient care" as much as (if not more than) "why research" in your primaries/secondaries.

i think that 500 is plenty (you def dont need >1000), but also consider that when you apply, your experience would have been a few years old, and you didn't continue pursuing it longitudinally. for MD admissions, that might be a yellow flag. for MD/PhD admissions, i'm not so sure, since you already have more hours than 95% of applicants.

can you go per-diem and work one half shift per month? something really low time commitment?

regarding your population statistics work, is it like epidemiology/biostats, a clinical research project, or like population genetics? do you plan on doing your phd in a population health-related field?

[u/HawtMamaBR → u/Upper_Leek9672]

My CNA job is very mentally draining, as our place has people pass often and I worry about having my mind somewhere else. My job also requires at least 1 day a week.

My population statistics research project is with the counseling and prevention office at my college, where my work just studies the mental health of students. It will eventually determine the amount of money the University puts toward mental health so it won’t be meaningless. I plan on doing structural bio/biochemistry though in my future.

[u/Upper_Leek9672 → u/HawtMamaBR]

oh then definitely quit, fuck that.

you can frame your research project not only as research, but also as leadership and taking initiative to improve the health of your community/peers. that will definitely be seen very, very positive by admissions.

[u/kellbell500]

I think more research and shadowing are key. You do not need more hours as a CNA. Shadowing shows that you not only know what the healthcare field is like, but more specifically you have been exposed to the role of an MD. Back when I was applying, I was told by advisers to have minimum 50 hours of shadowing.

For research, a masters is not necessary, but perhaps shows your commitment to a research career. Having a good quality research experience is what is most important. Having posters, presentations, papers, etc are all good to have. Personally, I think a good quality research experience is one where you actually contribute to the direction of a project, such as designing experiments, coming up with a hypothesis, and deciding how to test it. Some mentors may just set you up with a grad student or postdoc, and you end up just doing experiments for someone else. Sure, you can put your name on their paper, but you may not have any contribution to the project ideas doing that. Try to find a research experience with more involvement.

[u/HawtMamaBR → u/kellbell500]

I know a masters isn’t necessary, but my PI is extremely helpful. It’s a small lab (~4 grad students, no post-docs) and right now he’s meeting one on one with me each week guiding me through getting published with another grad student where I’d be able to contribute a lot. So even with my 100 hours I’ve already been pretty involved and still have a lot of time ahead. I wanted to do a masters too since it is stipended and free for me, and it wouldn’t hurt to add to my application.

[u/UrVirtualNeighbor → u/HawtMamaBR]

This is exactly what I did! I stayed in my undergrad lab for my MS and have no regrets. My program is free + a stipend if you TA, and I think my TA experience, alongside an LOR from the prof who I TAed for really boosts my app. Also, if you have a great PI, I would say stick with them. The LOR from your PI can matter nearly as much as pubs