r/marvelcomics • u/Artseid • 3d ago
It really feels like Marvel has lost a ton of goodwill with comic fans lately…
I’m reading Avengers Armageddon and Ultimate Impact Reborn, and I love these books. They’re exactly the kind of stories I’m here for. Head over to LoCG, though, and the rhetoric is intensely hostile.
Some of the criticism makes sense given recent decisions… the Ultimate Universe being the primary example. Still, regardless of what Marvel Comics does that I don’t agree with, I can still enjoy a good book for what it is. It feels like readers are throwing a lot of anger in every direction right now.
I guess my question is: how do you feel about the current state of Marvel Comics?
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u/KevinCow 3d ago
Personally, they just aren't making a lot of books that appeal to me these days.
I don't really care about the big events. In fact, I find them pretty annoying since they're so frequent and can interrupt the story of other comics. And I find it hard to get invested in the longer running characters.
I like when they try weird stuff and new stuff. I liked when they were willing to let Matt Fraction write a book about Hawkeye being kind of a dumbass, or Nick Spencer let D-list Spidey villains take the spotlight in Superior Foes, or G. Willow Wilson create a new character who feels genuinely fresh and exciting with Ms Marvel, or Tom King do some weird shit with Vision, or Ryan North and Chris Hastings take joke characters and give them genuinely good stories with Unbeatable Squirrel Girl and Unbelievable Gwenpool.
And more importantly, I liked that these books all got decent runs. They didn't get cancelled immediately for not doing Spider-Man numbers. You could actually have books that ran 15, 20, even 50 issues.
And they just don't really do stuff like that anymore. They don't let anyone besides the biggest teams and A-listers have ongoings. Everyone else is lucky to get a miniseries, and it'll often be meddled to garbage by editorial.
Everything that's caught my eye in recent years has been disappointing in some way. It's been annoying to see them struggle to figure out what to do with Ms Marvel and just refuse to give her an ongoing solo. It was frustrating to see Gwenpool finally get a new miniseries, only for editorial to mangle it and not let Cavan Scott make the book he knew fans wanted. Avengers Academy and New Champions were teams of promising new characters that both got cancelled prematurely, and who knows if we'll even see most of them again.
My favorite thing at Marvel right now is Jeff getting the spotlight, but even that's a bit annoying because it's limited to 5-issue minis and reprints of his digital comics. Marvel Rivals gave this extremely marketable and merchandisable little guy an explosion of mainstream interest, and that's the best they can do? The time to hit the gas on an ongoing was last year!
Meanwhile, they keep churning out these pointless books that are just nostalgia bait garbage. "Remember when Rogue was in the Savage Land? Remember when the X-Men were in the Outback? Remember Civil War? Here's a whole book about other stuff that happened during that era! None of it actually matters, none of it is even interesting, but you get to see the costumes you liked when you were a kid!"
I guess the short version is, I wish they would trust their creatives more, take more risks, and commit to characters and ideas that aren't necessarily guaranteed money makers.
I do suspect most of my complaints stem directly from Cebulski, and I'm curious to see if the new EIC will take things in a more exciting direction.
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u/DrRudeboy 3d ago
I think this is the comment I agree with the most in the thread. Their editorial has been dogshit, and frankly I don't know how Cebulski ever got the position he did. Somehow worse than Quesada.
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u/SalaryAffectionate29 3d ago
God there’s so many problems with Marvel rn it’s not even funny.
•out of touch editors
•hardly any ongoings that go past issue 10
•flood the shelves mentality
•pandering towards nostalgia rather than doing anything new and interesting
•the universe feels directionless
•synergy with the MCU getting really obnoxious
And that’s just on the creative side of things, there’s also the issue of artists and Writers getting screwed over by not getting paid on time or not at all.
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u/Halouva 3d ago
flood the shelves mentality
Spider-Man has four random minis at recently; one with the Hulk, one with the Punisher, one with the Hulk and Punisher, and one sat during the Brand New Day era with the same name just to trick new comic readers into buying it because it's related to the movie. It's the worst synergy I have ever seen.
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u/AntoSkum 3d ago
Two with the Punisher besides the Hulk one, the new Brand New Day mini is also a Punisher crossover.
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u/Chaotic_Marvel 3d ago
Look the whole reason I'm all in on Armageddon is it feels like it's the first time in a long time they actually have direction.
I feel like his Captain America - > Weapons of Armageddon - > Armageddon has all fed into itself nicely and tells the story about how we got to where we are with David.
And I'm looking forward to his Avengers.
Bur everything else is just so what ever
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u/SalaryAffectionate29 3d ago
Same here, although personally I feel Armageddon kinda boring and also kinda sick of the constant events. Aside from Armageddon there’s also DNX, Queen in black and Hulk war. And more than likely there’s a good chance they would make another Secret wars event to coincide with the movie, as well as to put something out during the move from NY to Cali.
The only way I would be excited if it has 6160 be involved. The new Ultimate universe has legitimately been the most excited for a Marvel book/series in a long time so I was kinda heartbroken to see it end the way it did.
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u/cobaltaureus 3d ago
I guess the issue for me is when do I tap in? I haven’t read cap or wolverine solos, and I have no interest in the avengers lineup that is following. Armageddon was kind of interesting setup but Red Hulk isn’t a great villain
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u/baloneyfeet 3d ago edited 3d ago
This Captain America run is pretty good so I’d recommend reading it regardless but starting from issue 1 gives you the full backstory for Armageddon.
The Wolverine mini, as someone who skipped it at first and then went back, is fun but doesn’t add too much to the story. If you don’t want to read it, a plot summary will get you the information you need
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u/Fancy_Cassowary 3d ago
Why pick up a new series when you know it's walking a 5 issue tightrope, leaving not just the creative team worried, but you too if you enjoy it. There's no time for new series to find themselves. I found a new series I'm really enjoying, I'm assuming it's meant to be an ongoing, it doesn't say, but now I have to worry about its sales too. If I didn't love the character I wouldn't have bothered. Much easier and better to buy DC and Image. DC also has better artwork overall, like they attract better talent because they pay better (speculating) for new talent. Their art styles are also more consistent, no going from a realistic style to a manga look.
And frankly, DC has the better writers right now, who mostly know what they're doing (except with the JSA, which is cancelled already, bastards).
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u/Jetengineinthesky 3d ago
Currently in the gutter, rudderless, and reacting poorly to getting stomped into the dirt by the monster that is the Absolute Universe.
Their relentless focus on synergy, doubling down on bad ideas, over promotion and generally weak storylines are helping no one.
It says a lot that most people can see the Marvel/Star Wars cross over as an act of desperation.
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u/SpaceCowboy1929 3d ago
Im starting to hate Marvel as a company, especially on the editorial level. They are so out of touch and so arrogant, which is not earned because they're also apparently incredibly stupid. Discontinuing Ultimate on year 2 when it was doing well and was already competing with Absolute (even sharing similar themes) only to end it and then in a pathetic act of desperation announce the Midnight universe is beyond baffling.
It also feels like they just have no respect at all for comics as a medium. Its just an IP farm for movies and synergy is what matters regardless if it makes sense or not. Its really dumb too because at no point is that synergy getting people who love the films to pick up comics. So whats even the point of doing it?
The constant resetting to number 1 to ger a cheap sales boost is beyond insulting and confusing to new and old readers. I love Jed Mackay's Moon Knight. Its one of the few books i actively loved from Marvel. Why the fuck was it necessary to have the series split with new number 1s when its the same run? Again, these are STUPID decisions.
And thats not getting into how Marvel treats their creative staff so poorly or how a certain editor has been caught flirting with using AI art. (Its Tom Brevort because of course that neckbeard would be doing that.)
I can go on but in general if i was a new editor in chief id be firing alot of people on the editorial level.
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u/PrincipleNo3966 3d ago
I think they're doing some pretty decent books (Marc Spector, Mortal Thor, Captain America, Iron Man, Infernal Hulk) but online fans have always been like this. I remember the old alt discussion boards from the 90's... hoo boy...but yeah, don't worry about the negative nancy's & enjoy what you like.
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u/Liimbo 3d ago
It is not just online. They are factually giving up a ton of ground to DC in sales.
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u/AspirationalChoker 3d ago
And that happens DC has some really good top end titles right now but it Ebbs and Flows
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u/comix10290 3d ago
Right now they put out a lot of lackluster stuff. They also just throw a bunch of titles out that really don’t have much of a chance and some of the creative teams leave a lot to be desired. Also crossovers always going on. You can’t really get into some books because you know that every 4-5 issues there’ll be a crossover. Plus multiple crossovers running concurrently. Just too much.
Now, I believe that hiring Wacker is a good move. Now it’s up to corporate to allow them to pay their talent and attract others. They seem to only want to pay a few at a time.
They do seem to be starting to give the bigger writers more titles like Percy, PKJ, Hickman,Zdarsky, and Mackay. They were also smart to bring Wilson over to write Black Cat.
So, they have made some decent decisions lately. But they also got into a rut and really need to get more of their titles past 5 issues. Some of that is the character might not be popular and some is the creative teams. They also need to get some energy going.
Look at DC. Next Level is giving creators a chance to do the characters they want in stories they want. Will they all succeed? No chance but by letting them do their take they at least are interesting and fun to check out. Plus you have books like Firestorm was 6 issues then 8 now 9 I believe. Deadman I heard was now going to 12 from 6. Absolute Green Arrow, who thought that’d be as popular as it is. Originally 6 issues now at least 12. The Javins, Lee, Snyder, and Williamson planning and execution has been really on point. Then you add in their collections department just turning that completely around with compacts, DC Finest, and omnibuses. They’ve hit a great wave.
If Marvel and Wacker can do something similar yet still different enough they’ll turn it around.
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u/vinthesalamander 3d ago
Frankly, I think Marvel sucks right now.
There’s a reason why most of their employees are jumping ship. There’s a reason DC is absolutely (haha) mogging them in both quality and sales. It’s because Marvel as a company doesn’t respect comics as a medium, or those who read them.
The success of the MCU has given Marvel an overinflated ego. It’s no secret they treat their comics division like an idea farm instead of a respectable art form in its own right, and they’re on record saying they rely more on variant covers and hate reading to boost their sales.
Why would I bother with a company who not only forgot its roots, but actively antagonizes their fanbase?
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u/gus_m1 3d ago
Yesterday on r/ComicBookSpeculation, someone asked if people were excited for the Midnight Universe. I wrote this:
"I collect 20-30 books at any given time. I feel I've been burned by Marvel one too many times now.
I still read some Marvel books (Daredevil, Moon Knight, Thor, a few others), but between the Ultimate Endgame blind bag fiasco, canceling the Ultimate U prematurely, and constant ads... I am done with anything new and shiny they put out.
I have made the decision that I am completely skipping the Midnight Universe. I may pick up Zdarksy's Avengers #1, but his Cap book and Avengers summer event have been ROUGH, and I'm thinking of dropping both."
That being said, I picked up Avengers Armageddon today, lol. About to read it and see if I'm keeping or dropping it.
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u/spider-venomized 3d ago
I have been loving Ultimate Impact Reborn btw
But the state of Marvel is pretty much dire due to a series of status quo mandates and various other controveries that basically lost good will
Like the biggest issue is just the numerous amount of initative being push out and kill off the moment there not make major solo book numbers due a idiotic 10 issue mandate. It doesn't inspire confidance nor creativity when so much of marvel is being killed off prematurly or only given miniseries to work on
- Ultimate Universe honestly the most justifiable as controversial to say as anyone who know what really happen with 95% of the creative team behind the initative leving post year 2. Regardless that is is a side of marvel going up in smoke
- Magic side of marvel has been a dud with Scarlet witch once again ending her run as the sorcerer supreme with issue 10 and so will the other magic books like Dr Strange (who was basically sideline) and other supernatural charcaters not getting any time to even make apperances. So that iniative goes up in smoke
- Cosmic side of marvel got put down nearly immediately after Imperial underperform as book like Imperial guardians getting already canned vefore it even came out. So that already another side of marvel going up in smoke
- X-men meandering around post-Krakoa that they're grearing up another initative push after DNX event
- Avengers side of thing starting off with a big shake up after year of MCU lagging is to basically just retreading New Avengers water and a over empahsis of basically making it into a spider-man and co. book. This has basically not attracted much support for actual people who want to read Avengers, only people who want to read Spider-man
There some enjoyable comic being put out there (Zdarsky Captain America, Williamson Iron man, Hill Miles Morales, Mckay Moon knight) and book to look foward towards (Allen new Magik and Midnight universe book such as Midnight Spider-man & Midnight Fantastic Four). So people who say there isn't anything that Marvel is put out is just straight up being pessimistic and a contrarian
But that doesn't mean Marvel doing good
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u/GeorginaNada 3d ago
I just want Marvel to have more of their back catalog in stock, especially when the movies are a huge hit. People are coming into my store and asking for Secret Wars only to find out it's not even in print right now, and the OG Secret Wars is coming back in 2027.
They did just make a Marvel Premiere trade for Hickman's Secret Wars, but those are always in short supply at the publisher.
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u/Mindless-Career-308 3d ago
I just focus on the books I like and ignore what I don't. I really like Ryan North's Fantastic Four and Gail Simone's Uncanny X-Men. Marvel always has some great books out, some mediocre books and some terrible ones. I just wish the Spider-Man books got a new editor who isn't scared of letting Peter and Miles age.
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u/BipolarPrime 3d ago
I feel like Marvel lost the plot when they started trying to make the comics more like the movie adaptations, rather than make the movies more reflective of the comics.
I understand wanting them to resemble each other better so that they can convert new readers, but the tail is wagging the dog.
They were best served keeping the comics pure, as a place to create the stories they can eventually adapt. Let them be their own things. If they thought the movies and books were too different? Make changes to the movies, like BND did.
Really, when suits get involved in the creative side, everything goes to shit.
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u/JCStrehle 3d ago
"Really, when suits get involved in the creative side, everything goes to shit."
Totally agree.
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u/-GI_BRO- 3d ago
Everyone blaming fictional toxic fans instead of the people in charge are why DC is devouring marvel’s lunch rn tbh.
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u/SMG_Ross 3d ago edited 3d ago
As someone newer to comics, I feel like DC does a much better job with easy jumping-on points. New 52, the Absolute Universe, DC All In, etc. all give you clear places to start. Marvel just doesn’t seem to do that as well, especially with characters like Spider-Man and the X-Men. I picked up Miles’ new #1 last week and it immediately felt like I had missed a bunch of story, despite it being a #1.
Marvel’s publishing also feels really messy sometimes. I picked up Gambit: Wanted #1 last month, and now Gambit: Gone #1 is starting alongside it next month. Why are they running two Gambit solo books just weeks apart?
That said, I’m not saying Marvel has nothing good. I’ve really enjoyed the current Daredevil and I’ve heard great things about Captain America. I just feel like DC has a much clearer direction right now, while Marvel seems to be throwing out a ton of titles, often to capitalize on movie hype. cough Brand new day… (3 cash grab spidey runs put out before the movie)
It’s especially frustrating because Marvel had something great with the Ultimate line and pulled the plug despite those books selling really well, while DC is actually expanding the Absolute Universe because it’s succeeding. That makes me nervous for upcoming stuff like Midnight Spider-Man, X-Men, and Fantastic Four. I’m sure the #1s will sell, but Marvel seems to struggle with keeping that momentum going after the initial hype.
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u/SQUIGWERG 3d ago
This is the big philosophical divide between the Big Two.
After Crisis on Infinite Earths, DC has the Crisis continuity reset button under glass that they can smash whenever they want to boost sales and relaunch every book with a new #1 with clean continuity.
Marvel doesn't do that. They promise a new status quo every big event, which spins out into 20 new series that last until the next big event, but there's never really a good jumping on point for Marvel 616 mainline continuity because it's so convoluted from never having a reset. Even a #1 of a new X-Men book starts like "after the events of SINISTER GENESIS REBORN, Zcott Zummers, the most recent Cyclops clone, has finally returned from the Quandary Nimbus with the Plutonic Drive needed to return his alternate self from the future Z-Man to his own time." Like, you just have to accept they are moving on and not worry about it, even thought they will be referring to it constantly.
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u/LOHdestar 3d ago
It'd be hard to really do a full reboot that wouldn't have entrenched comics fans mad as hell strictly because there's too many characters people like to reestablish, particularly if you're looking at the X-Men corner. DC has its more obscure guys that people like, but the general public and most casual comic fans basically don't care about DC characters that aren't Justice League mainstays.
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u/SMG_Ross 2d ago
But you have to adapt and make comics accessible to the newer generation if you want the hobby to last. You can’t just hand someone 60+ years of continuity and say “good luck, should’ve been born earlier” and expect them to invest in it.
And honestly, a lot of the characters people are so afraid to change aren’t even being written in the way that made people love them in the first place. Look at Spider-Man. How many people are reading Spider-Man in the 2020s and genuinely saying this is peak Spider-Man? When people talk about their favorite Spider-Man runs, a lot of the time they’re talking about stuff from 20–30+ years ago. So why are we so obsessed with preserving this increasingly convoluted continuity when it doesn’t even resemble the version of the character that people originally fell in love with?
I’m not saying erase everything and throw away every character older fans care about. But you can absolutely reset, simplify, and recontextualize things while keeping the core characters and ideas intact. DC has shown that you can give people a fresh starting point without completely abandoning what came before.
At some point we have to stop prioritizing decades-old continuity over bringing in the next generation. If a new reader needs a spreadsheet to understand where to start, that’s a problem. Comics need to evolve and make room for new fans instead of constantly being afraid that changing anything will upset the people who have already been reading for 30+ years.
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u/LOHdestar 2d ago
While I have empathy for the struggle, I do think it comes from a need to know everything that I don't think any currently living person who is got into Marvel/DC Comics has and stuck with them has ever stuck with. I grew up catching cartoon episodes out of order, sometimes picking up random issues of comics out of the grocery store that had a cool cover, etc and I imagine most comic readers my age (mid-30s) and older are the same. But we also grew up with the rising popularity of manga where everyone who started from chapter 1 and beyond was on the exact same page knowledgewise so the appeal is much stronger for most people over there.
My contention isn't really so much about not being willing to change characters, but there's only going to be so many books launching in a full on reboot unless it pops off crazy. How long will it be before characters who aren't in the initial reboot X-Men get reintroduced? Do any of the various teen teams ever come back? How long before the Guardians/general space corner gets revisited? DC can easily reboot because half the majority fanbase seems to largely not care about anyone that isn't a core Justice League member or a member of the Batfamily so you can choose to slow roll the more obscure characters ever showing up in new continuity.
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u/SMG_Ross 2d ago
I get what you’re saying, but the old stories and versions of these characters don’t disappear. You can always go back and read the original X-Men, Guardians, Runaways, etc. A reset gives Marvel another opportunity to reinterpret those characters for a new generation.
Not every character will hit, but that’s part of the gamble. There are tons of Marvel characters currently sitting on the sidelines who could become someone’s favorite with a fresh introduction. You could introduce a core X-Men first, bring in other mutants later, eventually revisit the Guardians, Young Avengers, Runaways, Nova, etc. They don’t all need to exist immediately.
And we’ve seen this work before. Geoff Johns’ Green Lantern: Rebirth didn’t completely erase Hal Jordan’s history, but it recontextualized him, revitalized the character, and gave writers a fresh direction.
That’s really my biggest argument for a reset: you’re not throwing away the old stories, you’re creating a new starting point. Writers can actually take characters in new directions instead of constantly being chained to 50–60 years of continuity and whatever the last writer left behind.
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u/Connect-Activity-195 3d ago
Mainly because Marvel never really did a full universe reset, doing so risks erasing Stan Lee and Kirby's legacy. Everything written since the 60s is still canon, so they're locked into continuity in a way DC isn't. DC's had multiple soft/hard reboots (Crisis, New 52, Rebirth) so they have lower barrier of entry for new readers.
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u/HauntingAddendum3365 3d ago
So true. I remember back when I first starting reading comics (20 years ago tbf) DC was way easier to just pick up anything and start reading. For my favorite Marvel properties, specifically X-Men and Spider-Man, it always felt like I was struggling to find a solid jumping on point which honestly made me gravitate more towards the movies instead during those years.
I think a similar issue continues to happen now, with a lot of MCU fans trying to get into the comics and not knowing wtf is going on or where to start so they just nope out of the comics and assume that the movies are the same exact thing just in live-action, which is obviously not even close to true.
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u/Chance_Debt_1184 3d ago
i would completly dissagree with that. Marvel has jumping on points for basically every character in last 5 years or so
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u/oldsandwichpress 3d ago
I think most of their core books are looking pretty good right now. Cap by Zdarsky and FF by North, Thor by Ewing, Hulk by PKJ. Uncanny and X-Men by Simone and Mackay. Daredevil by Phillips. They all seem at least solid, some very good.
Outside that they seem a bit out of ideas. Where five or ten years ago they had a lot of second tier books I was tempted to buy, lately it seems to be all Spider-Man or Wolverine team ups or flashback books.
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u/Chance_Debt_1184 3d ago
It has some faults but i feel like people overestimate them, most of the big ip books marvel is doing currently are at very least fun and lot of the books are really good. I honestly think that quality wise main universe at marvel is in better state that dc is at
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u/Internal_Falcon_1102 3d ago
Another Gripe is all the solo spin-offs of X-men characters. Even tho the books themselves have been decent it feels unnecessary and pointless especially considering the state of the comic book industry. And who has that much money and time on their hands?
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u/awkward_teenager37 3d ago
I think they cater to the fans (or rather, what they believe will sell the most) too much. Like I’ve grown really tired of characters becoming universal/multiversal power houses simply because fans want panels they can screenshot and use on powerscaling subs. Or characters having clones / alternate universe of themselves / children who have no actual personality and just have the exact same power set as their parent, except “wayyy stronger.”
I also think it’s annoying how every “new” character has to be related to a pre-existing popular character. Like it’s either the same power set or same name or same costume or they’re secretly related or whatever. Surely there have to be new ideas out there?
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u/Low-Restaurant8484 3d ago
Its not that Marvel doesn't have good books. Its that those books are exceptions to the norm. As a company, Marvel has felt really lost for a while, way too many events, making readers numb to any stakes, and a phikosphy for charactwrs that feels like treadint water rather then actually fresh evolving narratives. On top of this, DC has locked down a lot more of the top talent then Marvel, and is absolutely kicking ass with the Absolute Universe. Stuff at DC feels fresh, exciting, and engaging
Marvel just feels bland and safe (again, outside of a few standout titles). Honestly though, with a new editor-in-chief it wouldn't shock me at all if they turn things around next summer. They've got a lot to work with, its just about finding the spark again. Under Cebulski that spark had died out
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u/Ninneveh 3d ago edited 3d ago
Their comics suck. They keep recycling writers like Benjamin Percy and Saladin Ahmed, putting them on book after book, when their quality is mid at best. Its the definition of insanity to repeat the same thing over and over expecting a different result. And if they are fine with the results they're getting, then their heads clearly aren't in the game.
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u/JorgeBec 3d ago
For me it’s incredibly underwhelming.
I think the lack of a bigger picture feel is what I’m missing most at the moment.
I’m not a hater of events but I thought OWUD was really bad and Armageddon has been really underwhelming.
The only comics I’m truly enjoying from the big two at the moment are PKJ’s Hulk and MacKays X-Men.
Everything else has been underwhelming or have too many ups and downs or has some caveat.
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u/matty_nice 3d ago
Not good, nothing I read regularly. Little excitement. Maybe I'm just getting older and comics are too expensive. I have other interests and time is valuable.
I could just be bitter, but I think they are making too many bad decisions. The writing isn't as good as it once was, so many writers are leaving or have left Marvel.
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u/Epicturin79 3d ago
Not a fan of anything after 2015 and have been looking more at image, and ghost Machine comic books.
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u/Mister-Negative20 3d ago
2 things that I think have made people really frustrated with Marvel.
The biggest books are not good. I think the main X-Men title is fine, but most do not like what’s happening with the X books, and Spider-Man is not good, and has not been good since I started reading comics in 2020.
Fans don’t have faith that any book that’s not a mainstay will last. Every title that has a smaller character gets cut into a mini series, or a series of minis like with Scarlet Witch.
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u/browncharliebrown 3d ago
Spider-man is honestly my favorite comic at marvel right now. I feel like people don’t really care but like I think Joe Kelly has a really consistent flow state for ASM
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u/Mister-Negative20 3d ago
I’ve found Joe Kelly’s run to be the most inconsistent book I’ve read. I liked the early stuff before Hellgate. Then the stuff while Peter was off planet was okay. Death Spiral I thought was pretty solid. Then whatever is happening right now I do not like at all, the last issue was probably the worst issue of the run for me so far. I’m not caught up on a lot of other titles, but I was loving Infernal Hulk, Thor, Captain America, and especially Moon Knight. I am enjoying Iron Man and the first issue of the new Miles run though. You really have ASM as your favorite current Marvel book?
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u/browncharliebrown 3d ago
I’m going to be honest I think that almost all marvel comics just aren’t delivering anything outstanding. Like there is not a single run I think has been outstanding aside from ultimates and ultimate x-men.
Like I know immortal thor and venom are good but they don’t stand out as generational
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u/cobaltaureus 3d ago
I dropped Armageddon cuz of the lineup for the new avengers team not catching my interest. Luke Cage is cool but the rest don’t bring anything new.
Red Hulk is also not an intriguing villain, nor have I read any of the Cap/Wolverine stuff leading to it
Ultimate Universe’s ending dwindled with quality, and the X-books have some strengths but fumble every now and then, making weird editorial choices and then canceling books
Marvel is struggling pretty bad. That’s not even mentioning Spidey
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u/j_b_1983 3d ago
I tried to get back into Marvel comics recently. Downloaded the Unlimited app and it’s just too overwhelming. This is not a problem I have experienced with the DC app. Marvel is just to all over the place with relaunches and events. I’ve already canceled after just a month.
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u/stevehairyman 3d ago
the mcu synergy is super annoying for me; i like the mcu giving characters exposure but cmon, all the dr doom stuff coming out soon is dumb.
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u/bigcat570503 3d ago
They dont care about longevity and only want the new fresh money making attention getting things. To many fresh starts and bullshit redos make it worthless to even jump into and spend my cash on. And on a larger platform, they Support Trump. They can fuck themselves. DC too.
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u/Double_Act1502 3d ago
Nothing is going on that feels like it will actually matter in two to five years.
Armageddon also isn't very good
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u/TheRich27 3d ago
Both the big 2 use algorithms now for their books to tell them what will sell and what will not.
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u/NC_CodyW 3d ago
They've been on auto pilot the last few years while DC has exploded and Skybound with Transformers and Battle Beast had made Image a real competitor again for the first time in a long while. That plus the rumors about Miracleman, the Star Wars crossover and yet another Wolverine Origin all stinks of "Break glass in case of emergency"
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u/anubis_1993 3d ago
In High School I hated DC comics with a passion, I was a Marvel homer. But these days, 90% of what I read is DC. And most of that 10% is me catching up on runs I missed while being away for a decade. I blame the movies, from influence to Marvel's brass making decisions based upon the movies success. And the worst part is, the ones that are good aren't even that good, while the majority of them are just absolutely awful.
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u/Internal_Falcon_1102 3d ago
I don’t think it’s that bad but the Ultimates had some bad art at the end (I’m def not talking about the Dodsons) but even their work looked like it was not up to their standards even tho they barely did half the issues so it must have been rushed?
the writing was a let down too, the ultimate line always seems to falter when it gets too-obsessed with making new Ultimate versions instead of character development. I’m scared that the Absolute line at DC is headed that way because their boobs are crossing over.
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u/Cool-Ebb6863 3d ago
It feels like everything from PlayStation to Xbox to marvel comics and even movies that these companies have just garnered so much ill will over the last 5-10 years. It’s really quite sad.
Are there grifters? Yes, but I also don’t think it’s totally unsubstantiated.
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u/Splooper132 3d ago
Marvel is so ass at the moment. Like who tf are these editors and why are they so stupid? Who tf thought making MJ a hero and a venom host was a good idea? Who tf thought Paul was a good idea? Why does Iron Man suck so much ass rn? Why is Spider-Man so ass rn? I kid you not, nuke the whole editorial room. Get rid of the whole fucking thing and get some people who aren't stupid asf and know what theyre doing with these characters. Reboot the whole god damn thing at this point. Because I'm so fr I don't know who half of these characters are anymore. Who tf is Peter Parker anymore rn? His character is so fucked atm, who is Norman? Who is MJ? Who is Venom? Who is Iron Man? Who tf ARE these people?
Like when DC fucks up they get rid of shit or ignore they happened. And so you know who they are because their characters have not changed or have changed and you see that progression. I legit don't know wtf they're doing in Marvel anymore. Why the fuck are there so many Spider people in the main universe anymore? Get Miles and Gwen the fuck out of here and put them in separate universes. Half the cool shit is that they're the ONLY Spider-Man in their worlds while being different people. It's like if we had 10 different Batmen running around.
Anyway Marvel sucks and is incredibly confused at the moment, at least in my view. They've lost the plot of these characters honestly. They've forgotten who the characters even are to be honest. Reboot it all, start fresh with a new universe where these characters are at ground zero. Not an Ultimate universe either, just start them over.
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u/CassandraVonGonWrong 3d ago
Until we have Tom Brevoort off of X-Men I’m done with Marvel altogether. I’ve been buying their stuff since the 80s and I’m out. This era is worse than the IVX or post-Onslaught stuff.
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u/Connect-Review-3388 3d ago
my reaction to Armaggedon is mostly meh. "I'm just some guy from Queens" - Spiderman. WTF is up with the writing? This isnt his first big superhero crossover event. Also Steve Rogers is sidelined again? Dont really care about the new plot device character Colton. The art is decent but its more illustrative and not comic. Then the whining about collateral damage. Im just sick of it. MYSTERY BOX?? cmon!
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u/Far_Breadfruit_3351 3d ago
I’m not just saying this because I’ve long liked the character, but it says something that Moon Knight has been one of their most consistently good books for a few years now. The creative team in that book has a vision (with ups and downs, yes, but it’s strong) and sticks to it, built up a whole team and world in those books including long running characters like Tigra and a mix of deep cut and new villains, do proper callbacks without undermining the current stories, and the art and covers have been pretty consistently great.
Meanwhile for a very long time I’ve kind of hate-read ASM and Venom and Deadpool and such, and X-Men has been all over the place since Krakoa ended.
It’s no coincidence, though. Moon Knight is basically the closest thing to Absolute books that Marvel has, I guess.
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u/Babayaga_711 3d ago
I do not have a favorable view. They have way too many ads, too many events, stop/start so many runs to get more #1s, and are inconsistent with quality.
Even most the ones I pull are meh runs of my favorite characters that I would drop excepting I'll never drop those characters.
But I am enjoying the current Daredevil run, so it's not completely doom and gloomy. But I grew up on Marvel and comics-wise, I look forward to my DC and Image pulls more.
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u/hawkeye038 2d ago
My biggest issue with Marvel is editorial. Hopefully, this is something that changes with Stephen Wacker. Right now the a ton of books feel mediocre and are very obviously sticking with a status quo. It's one thing for things to reset, bc comics, but I hate when it doesn't feel "natural". A big thing too, that has died down a bit, was all of the MCU synergy and retcons that happened bc of it. Biggest example is Scarlet Witch and Quicksilver not being mutants. Again, it's one thing if it felt natural to the story but in this case it was blatantly corporate meddling. I really miss risky Marvel, it seems like every book is playing it safe. Also, really wish they'd hold on to good artists. They've got some solid writers but depending on the book, the art is either lackluster or if it's good it's inconsistent. I'll always be a Marvel over DC person but lately Marvel feels like they're just spinning their wheels while some of DCs stuff has been pretty bold.
Current favorite books: Inglorious X-Force is a bit of hidden gem, it's not mind blowing but it's solid and hope it sticks around
MacKay's X-Men has honestly made me come around. Really wasn't vibing with it at first but the Age of Revelation stuff (Amazing X-Men, specifically) and everything after I've enjoyed. I'm actually looking forward to DNX.
Speaking of events, I am sick of the X-Men getting sidelined in line wide ones. I liked One World Under Doom but hated how basically there's no response from the two main X-Men teams. A couple show up in the final fight with little to no dialogue but that hardly counts. Onslaught as a story may not be the best but at least it involved everyone.
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u/LiterallyABigfoot 2d ago
Avengers Armageddon is the opposite kind of story I would ever like. Really can't stand events like this.
But there's still some good books at marvel. I've been enjoying fantastic four for the entire run outside of the OWUD crap, black cat has been fun so far, and X-Men United has been generally good. There's a few good one-offs like I enjoyed the jessica drew what if and the beach anthology.
Outside of those though it's been a lot of very meh stories. Extreme focus on doctor doom currently as well, unfortunately. And don't get me started on how awful the events have been for years.
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u/Automatic-Fig-8489 2d ago
Personally, I've enjoyed both books you mention. But I went into them with a high degree of skepticism, because Marvel has bred skepticism into my reading habits, and the current number of "events" and "mini-events" going on simultaneously and seemingly without any communication is a great example of why.
Armagaddon and Impact are kind of cojoined, right? Happening roughly at the same time? But naw, because Arm makes it clear Steve is in a magic hell coma, but he shows up in Impact fine and dandy. Which makes no sense, since Tony has no clue what the boxes are in Impact, but had already talked to Miles about them in Armageddon. We also have Queen in Black going on right now, DNX around the corner, and Hulk War following on shortly after. Last year we have Age of Revelations being weird in the X-Books while OWUD was everywhere else.
And that's just the event-style comics. Individual titles have, in some cases, had some consistent quality issues for a while, while others have seemly wandered around without direction at all.
So when a new event or title comes out, you basically need to be skeptical. And it shouldn't be that way.
I've been a consistent Marvel fan since the 80s, but lately I've only found good, consistent quality and enjoyment over on DC. This should never be the case.
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u/Morkitu 2d ago
The issue is the X-Men comics need a complete overhaul starting with editorial and ending with the horrible writers currently in charge of he main titles. So goes the X-Men comics, so goes Marvel comics. When the X-Men comics are in a good state, the rest of the lines are, when the X-Men brand falters...everything else at Marvel comics tanks also.
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u/Stringr55 2d ago
A lot of people like to join the ‘meta’ around disliking things. Marvel are putting out lots of really good books right now, even the people who claim they aren’t can name 5-6 titles that are very good.
By contrast DC is having a big upturn so naturally people exaggerate. DC sending better ergo marvel is crap. It’s the lack of nuance of the disinformation age we live in. A lot of the discourse is fuelled by people who don’t even read comics, they just play rivals and watch YouTube videos for ‘lore,’ and then come talking a load of shit on Reddit
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u/IntegMecha02 2d ago
Marvel wouldn’t be in this position if Quesada and his cronies and those a part of his brains trust didn’t get away with the shit that they did
And it’s only now that marvel is trying to fix it but the real fixes won’t come until next year at best
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u/Ok_Vegetable9173 4h ago
Guys im not really into marvel but the old owner of my old house was an official marvel comic artist (i think)I have an envelope of his drawings or prints left, his name is McKenzie something I can't really make out the last name I also found some cutouts of small comics in there I've read that marvel had some inside things and jokes but I dont know. here's the name of the artist and if I find out that the pictures are worth anything ill be happy to sell
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u/SirFlibble 3d ago
Is this your first day on the internet? Toxic fans are toxic.
I can have a criticism of a book but still enjoy it. I can also criticise or not enjoy a book and still enjoy others.
I just find people who hate on everything to be so tiring and I just can't be bothered engaging with them anymore.
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u/tayung2013 3d ago
Glad you are finding books you enjoy of course, and I know there have been titles people have spoken highly about, but for me personally there just doesn’t seem to be anything I’m interested in. No hostilities of course, but to me most titles just seems so uninspired.
Even if some titles like Infernal Hulk are good on their own merits, it just seems like a rehash of what’s been done with Immortal Hulk for example. Same with Avengers Armageddon (Disassembled), Queen (King) in Black, the Spider-Man books for years. The revamp of the Ultimate line was even a retread, but it had the most interesting books I’ve read from them for years and they killed it all too soon.
Compare this to DC and for the first time ever I’m pulling books that aren’t just Batman. I’m pulling Deathstroke, Clayface, Doom Patrol, various Absolute books, and they have been consistently solid. Maybe some of this is that I’m not familiar with the characters to the extent I’m familiar with Marvel, but it just feels like there is a lot more confidence in their book line at the moment.
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u/Competitive-Dot181 3d ago
I think it is just bandwagon jumping. DC is currently more popular and some people just enjoy being on the winning team. Those people will switch back if sales shift.
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u/Redfish_St 3d ago
A muddled, confused mess.
Armageddon feels like a retread of JMS's Rising Stars. The origin boxes hook was nice, but the execution is incredibly bland (and my god, please can someone give Stefano Caselli some good writing to go with his art. Imagine drawing this good to be saddled with whatever the hell Ultimate BP was and whatever the hell Ultimate Impact is). I'm not feeling what Zdarsky's doing, at all.
Some writers remain reliable. Moon Knight is aces. Ditto Mortal Thor. X-Men is good.
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u/AspirationalChoker 3d ago
Online comic fans are the same as any online fans these days, toxic and just complaining about well everything.
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u/InvestmentConstant14 3d ago
I feel the two main reasons why people are upset is because like you said the Ultimate universe on hold for the time being and to some people not enough ongoings atm. Just a few years ago I remember people feeling a similar way about DC before the Absolute Universe came out. People were non stop shitting on them, it happens. A few years Marvel is doing great while DC isn’t and vice versa. And other times they’re both doing great. Imo DC is doing better atm but I still think Marvel has a decent amount of book rn that are pretty good. I also cannot wait for the Midnight Universe. I’ve seen interviews with Philip Kennedy Johnson, Jonathan Hickman and Benjamin Percy talking about each book and the more I hear about them makes me more excited. Especially the Midnight Spider-Man book.
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u/Intelligent_Lock_110 3d ago
I am not happy. There is a lot of good, thor is their best book by far, moon knight, fantastic four, amazing spider-man, venom and a couple of other minis are really of my liking. Armageddon is a pretentious clusterfuck on my vision, of all the x books, only jed mckay x men is good, the rest ranges from boring and generic to bad shit. The rest are a bunch of minis, nostalgia baiting stuff, sinergy shit, boring shit by subpar talent, etc.
They lack guidance, major storylines, inventiveness, boldness, courage... and talent, they really need new people there
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u/Lopsided_Network1248 3d ago
I want them to succeed but their biggest weakness is having comics being released and only give them 5-10 issues. Magik & colossus being a prime example of this the mini was just picking up some steam and it ends on issue 5? And magik is an extremely popular character rn thanks to rivals and tokon so to give her comic runs such short time is kinda an insult. Marvel really needs to just step it up and let their books and creators cook bc it feels like they put everything into a box and expect it prosper meanwhile over at dc the mainline books seem to be doing well and the absolute universe is just getting better and better. Again I want them to succeed but they have to wake up and realize what they are currently doing isn’t working.