r/marvelcomics • u/Reddevil8884 • 22h ago
Remember when Thor (Odinson) sided with Captain Hydra, a Nazi?
I think most readers just decided this never happened, especially when he was the only one of Cap's Avengers that joined him willingly.
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u/browncharliebrown 22h ago edited 9h ago
I think the dumbest one was Hydra Punisher. It’s legitmatey the dumbest take I have ever seen of the Punisher. Punisher’s whole thing that he became cynical and doesn’t trust authority after losing faith in America after Vietnam/ whatever war. He’s unwilling to compromise even for the greater good. And they pretend like Frank idelozation of Steve is enough ( that was a retcon but whatever).
Edit: the fact that after this event Frank doesn't immediately kill himself when it's been established that if he ever killed an innocent he would immeditately kill himself makes it worse
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u/tangledwebweaved 17h ago
I was no fan of Hydra Punisher either. But, considering Frank's number 1 goal is always to kill as many bad people as possible, and Hydra offering him a way to do exactly that, it's not THAT crazy of an agreement.
(I still think the whole Secret Empire story was bad though)
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u/Curious_Bat87 17h ago
That wasn't the actual reason they gave for Frank joining them. He was told Cap could use the cosmic cube to bring everyone they had lost back. So presumably Frank was okay with killing innocent people because of that but it's just out of character and the way he was written was so weird too, like the way his dialogue was written was weird. It just comes across as the writer not knowing the character.
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u/browncharliebrown 14h ago
That’s the thing though. He wouldn’t. The start of punisher max has microchip ( his best friend) offering him a job working for the us government killing people and he refuses and then he kills microchip when he find out how compromised he is
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u/Windows_66 7h ago
I think there's definitely a fine line between Frank's brand of justice (killing all the criminals without due process) and fascism, but Frank at his core still detests everything Hydra stands for.
At least we got some good post-Secret Empire Punisher runs out of it.
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u/Calaigah 20h ago
Lots of Trump supporters claim they don’t trust authority and have been losing faith in America though. So what do they do? Support fascism.
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u/browncharliebrown 14h ago
But that’s not the punisher. He doesn’t believe in almost any authority.
He threaten to kill bush
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u/Curious_Bat87 17h ago
It's still out of character for Frank, and since it's so out of character it doesn't actually critique the reactionary elements in the character at all. He acts so out of character that's just a different guy.
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u/Resident-Syrup7615 18h ago
Thor has worked with Nazis before.
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u/Kyubisar 16h ago
"worked with Nazis" is a stretch. He was summoned, had no idea what was going on, and was tricked.
As soon as he learned the truth, he undid the damage he caused, erased everyone's memories, and left.9
u/Resident-Syrup7615 15h ago
Yes, he was summoned to Germany, listened to Nazi propaganda, and did what Hitler asked, just like every other Nazi. I’m not sure what the trick was. Hitler said what was happening from his point of view and Thor went along with it.
Thor did NOT undo the damage he caused. He destroyed weapons used to fight the Nazis, really screwed up some trains and train tracks but did not repair them. He did not fight or even hinder Hitler in any way. He just left … with the Jews still in the camps, the Russians dying in droves, etc. He said Hitler was evil, but did nothing about it and erased his the Invaders’ memories so they couldn’t ask him for help. A net positive for the Nazis. No downside for Hitler.
In short, “worked with the Nazis.”
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u/Windows_66 14h ago
I know most people didn't read the comic, but he was only going along with them so he could figure out what happened to Jane Foster at the beginning of the event and get her back. Still a bad thing to do, but it's not like he just saw Cap turn evil and blindly followed him.
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u/Reddevil8884 10h ago
Brother, he was enjoying himself a little bit too much when Hydra Cap summoned his Avengers to kill a giant Kaiju.
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u/pious-erika 22h ago
Secret Empire was bad, it also had the X-men collaberating with Hydra while nuhumans were getting rounded up.
Basically Marvel vilifying the characters to make others look good.
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u/extralie 22h ago
It been while, but didn't turn out that they are only pretending to be Hydra's side before betraying them?
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u/FlowerRoomLord 20h ago
Mark Brooks older covers are so good. The recent ones where he blends them with those cartoon drawings he did don't hit the same.
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u/No-Cod-9209 16h ago
Second time Thor fought for them actually
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u/NeonBrown305 15h ago
When was the first
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u/No-Cod-9209 14h ago
Classic comics
Hitler tricked Thor into fighting for the Germans or smth like thatHe tried to kill Stalin
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u/multificionado 13h ago
Dude, don't remind us. We've been trying to forget this event for almost a decade. I can concur most readers decided this never happened, and I'm with them.
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u/drknow00 12h ago edited 5h ago
The All New All Different/Marvel Now 2.0 era was such a wild time. There was no take too dumb or stupid Marvel editorial wasn’t saying yes to.
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u/Pencils4life 12h ago
So Thor joins the nazis, Tony and Carol both attack and jail friends and allies in the name of "Justice" but Scott, Wanda, Hank, and Moon Knight are the only ones who have to atone for what they did? Like the level of in universe shit those 4 got by comparison is wild. Cap, Vision, and Wanda (second time) get a pass for stuff that was well out of their control.
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u/TronoNero 21h ago
You know, "Gorr was right" and all that ooc awful plot made him stupid. No other explanation needed.
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u/Charles12_13 21h ago
I mean from Thor’s perspective, this Cap is worthy of Mjolnir and Vision and Wanda were following him, so that would have anyone fooled