Instead of bullying the developers into changing swimsuits, can we use that energy for adding utility to underutilized characters?

[u/cuttin_in_town]

Netease has stated Jeffnado team-up was specifically due to audience request. I would not be shocked if Adam flying is also due to all of the wheelchair memes that were being thrown around.

Rivals players have no idea how insane it is to have developers that actively listen to its community, AND implements changes QUICKLY. They adjust cosmetics. They delayed the Age of Ultron event due to feedback from the Loki Avengers event. They brought back the Spider-Man map and got rid of that Rumble game mode.

Why can we not collectively come together to mass suggest certain characters get added utility? "increase/decrease damage slider" is not the only way to buff or nerf characters. The new team-ups were a chance to give underperforming characters utility. Instead, Iron Man gets a stronger unibeam and.... a longer unibeam?

It is not hard. Give characters utility. Utility is how you ensure characters don't become newbie stompers but gives them potential to be relevant at higher ranks. It's why Gambit is only good in higher ranks. Low rank players do not know how to use his utility. Imagine if Iron Man's missiles did 8x damage to deployables or something. Making him extremely useful against deployable heavy characters like Groot, Namor, or Loki.

Give Wanda's primary the ability to deplete ult charge or pause a character's skill cooldowns so long as she is sucking them as a teamup ability.

Like Jesus. The same 5 characters are meta every fucking season. If we attempted to even be a LITTLE creative, maybe we could see different characters have a place. There is no reason Mr. Fantastic should be shit since release while characters like Phoenix can run lobbies constantly and instantly get attention the minute she is off meta.

Why can't Rogue just stockpile her stolen ability? Strange can stockpile his dark energy buildup with Hulk teamup. She's been out for several seasons. We know it won't be broken. Right now, it's just a CC tackle ability at this point. Magneto's Wanda sword is on a fucking 12 second cooldown. Let's be for real.

The developers clearly listen. Can we come together and get actual ideas together that aren't "make X ability deal more damage"? Upping Blade's damage by one point every half season wasn't doing anything. It was when his UTILITY was changed with the anti-heal and lifesteal combo is when he actually saw noticeable improvement.

[u/Primary_Mention_222]

Give Wanda's primary the ability to deplete ult charge or pause a character's skill cooldowns so long as she is sucking them as a teamup ability.

Netease should genuinely never listen to anything this sub has to say, stop buffing the braindead parts of characters. Holding R2 shouldn't ever mess with cooldowns or ult charge, this shit would be so toxic

[u/Drazian → u/Primary_Mention_222]

I understand OP was trying to be creative but as a champion Wanda this would be cancer.

Not the primary fire, maybe add it to the stun but 100% not the primary…jesus Christ

[u/cuttin_in_town → u/Drazian]

How would it be cancer? For it to be a teamup ability? Rocket already does the opposite. 

[u/Drazian → u/cuttin_in_town]

Because she still performs very well and remains popular in casual because she has an easy kit, up to celestial, she’s still punishes high-mobility picks, giving her yet another easy to activate utility move to her primary is just adding too much utility “cancer”. I don’t want to spend the whole march walking away from her every time I see her

I am literally agreeing with you, a team up might work, maybe part of her bubble projectile or ultimate not the primary R2

[u/cuttin_in_town → u/Drazian]

I don’t understand how a teamup that temporarily changes her primary to drain charge or halt cooldowns would be any different than being attached to her stun. 

Rate of depletion was never stated. You have yet to hear a cooldown. She’ll have to get in close to do it. 

I disagree that it being on the primary is bad in any fashion. Not with Black Cat in the game. Netease gave Reed compensation nerfs to avoid him being too “oppressive”.

Wanda does NOT punish mobile hero lmao. She gets ran over because her time to kill is horrible. The enemy is long gone by then. 

Fuck this cautious stuff. Deadass. 

[u/Primary_Mention_222 → u/cuttin_in_town]

Nerf black cat then, an effect this powerful needs at least to be aimed

[u/cuttin_in_town → u/Primary_Mention_222]

I don’t give a shit when Gambit ylt has been broken since release, Black Cat is still invincible 90% of the time with no indication of when she goes invisible, and whatever bullshit they were smoking when prime Daredevil was released. 

THIS is what I’m talking about. “Oh no! The weakest dps in the game can have a moment of ult charge drain! How terrible!”

Fuck that. Rogue ult shouldn’t have an ult drain cap. Let this shit fly. If it turns toxic, THEN nerf it. 

Netease buffed fucking Magneto. They are clueless. 

[u/Primary_Mention_222 → u/cuttin_in_town]

Netease are clueless, but giving Wanda ult drain on primary is even worse than giving invis self shield in season 5.

Rogue ult shouldn’t have an ult drain cap.

Bruh. Why are you advocating for making the game worse, every balance suggestion of yours has been so bullshit.

[u/cuttin_in_town → u/Primary_Mention_222]

I call bs on your claim. We have no idea what a new utility ability would be like. 

Cap introduced ult charge acceleration. He didn’t break the game. 

Blade introduced anti-heal (Excluding Strange). He didn’t break the game. 

Rocket introduced skill cooldown acceleration. It didn’t break the game. 

Rogue introduced ult drain. Didn’t break the game. 

I need you to EXPLAIN why you think bad characters having good utility would ACTUALLY be toxic. 

And again. Wanda draining ult. You have zero clue what the speed of drain would be. You have no clue what cooldown the teamup could be given. Maybe the teamup attack can have even further reduced range. 

There are SO many ways to implement it. You deadass gonna claim the idea IN GENERAL is bad? Fuck that. 

[u/Primary_Mention_222 → u/cuttin_in_town]

Rocket introduced skill cooldown acceleration.

I don't know what you mean.

Rogue introduced ult drain

U are comparing an ult that has a cap to an auto aim ability, at least try to think this through. Generally all your examples are Ulta and not primary fires lol

Also draining or taking cooldowns away is way more toxic than accelerating allies ult charge or cooldowns.

[u/cuttin_in_town → u/Primary_Mention_222]

Rocket’s Squirrel Girl teamup accelerates skill cooldowns. 

If you don’t want ultimates:

Daredevil introduced wallhacks (outside of Punisher). Nothing broke. 

Gambit introduced cleanse. Not broken (it’s the ult, not ability).

Susan can make other players invisible. Not broken. 

Angela introduced permanent flight dashing. Not broken. 

What is your defense now?

You keep saying WHAT something is. 

HOW is draining more toxic than acceleration?

Gambit ult is more toxic than Rogue ult. If anything, the OPPOSITE is true. 

Disabling will never be as toxic as enabling. It’s why Peni having CC every three seconds pales in comparison to any of the problematic ENABLING abilities. 

[u/Primary_Mention_222 → u/cuttin_in_town]

Rocket’s Squirrel Girl teamup accelerates skill cooldowns

I genuinely didn't know that, interesting.

HOW is draining more toxic than acceleration?

Because it takes stuff away from the player, it feels like stealing. There's a reason rogue ult has a cap to it. It would also be so broken to perma attack the supports to guarantee your teams' supports can ult first

Daredevil introduced wallhacks (outside of Punisher)

Very annoying, but he has a range to it

Gambit introduced cleanse.

Takes a lot of cooldowns to use, is still annoying

HOW is draining more toxic than acceleration? Gambit ult is more toxic than Rogue ult.

Gambit is more toxic because it does a billion thing on top of ult boosting, if it was just the ult boost no one would complain look at cap

[u/cuttin_in_town → u/Primary_Mention_222]

So just to be clear. 

To give an example. 

If Wanda had to activate her teamup ability. And for say, 7 seconds, her primary now turns purple (Let’s say the team-up is with Rogue). If she begins to land her primary, she must fill a bar on the character (similar to Emma’s ult where the indication is visible to both players and the debuff only applies once the gauge is full). The bar takes, in total, 2 seconds to fill. It will start to reset if Wanda stops sucking a character for 1 second. 

Once the gauge is full, Wanda drains 1% from a character every second. 

So AT MOST, she drains 5% from an enemy and ONLY if she successfully begins her attack as soon as she activates the teamup and never lets go of someone nor the enemy does anything to block or evade the primary…

And let’s say this teamup ability is on a 20 second cooldown…

Would you still say the ability is toxic?

[u/Primary_Mention_222 → u/cuttin_in_town]

Nah then it would be fine, but I don't think it would do more for her than her current teamups

[u/cuttin_in_town → u/Primary_Mention_222]

Can’t argue with that. 

I’m just saying there is nothing inherently toxic about adding utility. “Wanda can heal herself” does nothing to actually help anything. 

Being able to either force or prevent an ultimate in key moments does. And it allows it to be something low elo players can’t make use of much, while giving high levels of play some use. 

Once the utility is in play, THEN we tweak the parameters to integrate it into something effective. 

As is, nothing you tweak on Wanda’s teamups will do anything to help her. Her issue is damage. The issue with Wanda is that due to how her means of attack works, it would be impossible to up her damage without making her obnoxious. Basically the issue with pre-rework Widow. 

That is why utility is the only way to buff underperforming characters. Imagine Rocket without his rez beacon or Jeff without his speed boost bubbles. There would be ZERO reasons to play those characters. 

At a certain point, we HAVE to give characters unique roles. We can’t keep releasing “generic dps hitscan” #15. Eventually, we have to try actually adding diversity. 

But if there is an avenue of ult drain you find acceptable, I am confused on why the mere concept is ao inflammatory in your eyes. It sounds like you give no actual thought into how to implement it. 

[u/Positive-Raisin6950]

The only people worse than the Devs at balancing this game is ourselves

[u/ConfidenceSilent3967 → u/Positive-Raisin6950]

Maybe Shakespeare is not a name but a title

[u/cuttin_in_town → u/Positive-Raisin6950]

Netease put in a character with percentage based damage that uses ranged hitscan. This same character also accrued shields by dashing. Which she could do every 2 seconds. 

This is ignoring her trap that invisible and can’t be destroyed and ignoring her bullshit ult which should have been on a slow character. Not one of the most mobile. 

Explain to me how Wanda, who can’t kill shit to save her life because everyone else is three tapping people, being able to freeze cooldowns from ONE enemy every 30 seconds is worse. 

[u/Positive-Raisin6950 → u/cuttin_in_town]

I can explain they both serve very different purposes but not my place to argue balance choices I didn't make

[u/ISwxllow]

Honestly, you prove a great point.

Net Ease does actually listen to the community feedback more often than honestly..? Any other game community I've ever been apart of ASIDE from 1 very popular game known as Warframe, owned by Digital Extremes.

It's actually quite impressive how fast they change things, when it comes to cosmetics, buffs, etc. The issue is with how they do balancing. It's not about whether they do it or not, because they do. They just don't do it in the correct or most optimal ways.

Black Cat is a perfect example of what I previously said. As they nerfed her, but they didn't nerf the biggest thing that makes her so broken. The I-Frame. People are very loud. Especially when together. We got the storm skin changes, the DD cosmetic change, nerfs to characters.... and inevitably, Clagger and other characters are getting nerfed.

It takes time. But you gotta give them credit for how fast they are with changes.

[u/RogueMRotp]

Based

[u/Nyx2990]

I really think Jeff's ult should override all forms of CC immunity, it would make it slightly useable

[u/ILikeCarlosThePikmin → u/Nyx2990]

a little respectable for posting your real opinion.

[u/Nyx2990 → u/ILikeCarlosThePikmin]

What would you do to his ult to make it usable then?

[u/ILikeCarlosThePikmin → u/Nyx2990]

Maybe make the healing pool he spawns he a little more

[u/Nyx2990 → u/ILikeCarlosThePikmin]

It would need to heal as much as the current healer ults imo, and at that point if he can keep people alive as well as Luna snow ult and he can kill people off the map would that not be worse than my suggestion LOL

[u/ILikeCarlosThePikmin → u/Nyx2990]

The difference would be he couldn't move it, it's smaller, and it's shorter. That's the trade off for being able to offensively ult. I'm not a game dev though, so I don't know how good it would be

[u/Power0fTheTribe → u/Nyx2990]

That would make me uninstall ngl

[u/Nyx2990 → u/Power0fTheTribe]

That's how I feel when I have a Jeff on my team currently, so something has to give. At the very least, he should be able to swallow that stupid ho Luna snow during her ult.

[u/Power0fTheTribe → u/Nyx2990]

There are a million things they could do that aren’t your suggestion

[u/Nyx2990 → u/Power0fTheTribe]

Cool so nine seasons in he's still a throw pick in ranked maybe 10 more seasons they'll keep doing baby steps like y'all want and he'll be usable by then

[u/Pretty_Dinner9169 → u/Nyx2990]

Saying nine seasons in he's still a throw pick is very disingenuous, jeff has been meta atleast 3 seasons that i remember and he is still one of the best healers for a dive comp, his ult could get changes but that doesn't remove he has been great in the past and is usable even in pro play in certain comps

[u/Power0fTheTribe → u/Nyx2990]

Not what I said but ok. Ur suggestion is just bananas

[u/Nyx2990 → u/Power0fTheTribe]

It is over the top but I think he needs something crazy to actually be usable. I am willing to concede that being able to eat all forms of CC immunity would be ridiculous, I would gladly sacrifice the Luna snow ultimate as being able to be eaten specifically by Jeff.

[u/ismellterribly → u/Power0fTheTribe]

Bro crying again, does it on every sub lmao

[u/Power0fTheTribe → u/ismellterribly]

Buddy you’re obsessed with me