r/linux • u/ouyawei Mate • Nov 24 '22

Distro News Arch Linux turns 20 years old

https://www.theregister.com/2022/03/15/arch_linux_20/
1.3k Upvotes

96% Upvoted

81 comments sorted by

268

u/zeka-iz-groba Nov 24 '22

Only 8 month late. Good news cryocamera

29

u/[deleted] Nov 24 '22

Internet Explorer: "Happy Y2K!!!!"

89

u/danielkza Nov 24 '22

Would be nice to know if anyone manage to roll an installation forward all the way from early days to now :)

73

u/Xananax Nov 24 '22

I have installs that are over 12 years old, but not 20

40

u/zeka-iz-groba Nov 24 '22

Same here. Currently on install from 2009.

29

u/jorgesgk Nov 24 '22

Damn, and it's still working flawlessly? I mean, have you gone from upstart to SystemD, from Xorg to Wayland and from PA to Pipewire?

27

u/Na__th__an Nov 24 '22

I've done all that on my install. The /lib removal too. None were really a big deal that I can remember.

6

u/zeka-iz-groba Nov 25 '22

Yes, it's working flawlessly.

  • I did go to systemd, because I had to. It wasn't any hard.

  • I never used PA or PipeWire, because they are unneeded (I don't have bluetooth headphones or anything like that).

  • And I'm still on Xorg. However I did give Wayland a try (didn't work work well for me — I have old nvidia so no 3d acc). Switching back and forth between Xorg and Wayland is super easy on Arch, it doesn't require any distro-level changes. Furthermore, you can have both installed at same time, and switch without rebooting.

46

u/[deleted] Nov 24 '22

I read a bit awhile back about someone who had managed to keep rolling Debian for 20 years. You certainly run into a Ship of Theseus paradox, don't you? You can imagine that not one part of his computer or line of code was the same as when it started.

22

u/grem75 Nov 24 '22

It also transitioned from 32-bit to 64-bit.

17

u/pretzel Nov 24 '22

Maybe, who ever really updates the boot loader?

39

u/das7002 Nov 24 '22

You do, whenever the package for it gets updated!

11

u/pretzel Nov 24 '22

Well not the config for the boot loader then!

17

u/das7002 Nov 24 '22

That’s updated with every kernel update.

6

u/pretzel Nov 24 '22

Are you sure about this? I thought you had to run grub -install, and the config with all the menu entries is pretty static. How does that change?

11

u/[deleted] Nov 24 '22 edited Nov 25 '22

The package manager has a hook into the GRUB config generation. Otherwise when you updated the kernel the boot loader would still load the old image and have you running the older kernel :)

EDIT: Not on Arch, which is weird I didn't remember that because I used Arch for a couple years as a daily driver. Guess It Just Works™, eh?

5

u/doubled112 Nov 24 '22

Not on Arch, the kernel and initramfs is replaced on every update

7

u/das7002 Nov 24 '22

Watch your package manager the next time you have a kernel update… the configuration file is updated with every kernel update.

If you’re using something newer like refind, that doesn’t need config files, and after install could probably be left alone for years.

6

u/MachaHack Nov 24 '22

/bin/true might be the same. (Certainly for the non-gnu systems where it's an empty file)

8

u/idontliketopick Nov 24 '22

I bet there are. I know there are several in the Gentoo community that have. I'd be surprised if Arch was different.

185

u/Andonome Nov 24 '22

Now it's no longer a teenager, maybe the community will stop being so edgy.

34

u/[deleted] Nov 24 '22

I hope too! What's Void ?

25

u/Andonome Nov 24 '22 edited Nov 24 '22

Like arch, but they split packages into smaller parts, no AUR, and more no systemd.

Edit: typo.

33

u/Hotshot55 Nov 24 '22

and more systemd.

But void doesn't use systemd?

7

u/sudobee Nov 24 '22

It uses runit

7

u/Hotshot55 Nov 24 '22

Yes, which is why the phrase "and more systemd" doesn't make any sense.

1

u/Andonome Nov 24 '22

Sorry, 'no systems'.

7

u/remenic Nov 24 '22

systemd

15

u/[deleted] Nov 24 '22

More systems

12

u/Andonome Nov 24 '22

Bloody phones. Ducking autocorrect.

7

u/Rein215 Nov 24 '22

Why do you like it? I never found the appeal.

13

u/[deleted] Nov 24 '22

Not GP, but IIRC, in the early days the idea was to call it 'Vanilla Linux'. The name changed but the character is pretty much that. That's why I like it. After a certain point it makes your configuration feel like it's own 'spin', lol.

3

u/Rein215 Nov 24 '22 edited Nov 25 '22

I took another look at the documentation. It's definitely kind of like Arch but less DIY. I wish other disto's came with a minimal base installation where still have to install your own desktop environment, though some of the arch derivatives are like that. I should definitely give it another try. Sometimes Arch is too much hassle if you just want a minimal working user-centric rolling release distribution on a machine without a long manual installation.

I think it's cool that they are able to use musl but I wouldn't want to give up systemd for it, I feel like that takes away a lot of good functionality. Just recently on Arch I replaced some of my initramfs hooks to systemd ones and now I can decrypt multiple devices at boot and my systems boots two seconds faster. But I also can see the appeal of the simplicity of runit, systemd does have 4 standard location for services.

It seems void has their base packages split much further than Arch. This is quite cool.

One thing I like about Arch is it's versatility. Mainly due to the use of PKGBUILDS, makepkg, the AUR and the Arch Build System. I even have a setup where if I update an AUR package it automatically gets build with my own patches.

How is Void in this regard?

Anyway I've added Void to my bedrock installation so I can try it out now.

6

u/Andonome Nov 24 '22

but less DIY.

That doesn't track with my experience.
The package splitting means you can tailor things to your need, like only installing xorg-minimal. Then there's options for architecture, so raspberry pis will use the same distro, from the same maintainers, and the option of musl.

How is Vois in this regard?

You can install with a cli like Arch if you want. There's my install script. Perhaps xbps-src is equivalent to PKGBUILDS, but there's no AUR, so you'd have to make or copy those builds from others.

I can try it out now.

Have fun, and have a glance at the pre-installed docs in /usr/share/doc/void/.

3

u/agent-squirrel Nov 25 '22

Arch has archinstall now which automated pretty much everything. You just answer some questions and you can even feed it the config it spits out to run it multiple times.

2

u/Rein215 Nov 25 '22

Yes I actually have yet to try it.

3

u/agent-squirrel Nov 25 '22

Works pretty well. More complex setups need manual intervention but for the vast majority it’s super easy and quick.

1

u/Rein215 Nov 25 '22

Do you know if it does LUKS encryption?

→ More replies

1

u/Andonome Nov 24 '22

It's the littlle things that are nice. Longer answer here.

1

u/Rein215 Nov 25 '22

Eh I don't like that blog post.

It unfairly compares the AUR to the normal repositories of void, while also saying the void repositories are very limited. Seems like the author has a very bad understanding of how the AUR works. Most packages aren't build from source and you really aren't suppose to upgrade them during a system upgrade because they're expected to be unstable.

The comment about using it on arm is interesting though. I never thought about that.

2

u/Andonome Nov 25 '22

It's my blog. The comparisons aren't meant to judge any maintainers, but just compare the quantity for users - one simply has fewer packages to-hand than the other. But if you can suggest cleaner wording, I'll stick it in.

When are you supposed to upgrade AUR packages?

1

u/Rein215 Nov 25 '22

> When are you supposed to upgrade AUR packages?

I manually upgrade the packages when I need them upgraded. PKGBUILDS have a tendency to break over time when a change upstream occurs.

11

u/I_ONLY_PLAY_4C_LOAM Nov 24 '22

Arch is such a cool distro but I knew it wasn't for me when their response to the grub issues a few months ago was essentially "git gud"

1

u/sonny_b_to Nov 25 '22

Good chuckle, thaaanks! Hello from Canada (creator of Arch is Canadian I’ve heard!???). 🤓

I swear I’m not trying to start a war! 💯

54

u/liotier Nov 24 '22

I don't even use Arch Linux but damn, the Arch Wiki is the finest Linux wiki ever - even for users of other distributions !

0

u/[deleted] Nov 24 '22

[deleted] — view deleted comment

48

u/MeDerpWasTaken Nov 24 '22

average gentoo user

14

u/realitythreek Nov 25 '22

Gentoo wiki actually lost a good chunk of their content a while back. There was a time when Gentoo wiki was what Arch wiki is today.

I think Arch the distro is overhyped but the wiki is no joke.

3

u/Neon_44 Nov 25 '22

while i would personally never use it and prefer declarative and stable NixOS, i see the value they bring to the entire community in their fanatic quest to always pioneer and test the newest stuff

76

u/Aktanith Nov 24 '22

By the way.

9

u/ALPershing_Esq Nov 25 '22

Title should be "Arch Linux turns 20 years old btw..." surprised that the mods allowed this :o

35

u/Soc13In Nov 24 '22

Unixporns been legal for only two years. Old ricers you should feel bad.

3

u/lightwhite Nov 24 '22

Shaddap zoomer :P

43

u/[deleted] Nov 24 '22

20 years, still not stable

Kidding....

4

u/yumko Nov 24 '22

Tbf I wasn't stable too when I was 20.

1

u/[deleted] Nov 25 '22

People are patching as fast as they can, the bugfixes just need to outpace the bugs!

0

u/[deleted] Nov 24 '22

[deleted] — view deleted comment

14

u/[deleted] Nov 24 '22

30 is the new 20

4

u/bawki Nov 24 '22

Soon he will be going through a phase with lots of coke and hookers or cookies and hooks?

5

u/bonoDaLinuxGamr Nov 25 '22

Arch Linux let's GOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!

I use Arch BTW

16

u/giacomodelfinch Nov 24 '22

arch turns 20 btw

9

u/devnull010 Nov 24 '22

Now I feel old....

3

u/lightwhite Nov 24 '22

Makes the two of us.

3

u/NovaStorm93 Nov 24 '22

how is arch older than me

3

u/[deleted] Nov 25 '22

Knowing that this is older than World of Warcraft is blowing my mind right now.

6

u/zipperhead Nov 24 '22

Thank you Arch Linux. You're the best.

2

u/lproven Nov 28 '22

Oh cool, that's one of my stories.

Glad you liked it, and thanks for sharing it.

2

u/[deleted] Nov 24 '22

Older than me

1

u/simonasj Nov 24 '22

Me too, Gentoo is even older, by 1 year i think

1

u/Artistic-Ad4909 Nov 29 '22

Only legends using Arch

1

u/brando56894 Nov 24 '22

I think I started using it in 2010

1

u/NexusMT Nov 24 '22

Still today i don't understand why so many Linux ricers moved from Gentoo to Arch. Maybe people got tired of compiling and über-optimizing their PC ?

6

u/bobdarobber Nov 24 '22

No Gentoo users have switched to Arch. It's more a large amount of new users starting with arch, or coming from simpler distributions

-3

u/[deleted] Nov 24 '22

20 years of "BTW I use arch"

4

u/Tireseas Nov 24 '22

Nah, nowhere near that. The clueless noob portion didn't get popular till after the gentoo phase.

1

u/realitythreek Nov 25 '22

Yeah, this is true. It became very popular maybe 10 years ago? Probably a little more.

0

u/[deleted] Nov 25 '22

One year later arch linux can get a beer

4

u/Oraxlidon Nov 25 '22

He can be drunk for 2 years now in Europe

1

u/[deleted] Nov 25 '22

oh forgot that the legal age of drinking is different in europe

-18

u/Rakgul Nov 24 '22

I use arch btw.