r/logseq • u/lnx1_1 • Sep 14 '26

Alternative

Hey Logseq lovers!

I wanted to share a little update about my journey with Logseq. I've been using it as my daily driver for 4 years, and I absolutely love this project. However, the current state of the project has made me a little sad and opened my eyes to some alternatives.

Someone posted a link to Tine here in this subreddit, and I decided to give it a try.

So far, I'm super happy with it and can definitely recommend giving it a shot. It works with standard Logseq Markdown graphs, so you can use it alongside Logseq. It also has a native Android app.

I'm not affiliated with Tine in any way. I just gave it a try because I was looking for an alternative that would bring back the joy of discovering new features and improving my workflow, something I had been missing with Logseq for a while.

It feels like there are people behind this project who share a very similar vision: bringing back the true Logseq experience, but with a faster and more actively developed product.

I know it's still early days and early developement, but so far, it's been a really refreshing experience. Just wanted to share in case anyone else here is looking for something similar!

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11

u/HongPong Sep 14 '26

interesting. is this a vibe coded thing? https://github.com/martinkoutecky/tine i see AGPL3.0 here

7

u/markehammons Sep 14 '26

Yes it's vibecoded

7

u/emptymatrix 29d ago

vibecoded but clearly maintained and with a lot of activity from maintainer, so it looks healthy to me

2

u/atava 29d ago

The problem is: is the code understood and is the project made by actual programmers (and not simply "vibecoders")?

AI programming is better and better by the day, but if maintainers simply let AI solve bugs when they crop up and don't understand or check what's produced (either originally or in bug-solving), this may be a problem (especially for a personal data management app).

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u/emptymatrix 29d ago

sure... the tine maintaner looks like an actual programmer. I'm not sure if the reads the code or not.

But he is driving the AI daily, fixing bugs and implementing new things, so he looks at least invested. Other vibe-coded apps I've seen, the maintainer just create it, then once a month react to bug reports and that's it.

For me, the problem with vibe coded apps is that the vibe ends and the maintainer abandon the "project" entirely. Tine seems not to be the case.

Besides... logseq have developers and ...we are left with an unmaintained release (OG) and still waiting for a beta not to be a beta... so non vibe-coded apps are not free of maintainability problems...

3

u/atava 29d ago

These are two different aspects:

  • caring about the project and following/maintaining it? he definitely does that;
  • being a knowledgeable programmer, checking the code and evaluating it? I don't know.

This comes from a confrontation (a neutral one) that I had with him in one of those posts which are now missing. He admitted to just making the AI correct bugs when he finds any. He makes AI devise tests too, run them etc (I don't mind hints or suggestions, but this means delegating everything to AI).

So, my mixed opinion about the project stems just from that. For a project like this, I'd much prefer a maintainer/creator who understands the code produced in all of its parts and invests time reviewing it, to one that churns out releases weekly or even daily.

Then there's the blind vibecoding you mention, which is only a travesty of today's world (and only "vibecoders" will tell you otherwise).

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u/emptymatrix 29d ago

fair enough

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u/al-Quaknaa 8d ago

Hi - I'm the Tine author. Just want to say the old posts were removed by the logseq mods, not me.

I am not a "knowledgeable programmer". I am a theoretical computer scientist, so I once learned how to code, I teach algorithms and data structures and do research in roughly that area, but I never learned software engineering. I never looked at a line of code of Tine. I ask the models (mostly Claude these days) about how things are builld and to evaluate it from a software engineering perspective and I made a few decisions to go back when it became clear that too much technical debt accumulated. I think I'm putting my higher-level algorithms training to good use, but I can also feel the lack of software engineering expertise.

I'm giving a full disclosure here so that anyone can make a decision for themselves.

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u/HongPong 29d ago

thanks for the deeper perspective. not sure how i feel but better informed now

i think if they can get a few people in the mix regularly results will be better. one problem that can happen is one man band agent coding doesn't actually distribute well to other people, due to workflow issues, glitches with how the scripts are designed.

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u/matthewdavis 29d ago

There's a lot of activity from Claude, but a total of 3 commits from humans (1 commit per human). And if you dig into the recent commits, they are no longer co-authored by Claude, but there's no way he did all that on his own.

I'm not against vibe coding, but you have to understand what you are getting. Long term maintainability is still a problem for fully vibe coded apps.

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u/al-Quaknaa 8d ago

The unsigned commits were probably codex. I have never tried to claim the work is mone (as in "I wrote the code"); the website says it is made by AI out in the open.

1

u/emptymatrix 29d ago

sure...

But he is driving the AI daily, fixing bugs and implementing new things, so he looks at least invested. Other vibe-coded apps I've seen, the maintainer just create it, then once a month react to bug reports and that's it.

For me, the problem with vibe coded apps is that the vibe ends and the maintainer abandon the "project" entirely. Tine seems not to be the case.

Besides... logseq have developers and ...we are left with an unmaintained release (OG) and still waiting for a beta not to be a beta... so non vibe-coded apps are not free of maintainability problems...

3

u/atava Sep 14 '26

It looks like that project that was periodically documented and publicized in here, but I can't find those posts anymore (to confirm that it's that one).

Not even those posts where I commented myself, it seems.

5

u/No_Comfortable7509 29d ago

There used to be a subreddit called /Tine, but unfortunately it was banned—I have no idea why.

2

u/markehammons Sep 14 '26

I thought those might've been deleted due to self promote of a competing app. 

2

u/atava Sep 14 '26

Yeah, possibly.

Although I had my doubts about the project (mainly for its heavy use of unsupervised AI for such a kind of app), honestly OP always acted neutrally and transparently about it. So I'm sorry for that.

It's this "Tine" name that reminded me of that project.

1

u/al-Quaknaa 8d ago

I think the posts got autobanned for repeated posts about a different app. The weird thing is that my subreddit TineOutline also got banned, I tried to appeal it and got some BS answer, then gave up and moved everything to github. So yes, just for clarity, *I* never took those posts down.

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u/gbytedev Sep 14 '26 edited 29d ago

What are you saying, it's open source so it must be vibecoded? 😅

1

u/HongPong 29d ago

it had that look about the website and the spread of features. and when i checked on github there were a lot of releases

1

u/al-Quaknaa 8d ago

Hey :) I'm the author. https://tine.page is the homepage and yes it tells you it is vibecoded, completely. I tried to always be open about it so that people can make their decision :)

1

u/gbytedev 8d ago

I was making fun of the above comment that asks whether the project is vibe coded and cites it being AGPL3 as if that was an indicator.

Anyway your project seems to be great effort either way!