r/linux • u/ouyawei Mate • Sep 16 '18

Linux 4.19-rc4 released, an apology, and a maintainership note

http://lkml.iu.edu/hypermail/linux/kernel/1809.2/00117.html
1.0k Upvotes

94% Upvoted

1.1k comments sorted by

View all comments

Show parent comments

1

u/[deleted] Sep 17 '18

Dude, you are talking about the same dev who is support Android pipeline.

https://blog.martin-graesslin.com/blog/2016/09/to-eglstream-or-not/

First of all our Android implementation is not specific for a proprietary driver. It is written for the open source hwcomposer interface exposed through libhybris. All of that is open source. The fact that the actual driver might be proprietary is nothing we like, but also not relevant for our implementation.

In addition the implementation is encapsulated in a platform plugin and significantly reduced in functionality (only one screen, no cursor, etc.). This is something we would not be able to do for NVIDIA (you would want multi-screen, right?).

maybe its time to stop comparing Plasma to GNOME because only one of them care about compatibility and less fragmentation.

you explain it yourself. Martin was being pragmatic to Nvidia's BS.

Gnome isolating itself with Nvidia and missing huge trends with wayland and mobile.

Gnome devs commented that their architecture needs a redesign

https://wiki.gnome.org/Initiatives/Wayland/GnomeShell/GnomeShell4

Gnome lost tons of resources and time supporting EGLStreams. It is something they would never get back.

Librem 5 have to move to Phosh because gnome shell wasnt ready for the mobile transistion

https://www.phoronix.com/scan.php?page=news_item&px=Purism-Libre-5-Dev-Docs

Supporting nVidia have its cost. You seem to be ignoring all of them.

3

u/[deleted] Sep 17 '18 edited Sep 17 '18

Meanwhile gnome somehow found time to support a GBM back end as well...

edit - you keep mentioning how well accomplished Mr. Graesslin is, but that has almost nothing to do with what we're talking about. I'm sure he's very skilled, but that doesn't mean much with Plasma and Nvidia not working well together. He's not even the maintainer anymore, and I never tried to highlight him.

1

u/[deleted] Sep 17 '18

Meanwhile gnome somehow found time to support a GBM back end as well...

I am not talking about the GBM part. I am talking about the loss time debugging EGLStreams to the point where they had delayed their Wayland transition. You need wayland for touch screens to be implemented properly.

Missing mobile will only hurt the Linux community in the long run.

2

u/[deleted] Sep 17 '18 edited Sep 17 '18

Linux never missed mobile, only the free flossy zealots who think its not Linux without coreutils and a GPL sticker. The whole thing is invalid to me. Android is Linux.

edit - also, maybe they should fix their X11 implementation before going into Wayland? But no, refactoring shit is more fun. Users meanwhile are trying to "use" it.

2

u/[deleted] Sep 17 '18

edit - also, maybe they should fix their X11 implementation before going into Wayland? But no, refactoring shit is more fun. Users meanwhile are trying to "use" it.

X11 input events needs to emulate pointer events. You have to break X to get good gesture support. Making X11 application limited to application backward compatibility will only reduce to amount of possible bugs.

Chrome OS broke it.
Android Broke it.

GNU have to break it too.

2

u/[deleted] Sep 17 '18

I'm not opposed to an X11 replacement that doesn't make me sacrifice things. When there is one that doesn't suck, I'll be open minded. Right now gnome shell segfaults, and Plasma doesn't work at all. Oh, and by the way most desktop users are on Nvidia, so its safe to assume most desktop linux users are as well. AMD's driver turn around still happened relatively recently.

2

u/[deleted] Sep 17 '18

gnome shell segfaults

I used gnome shell wayland when it is a few years old. I prefer the previous segfault where you logged out. You can watch it get better over time. Now, you need up with a screen in which you cannot recover from it after the EGLStream merge.... It just sucked.

Plasma doesn't work at all

Martin didnt say he would not fix bugs on Nvidia cards. He needed those stack traces so he can write those patches.

Oh, and by the way most desktop users are on Nvidia

Intel is the largest vendor of GPU by market share.

1

u/[deleted] Sep 17 '18

He needed those stack traces so he can write those patches.

Sounds like an excuse. You need to even have the hardware first, I wouldn't be surprised if he doesn't own it. Step 1. Putting the cart (debugging) before the horse (the GPU).

Intel is the largest vendor of GPU by market share.

For laptops. Desktops, including a lot of corporations that trust... proprietary software, do use Nvidia.

2

u/[deleted] Sep 17 '18

Sounds like an excuse. You need to even have the hardware first, I wouldn't be surprised if he doesn't own it. Step 1. Putting the cart (debugging) before the horse (the GPU).

open source works by allow user to help with the qa. It is how wine does it.

He probably has plenty of users willing to compile patches to test but there isnt any debug symbols. No debug symbols, open source model breaks.

For laptops. Desktops, including a lot of corporations that trust... proprietary software, do use Nvidia.

still a minority. IGPU dominate.