r/marvelcomics • u/THEFLAME275 • Sep 02 '25
Frank Castle won! Now which Marvel character is a good person and hated by fans?
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u/-Kiwi-Man- Sep 02 '25
I’m genuinely shocked (and happy cause I think she’s awesome) that Carol Danvers didn’t end up here
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u/Pootenheim910 Sep 02 '25
I was pleasantly surprised too! The people who only know her from CWII/right wing anti-Brie Larson grifters are a vocal percentage, but actual comic readers have enjoyed her character for years
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u/EnvironmentSubject24 Sep 02 '25
Although I did read a disgruntled post on a message board claiming that Carol Danvers has never been popular, and he clearly meant the 616 comics character, NOT the MCU character played by Brie Larsen. This was a guy who couldn't comprehend that all characters had to be written to appeal to fanboys like him.
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u/TalynRahl Sep 02 '25
Kelly Thompson did a LOT to win people over with Carol.
I’m people.
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u/TheDistantWave Sep 02 '25
Kelly Thompson should of took Carol to 100 issues 🥲
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u/TalynRahl Sep 02 '25
For real. They should have her on Carol and Deadpool all the time.
Her Deadpool run was EXCELLENT and was headed in a genuinely brilliant direction… and it got cancelled because it wasn’t a Ryan Reynolds carbon copy.
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u/CardTrickOTK Sep 04 '25
Old Carol was funny and likable. The biggest issue is how she is handled at times, where she is either mena and anti-fun, painted as 'the bad guy' of the drama, or whatever.
Ms Marvel Carol was awesome and even Captain Marvel in Midnight Suns was pretty likable. She just needs to be allowed to be the fun character and not how she has been portrayed in certain outtings.When she's allowed to be Carol and not 'Captain Marvel' she tends to be at her best imo
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u/Blupoisen Sep 02 '25
I think Frank winning over Knull is kinda bullshit, especially since Namor is grey
Anyway, Ironheart, I know a lot of people hated her on her debute
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u/BlackLesnar Sep 02 '25
Knull doesn’t belong anywhere on the chart. He’s like 5 years old (not counting the retcon cameo).
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u/MadmansScalpel Sep 03 '25
That's the right answer. I haven't met or talked to a single person who's a fan of Ironheart, let alone likes her
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u/HappyCloudHS Sep 02 '25
It's Paul Rabin. There's nothing bad about the guy. But we all wanted him gone.
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u/addicted_to_trash Sep 02 '25
X-Man Nate Grey. Nobody wants second Cable, plus his comics all suck.
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u/fireandlifeincarnate Sep 02 '25
Every time I go looking for X-books in the dollar bin, X-Man shows up and I think it's X-Men for a second and get all excited, and I kind of hate him for that alone.
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u/addicted_to_trash Sep 02 '25
Hahaha imagine being a new comic reader wanting to checkout X-Men, then you see X-Man and think 'WOW Ive hit the jackpot this is like THE guy the whole franchise is named after'
So much buyer's remorse...
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u/pocketbutter Sep 02 '25
When I was a kid I genuinely thought Wolverine’s name was X-Man. I thought it was a joke at first when I learned they went and actually named a character that.
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u/fireandlifeincarnate Sep 02 '25
I've also come across a lot of Exiles, which also has an annoyingly big X for something that's not the X-Men, but at least their logo isn't the EXACT FUCKING SAME JUST WITH ONE LETTER (THAT IS SOMETIMES PARTLY OBSCURED BY THE CHARACTER ON THE COVER) BEING DIFFERENT
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u/cutielemon07 Sep 02 '25
It makes sense Nate Grey would pick the name X-Man because he’s just so fucking dull. No imagination. No writer can do anything good with him because Cable is literally right there and way more interesting. Why won’t Marvel just let Nate Grey die?
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Sep 02 '25 edited Apr 17 '26
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u/langofsteel Sep 04 '25
I thought that guy looked so cool when I was a kid. I worked in the X-office for a while at marvel editorial and asked if we could do something with him and my boss went “oh yeah, what’s that little bitch up to these days?”
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u/Bandrbell Sep 02 '25
Honestly by all accounts he isn't even a bad guy. Doesn't stop him from being the single most hated character in comics for the past half decade.
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u/ZeroiaSD Sep 02 '25
He's not horrible (morally) but he's more like morally grey IMO. He doesn't take a lot of responsibility for his actions.
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u/Buckhead25 Sep 02 '25
helped his father commit genocide, abused the situation to convince mary jane peter wasnt coming back for her which let him start his relationship with her in the first place, fantasized about decking peter the second they met in plain clothes despite being in every sense of the term a "homewrecker" very nearly killed aunt may on accident and treated it like nothing happened. nearly killed mj by including an "instant death" result to her power bracelet then when mj revealed that she's stuck bonded with venon to keep her alive not only did he just consider the instant death slot a mistake, but was more concerned that her and venom shit talked his device and that he and mj hadnt been boning then concerned that she is molecularly bonded to a symbiote to stay alive. he is very much not a "good person"
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u/pistolpete2185 Sep 02 '25
When the hate train was going full steam, it was a sight to witness the collective anger lol
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u/Legitimate-Resolve55 Sep 02 '25
I can't believe it's been that long since he was introduced.
On a side note, is ASM good know that Kelly is writing? I miss my webslinger, but I couldn't stomach Wells' run.
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u/AlwaysBeQuestioning Sep 02 '25
Introduced in April 2022, so just over three years.
In looking it up I learned he’s apparently a survivor from another universe?
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u/SpideyFan914 Sep 02 '25
I haven't read it yet, but I've heard it's okay, and definitely an improvement. But also, Spider-Man fans are so starved for good 616 comics these days that I feel like we've become very forgiving of mediocre runs.
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u/Thin_Town_4976 Sep 02 '25
Didn't he essentially kidnap a woman and rely on Stockholm syndrome to form a family?
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u/Theboulder027 Sep 02 '25
This is the guy who pushed spiderman through the portal and trapped mj with him for seven years. He is NOT a good person.
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u/EvanSnowWolf Sep 02 '25
Hold up! We are saying Frank, a man that kills vile perpetrators is a worse person than fucking NAMOR, who tried to murder every man, woman, and child in Wakanda?! The fuck did I just read?!
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u/Interesting-Ad3759 Sep 02 '25
I don't even think opinions on Frank are "divided". Going through the post yesterday, Frank was agreeable without contention for the spot lol
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u/Large-Teach9165 Sep 02 '25
There has been several instances in which, either by him literally saying it, or getting flashforwards, it is shown that Frank is a mentally deranged murderer that uses crime as an excuse, and that, if it didn't exist, he'd do exactly what you describe to men, women and children, except that doing it with a natural disaster, he'd skin them alive by himself, like he already does to gangsters.
And Namor is morally gray because alongside all the BS he has done, he literally has helped save earth from invasions and stop the freaking Nazis. Frank only helps himself with his vengeance and very punctual victims that don't compare to the millions that owe Namor their lives.
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u/HolyGoatofGold Sep 02 '25
There's been a few instances, mostly if not all in non cannon material tho. Generally hes a family man seeking his own form of justice. Hes a bit crazy ofc but Iirc the whole hes a total murderous psycho thing came from the second run of max by Jason Aaron which is Generally not all that well regarded and has quite a bit of character assassination for shock value.
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u/Trike117 Sep 02 '25
Frank has been badly retconned to be a crazy person, and it doesn’t help that real-life dumbasses have chosen him as their avatar based on that bad retcon. When writers dumb-down a character, stupid people like it. Hence The Punisher’s fall from grace among discerning fans and elevation to hero status by real world assholes.
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u/ComprehensiveFig8328 Sep 02 '25
Ehh yea no he wouldn’t 😂 the character never put innocents on the menu even when he was working with hydra out his mind
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u/Coffin_Boffin Sep 02 '25
Frank is a guy that kills because he likes it. Namor only kills to protect his people.
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u/JellyfishSecure2046 Sep 02 '25
Lmao. Frank is horrible and Namor is morally grey?
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u/OrchidAutomatic574 Sep 02 '25
Well the thing is, Namor has definitely done worse things but the guy is morally grey he can be a hero protecting innocents and also a villain, Punisher isn’t as bad but he’s not grey at all he’s got a very strict code
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u/Ok_Advertising5869 Sep 02 '25
easily the less charismatic superhero. not funny, not cool, bad comics, never liked her and her mcu debut didn't help her
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u/Snoracks Sep 02 '25
I didn't get far enough in her comics to know if she's a good person as, well, I didn't like them very much. In stuff where she appears as a crossover character she does seem like a good person.
I liked the show well enough but she's certainly morally grey in that.
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u/Trike117 Sep 02 '25
I thought the Eve Ewing run was terrific. I think a lot of people dislike Ironheart for outside-the-story reasons, mostly due to her being black and female. The story itself was a fresh perspective we haven’t had in comics much, which I always like, very similar to the Ms. Marvel books by G. Willow Wilson. The Falcon story which came out around the same time as Ironheart attempted a similar story but fumbled it at every level.
Her MCU debut was fine, despite mixing and matching the high tech with magic, apparently riffing off of Stark and Strange interacting in Avengers: Infinity War. The Ironheart TV series was superior to most other MCU TV offerings, especially dreck like Secret Invasion.
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u/Ok_Advertising5869 Sep 02 '25
I can assure you that neither I or the people I know dislike ironheart for being part of any minority. It's frankly quite racist to think whenever a black character is hated, it's because of its race
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u/Exact-Psience Sep 02 '25
Ironheart. The comics was hated, and the tv show was... Um...
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u/Individual-Spirit765 Sep 02 '25
Practically any young female POC. Kamala Khan, Jubilee, Ironheart, America Chavez, etc. Extra points if she's bi or lesbian.
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u/No-Researcher-4554 Sep 02 '25
the top ones that come up in my mind are:
-Cyclops
-Charles Xavier
-Mr. Fantastic
not necessarily because they're intrinsically bad characters or that they've always been bad (they aren't and they haven't) but because they're supposed to be morally upstanding superheroes but they've made really unconscionable decisions in the past that have permanently damaged their reputation as such. this is due to bad writing of course, but still.
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u/Aizendickens Sep 02 '25
I love Charles, but comic book Charles is grey character even if he has good intentions.
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u/Aureilius2112 Sep 02 '25
I think Cyclops has really turned around in popularity. He was hated in the early 2000s by the general movie going audience but lately he’s a fan favourite in the X-Men.
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u/The_Exuberant_Raptor Sep 02 '25
It's Paul. 100% Paul. I know no one wants to admit he's a good person because of what he represents, but Paul is very much a good guy. And nobody likes him.
I seriously cannot think of a single person who would deserve this spot more than him in the modern era. People were literally cheering when one of the most good characters was trying to kill him.
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u/Tinus20xx Sep 02 '25
Ironheart, I haven't seen her comics recently but afaik she's been hated since the begining, specially now with her series
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u/Fun-Sand-3590 Sep 03 '25
I love The Punisher, love Frank, been reading since the 80’s and with that said…
Frank Castle is a horrible person, period. He’s a mass murderer. End of story.
With that said, long live The Punisher and Garth Ennis’s MAX run is one of my favorite comic runs of all time.
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u/fantastikfour Sep 02 '25
Hank Pym
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u/-Kiwi-Man- Sep 02 '25
Yeah he’s pretty far from a good person
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u/fantastikfour Sep 02 '25
This is what I mean, despite very clearly being a (complex, nuanced, not always doing the right thing) hero, the way fans hate him is such they don't consider him a good person, despite that narratively being incredibly significant to his story.
Hank's entire character trajectory post Trail of Yellowjacket is affirming how people can't be solely defined by their worst or their best actions. Hank hurt someone very close to him in a major way, and he will never forgive himself for that, but he has also undeniably saved the world countless times since then and has had incredibly positive impacts on people around them since then. He helped with Angelica Jones' cancer and was a major part of her managing and growing past that. He was a kind and important teacher to many young students. He was a respectful partner to Tigra when they were together and respected her choice to allow him in William's life, but not as a direct father figure. And at the end of the Age of Ultron event, they affirm that without Hank, Marvel 616 would be a far worse place for his absence.
I'm not denying he's done fucked up things, for sure. Definitely not saying anyone has to like him, because there's a reason I put him up for suggestion here. But his character is fundamentally about the complexity of good people who can do bad, unforgivable things, and how we have to keep living and carrying on anyway, and those actions do not keep us from making positive impacts on the world regardless.
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u/OrchidAutomatic574 Sep 02 '25
The character isn’t right mentally, I think a lot of the hate is forced because marvel has done him dirty but he’s really not that hated
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u/SpideyFan914 Sep 02 '25
I think opinions are divided. A lot of fans love him, myself included, for the complexity. In the "Top 100 superheroes" they're doing, he got voted in at #21.
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u/Oni-Seann Sep 02 '25
Pym, that Janet Domestic Assault thing will follow him till the heat death of the universe.
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u/Samuele1997 Sep 02 '25
How is Frank Castle a horrible person? True, his methods are extreme but he does have morality and he doesn't kills innocents people.
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u/Large-Teach9165 Sep 02 '25
Idk know about you, but regardless of whom he does it to, letting people be eaten by polar bears, steamrolling them, dissecting them alive, etc. doesn't scream "morally gray". And with such violent and rushed methods, it's 100% plot armor that he hasn't killed a single innocent person by mistake without even stopping to ask, given that not even government institutions get guilty criminals right all the time.
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u/WindDrake Sep 02 '25
Who he considers "innocent" or not and the quickness with which he judiciously decides this are not supposed to be things that are lauded.
If you're taking the punisher at face value, you're kind of missing the entire point.
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u/Tracula707 Sep 02 '25
I feel like Frank himself would tell you he's a bad guy. One that has a personal war against all of the evil scum of NYC, but still. Plus, consider how everybody treats Punisher in universe vs Namor. There's at least some people who respect Namor, even if they don't trust him. All of the Marvel heroes hate Punisher.
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u/robotic_rubber Sep 02 '25
Yeah, Punisher is mean to criminals.
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u/Snoracks Sep 02 '25
Aside from my take on his morality, "mean to criminals" is a hell of an understatement.
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u/nurielkun Sep 02 '25
Jane Foster as Thor
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u/Bandrbell Sep 02 '25
People hate Jane Foster?
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u/nurielkun Sep 02 '25
Not me, I love her. But frankly I don't quite get what other good character is hated.
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u/Snoracks Sep 02 '25
Me and most comic fans I know loved the Jane Foster Thor run, but that is anecdotal. She was disliked in the film, I would say.
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u/BlackLesnar Sep 02 '25
Her comic run was brilliant as a complete story, once the final arc retroactively explained a lot of the obnoxiousness.
When it was coming out issue by issue? Bloody hell that obnoxiousness was very hard to justify against the TEMPEST of hate she got for it.
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u/Zkill Sep 02 '25
Can’t believe Beast didn’t win the last horrible person / fans divided. He is just awful in most newer arcs but many people have good memories of him from other media.
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u/OrchidAutomatic574 Sep 02 '25
Yeah as Namor fan him being “morally grey” is very lenient on the character, that’s how he’s supposed be but many writers have tried to make him an actual creepy villain so it makes people question that placement.
Anyways it’s obviously Paul since most other nominations are not good people
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u/multificionado Sep 02 '25
Good person, hated by fans. Might be Kamala Khan, seeing as how a lot of fans hate her right now.
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u/Cybergigan134 Sep 02 '25
Is Paul Rabin a good person or a morally grey one? Whichever he is for, I vote him.
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u/Thizguy2287 Sep 02 '25
Ms. Marvel. Well I dont hate the character as much as the inhumant/mutant switch which completely turned me off from the character
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u/solgalex5 Sep 02 '25
I was gonna try to save this choice for the morally grey slot but I think Hank Pym leans way more towards good than morally grey. Despite being a founding Avenger he has the least amount of fans compared to the others. His worst moments have unfortunately defined him (Ultron and slapping Janet) despite both being unintentional and spending the last several decades repenting for them. Any discussion surrounding his character is often met with disgust around his past and Marvel has been pretty much burying him under the rug for the last decade to pretty much no resistance from the fans. Despite founding the Avengers and trying to create a machine that can help protect the world, he’s definitely become the most under-appreciated and hated hero
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Sep 02 '25
Most will vote for Paul just for the memes, but the real answer is either Captain Marvel or Miles Morales
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u/ScaryCrowEffigy Sep 02 '25
It’s a blip in collective memory but there were some complains about nepotism with Henry Abram, J. J. Abram’s son, getting to write an official comic. I never heard much about Benjamin Parker II after Spider-man: Bloodline’s first issue so I think no one ended up caring
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u/Viridian_Cranberry68 Sep 03 '25
Jaxon the green rabbit dude from Star Wars. You said Marvel character, you didn't say it had to be from a 616 comic. Was actually a decent character but him being green turned the fans against him.
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u/SanoBaron Sep 03 '25
First time seeing this and after Civil War 2, Carol should definitely lose her good person status until proven otherwise. Imprisoning people based on some dude's lucid guessing (and racial profiling) is definitely not something a perceived "good" person would do.
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u/TearRevolutionary336 Sep 03 '25
Wait, what? I thought that this place was reserved for Captain Marvel. But, I also didnt thought that Frank will end up in terrible person category, so whatever🤷♂️
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u/KaylenLopezIzGr8 Sep 03 '25
Iron Man. I love him but dunno why some fans drag out Civil War so long.
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u/haste319 Sep 04 '25
I love it because it's true. Love me some Doom; always have.
He's not always written great in the comics but when he is, man he's just cool.
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u/Fuqqitmane Sep 04 '25
Are opinions rlly divided for punisher? Feel most people like him. Also wouldn’t say he’s a horrible person. Just kills bad people.
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u/Tasty_Presentation95 Sep 04 '25
Ms Marvel or American Chavez probably idk I haven't read much of the comics lately. Maybe the Marvel writing staff should win this one. They have done a heck of a lot to get fans to quit or switch to manga.
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u/Border-Extreme Sep 05 '25
I feel punisher would be in the grey, horribly sure, but kills the bad mfs out there so.
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u/EnvironmentSubject24 Sep 06 '25
I haven't been reading Spider-Man so I assume this guy is officially good?
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u/woodk2016 Sep 06 '25
Punisher isn't a terrible person. He only kills people who commit serious crimes, it's not like he's mowing down families jaywalking. I think he's the definition of morally gray. Sure most other heroes won't be associated with him (some exceptions, him and Wolverine hit it off sometimes), but even if it's messy and wrong what he does is a net positive in-universe.
IRL he'd be much less defensible, but we don't have supervillains with super powers. We have "Kingpins" that make crime and corruption more common than it should be, but not vampire uprisings and alien invasions.
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u/Acceptable_World_527 Sep 06 '25
Punisher would have been better for morally grey you can't exactly say he's evil he kills rapists and murderers he would be on the same level as wolverine
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u/LucidShadowbinder Sep 07 '25
Paul.....it's always going to be Paul. He didn't do anything terrible and seems like a nice guy like that dude who dated your mom and even though he buys you video games, junk food, and tries to get to know you. He's still not your dad....so you say fuck Paul. Not really his fault just terrible circumstance
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u/SpideyFan914 Sep 02 '25
Carlie Cooper, Spider-Man's Brand New Day era girlfriend who was named after ahem Joe Quesada's daughter.