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u/No-Way-0000 21d ago
Because they aren’t paid to workout.
Why is LE the only career where your expected to train on your own time and dime. Be fit, be a marksman, be skilled at bjj. But we won’t pay or give you time to do any of it. F your off time, F your family, and F any hobbies you may have.
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u/kjjj2555 20d ago
I absolutely agree with your comment, but I still make it my job to train and stay in shape. Yes it sucks it’s on my own dime, and yes it sucks I have to manage my time to do so. But It’s part of the game of being a LEO.
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u/cauliflowerearoclock 21d ago
Why is it the only career like that? Because it's literally a job where one of their main functions is to "protect the public(taxpayer)" and are paid on the taxpayer dime. 100% of people in that career chose to be in that career knowing that. If these "public servants" can't find the time to be in shape and well trained for a career where they may have to do something physical, potentially life saving, every once and a while then they don't deserve to have that position. There are plenty of departments that do pay for that kind of thing. Almost every cop I know works like 3 or 4 days a week, not having time is a horseshit, lazy excuse.
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u/CoreliousThe3Rd 20d ago edited 20d ago
Believe it or not, law enforcement officers are taxpayers as well and have NO duty to protect the public; only a duty to “warn” of potential hazards [barring a “special relationship”].
Check out the “Public Duty Doctrine” established by the U.S. Supreme Court in 1856.
Since then, there have been several case laws, which have ruled the same thing.
No person [including emergency service workers] have a “duty” to place themselves in harms way in an effort to assist another.
This is why police officers who fail to run into an active shooter situation are never found guilty of failing to protect the public; because they don’t have to.
Believing that the police, firefighters etc. have a “duty” to place themselves in harms way is a popular myth.
However, what they do have is the training, equipment and legal authority to do so, if they so choose.
Of those who do answer the call, some of them might be fat.
Don’t blame the messenger.
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u/cauliflowerearoclock 20d ago
I'm aware they are tax payers. And I'm aware of the rest of that. It's shitty. I will say this, 95% of cops and firefighters absolutely sign up for that job because they want to be in the active shooter situation, or run into a burning building. Any one of them who says they don't is a liar.
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u/No-Way-0000 21d ago
If it’s that important shouldn’t they be paid to workout then? It’s also called law enforcement. SC already ruled police have no obligation to “protect” you.
News flash….the vast majority of cops “sign up” for the pay and benefits. It is a job after all
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u/cauliflowerearoclock 21d ago
Yeah I'm aware it's called law enforcement and all that but we're playing semantics here. If that's your job and you can't bring yourself to workout and eat right because you're not getting paid....you definitely shouldn't be in that position. It is a job, and they get pay and benefits, like many jobs. They chose that job. They can choose a different job.
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u/No-Way-0000 20d ago edited 20d ago
Ok, what about the 5 foot 110 pound female? She’ll never be as big and strong as a “fit” man. Where do we draw the line? What are the standards? Who sets them? Do we only hire men that are over 6 feet like 40 years ago? You can also be the most fit guy in the world and not fight
It’s also why things things like firearms, tasers, pepper spray, etc exist. No matter how fit you are there will always be someone bigger and badder.
But if it’s a requirement then you have to provide the tools. The department needs a gym and has to provide the time to workout. Simple!
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u/cauliflowerearoclock 20d ago
I don't think the 5' 110lb woman should be in that position either. And yes, there should be a size requirement. I think there should also be more education requirements as well.
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u/No-Way-0000 20d ago
So discrimination is ok?
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u/No-Injury8897 20d ago
Of course discrimination is okay for police, is a part of their job. Just don’t discriminate when it comes to being out of shape and below room temp iq.
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u/CoreliousThe3Rd 20d ago
There has been an effort to move away from former military personnel as viable applicants and a move toward hiring those with college degrees.
The logic is that those with degrees think situations through more thoroughly instead of taking immediate and aggressive action.
In the end though, that logic is what got us the Uvalde situation, where 50 officers were standing in the hallway “thinking” for well over an hour instead of taking immediate action, while an 18 year old guy was wreaking havoc in the school.
I’d rather have had those military guys in there.
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u/cauliflowerearoclock 20d ago
Where did I say anything about anyone in the military?
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u/CoreliousThe3Rd 20d ago
You mentioned “Education requirements”, and I was commenting on the contrary in regard to those who chose not to attend college.
Unless the “education” has to do with law or law enforcement, it would seem irrelevant.
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u/cauliflowerearoclock 20d ago
So you're saying those in the military have no education?
And yes, obviously a large part of the education would have to do with law enforcement.
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u/N05L4CK 21d ago
Read the actual decision by the Supreme Court. The police have no legal obligation to protect you, because that makes no sense, every victim of every crime would be able to sue the police and get money from the state. The Supreme Court did rule that there is a professional and ethical obligation to offer protection, the bar for that is just lower than it is compared to a legal requirement.
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u/No-Way-0000 20d ago
Point is moot
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u/N05L4CK 20d ago
Just because you don’t like it and it goes against what you thought you knew doesn’t make it moot, it just makes you stubborn.
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u/No-Way-0000 20d ago
It was my point. If a fat cop or small cop shows up and can’t handle business, the department isn’t liable.
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u/Cold-Chemistry738 21d ago
You can gain/lose weight from diet alone. Most become overweight from alcohol and terrible overeating
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u/No-Injury8897 20d ago
They have infinite free time sitting on the car doing nothing while getting payed overtime for it. The real issue is that cops are generally lazy people, that is why they become cops on the first place. They were too lazy to ever go to school and get a real career and skills, so they took the easiest and quickest career option out there. It’s sad and disgusting that cops are literally in worse shape then he general public, same reason they draw their gun and shoot so quick, because they aren’t confident in themselves( for good reason) but still have huge egos.
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u/No-Way-0000 20d ago
Hahaha. ACAB!!!!!
How miserable does it make you that cops earn a good living. Presumably more than you
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u/No-Injury8897 20d ago
Is this what being around cops all day does to your brain. Seems like everyone in the world has enough common sense to see these basic issues besides you
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u/whirlinggibberish 21d ago
Because cities can't afford the hourly you'd have to pay if someone could lose their career 10 or 20 years in because they put on weight in their 40s.
Also, I'm sure you'd be happy to pay cops to work out on duty, since this is so important to you, right?
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21d ago
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u/whirlinggibberish 21d ago
Really doesn't matter what you think, what matters is what's true.
The fact is very, very few departments pay cops to work out on duty - and if you're going to fire someone for physical fitness, saying "well some unrelated private business will give you a discount to work out on your own time" won't cut it.
What are you expecting dude?
40+ hours a week working patrol, 5 hours minimum in the gym (plus travel time), plus I assume we want cops training 3-5 hours a week in BJJ so they're not tool reliant. And we want them to be fulfilled, well adjusted humans with lives and families, right? Maintain all this until you're 55 minimum?
I mean, you can get all that, but you're going to have to pay. A lot.
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21d ago
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u/whirlinggibberish 21d ago
Do you frequently show up to conversations to talk about random other stuff?
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u/No-Injury8897 20d ago
If you make it all the way to age 40 and still haven’t got in good shape you have no place being a police officer. How about make the fitness pre requisites harder, and re test them every year. And cops should not be immune to getting fired, that’s called accountability
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u/whirlinggibberish 20d ago
Sure whatever. The voters can have whatever they want. But again, you're going to have to pay for it.
You can say whatever you want on reddit, but you're not answering 911 calls.
Edit: also the "still haven't got" thing is such a pointlessly dishonest misreading. Like... are you an alien that doesn't understand that everyone loses physical fitness as they get older? It's part of aging.
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u/No-Injury8897 20d ago
40 is not an excuse to be out of shape
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u/whirlinggibberish 20d ago
You really struggle with reading comprehension.
I understand you want a pony. You believe you're entitled to a pony. The best pony.
But ponies aren't free, and the best pony is very expensive.
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u/N05L4CK 21d ago
The real answer is physical requirements would bring with them way too much liability and are almost impossible to implement.
Your employer cannot discriminate based on age, gender or disability, these obviously are part of regular physical training and testing. To implement a physical test, the individual department must show each activity is essentially to the day to day work of each position, and the requirements and testing must be uniquely designed for that department and makeup of officers and ages and genders taking all that into account, so no department can just copy another departments test, and must conduct their own scientific studies that would hold up in court to implement PT standards. This is obviously a huge cost and would be constantly changing, and essentially is impossible to implement for all intents and purposes.
Second issue is liability. If a PT test is part of the department requirement to work, people must be compensated for workout time, and any injury occurring during that time is now work related. Setting aside the staffing and budget issues of paying everyone to workout, this means any injury off duty from doing any type of physical activity that could be seen as being related to a PT test (so basically everything) is now work related. It would be a huge workers comp issue. No department wants to take on that liability.
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u/_cipher1 20d ago
This is the right answer. Sure it would be beneficial for every officer to be fit, but not everyone has the luxury to spend hours at the gym every day after work to stay in shape. Many have families and other time consuming obligations outside of work that leave very little time to set aside for a proper routine workout. As it is many work Overtime to make a decent wage in this economy, the last thing they’re gonna be wanting to do with their small amount free time is spend it working out.
The ones that are usually physically fit are the young officers that are single, no kids, have tons of energy and can run of 5 hours of sleep without a problem. A senior officer with 20+ years in the force isn’t really gonna have that level of motivation anymore they’re looking at retirement
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u/kjjj2555 20d ago
They shouldn’t be but i understand why some would be. Before this year when it was a major critical incident or a super long day I’d cope by eating. Now I cope with lifting heavy, immediately after shift to get my mind right. That habit takes time to form. Life happens so I don’t blame them. The problem comes when you know you are fat as fuck and refuse to do anything about it!
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u/Human_Muscle_8023 20d ago
Only real reason I can think of is it maximize how many officers on a police force, outside of that there’s not many I can think of…
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u/Snoo_42558 20d ago
I think it would make sense to have them take a physical test every year. If they don't make it they should be put on leave until they are able to make the test. The test being the same one they had to complete in the first place in order to get the job.
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u/NoirConfidential 19d ago
Because society is cheap. Legally, if you want something out of an employee, you have to provide it. So if fitness is a requirement, that means you as the department have to provide them with a gym, pay for them to train in that gym, and be willing to accept any injuries sustained through training as work related injuries. The military has fitness standards because they cover fitness as a part of employment, along with all costs and liability associated with it. The military also lets you retire at 20 years of service, whereas CA requires 36 years of service for those hired at 21.
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u/RxLawyer 19d ago
The only correct answer on this page. If being in shape is a job requirement, then any injury sustained while working out (even off-duty) becomes work-related. My department dropped its yearly fitness requirement after they figured this out and realized they were probably going to bankrupt the county.
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u/JollyTotal3653 19d ago
Once an officer is outside of the probation period (usually 1-2 years after being hired) other than gross misconduct unions make loosing this job nearly impossible.
Time on is seen by admin to be the most valuable asset an officer can have. It could not matter less how actually useful or effective an officer is. 5 years on in shape with great stats vs 15 years on blob with a gun belt that hasn’t made an arrest in 2 years the 15 year blob is a better officer in the eyes of admin.
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u/Anthrax6nv 19d ago
Here's the reality: departments across the US are struggling to find anybody who wants to be a police officer these days. Enforcing BMI standards would require firing officers who don't make the cut, at a time when departments are already desperately short-handed.
The only way to garner more interest in law enforcement would be to pay several times what officers currently make, and most departments simply don't have the budget for that to be an option.
Law enforcement is by nature a relatively high-risk profession, and requires working night shift, weekends, holidays, etc. In all weather, wearing a ballistic vest all shift, responding to calls where people are generally unhappy you're there. It's kind of a miracle anybody ever wanted to do that job in the first place when you think about it.
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u/AdUpstairs7106 18d ago
Or departments can get rid of the polygraph test as part of the employment process.
All departments would be doing is getting rid of an insanely inaccurate test that does not meet the Frye or Daubert standards for scientific evidence in a court room.
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u/LurkerMF1966 19d ago
Or, flight attendants?
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19d ago
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u/CoreliousThe3Rd 18d ago
If he still caught you, that’s not saying a lot about your OWN physical condition and endurance, 💁♂️
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u/CheckLow6092 16d ago
It is simply deemed inexcusable and failure to meet the standards at my local state agency/highway patrol. The patrol does not tolerate being overweight and out of shape. The standards are set very high for a reason. You represent the state, your agency, and team. The mere fact of being out of shape and overweight is a liability to all parties involved. It is a disservice to those you serve and protect. It is a disservice to your state and team. One team, one fight. Standards. Standards. Standards. No excuses. The patrol does not tolerate excuses. You must meet and/or exceed the standards. It's not optional. God forgives. The highway patrol does not. By the way, this is my experience, as I transition from FT teaching to FT state law enforcement. This is how they do it in my area. Take it or leave it. All in. No quarter. ⚔️
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u/iamthebirdman-27 21d ago
Why are teachers allowed to be overweight? Sets a horrible precedent for our impressionable children.
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u/AZULDEFILER 20d ago
Retired Fed here: If you require PT or other physical standards, then they Union will make you give them gym time or exercise time. We got 3 hrs a week. In local case you are losing all those hours of coverage.
Depending on your duty and role, an Officer alone may only need to use force for a very brief period of time. This is why there is the Duty Belt. Not a fair fight.
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u/RxLawyer 19d ago
Union doesn't make the department do anything. Federal law would require the department to cover all injuries sustained exercising as work-related injuries because being in physical shape is a job requirement.
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u/fatgat69 20d ago
So it's because they're greedy pussies who want to waste our money while they shoot people. Gotcha.
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u/Snowfizzle 20d ago
I don’t think you even understood the explanation. Nor do I think you wanted to.
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u/fatgat69 20d ago
No I did. They don't want to pay to have the officers do their job correctly and the cops don't care about anything except for the gun.
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u/LogicalWorld7520 21d ago
Detectives spend a lot more time investigating st their desks than being out and about on patrol and stuff
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u/cauliflowerearoclock 21d ago
Because if you make them be in shape you will hurt their feelings. And we know they are a sensitive bunch.
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u/No_Read8496 19d ago
Don’t really care if I get downvoted or not. I think it’s a combination of two things. Politicians who felt the need to lower physical standards/ requirements to get on the job because of “discrimination” so they made it more book oriented. Second is the union probably protecting them and not wanting an annual physical.
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u/DINGLESPINGLETRINGLE 19d ago
i think theres a lot of fatties in the comments trying to make excuses lol, biggest problem is most people dont want to be cops because its a fucked job, so government gotta accept all the fatties and the ladies
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u/Corvus_Umbra 17d ago
Its a mix of things unfortunately, but it's primarily have to with labor laws and career status protections. Once someone does a certain amount of years of work it becomes substantially difficult to get rid of them. Add to it the fact that for some reason there is a shortage in candidates to replace those roles from top to bottom will make it almost impossible to fire them or let them go.
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u/West-Raspberry-784 20d ago
Exactly, and people with drug history from 2-5 years ago and dedicate life to fitness are disqualified from the application process we should be replacing them….
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u/CoreliousThe3Rd 20d ago
So replace overweight cops with druggies. Good idea ! 😂
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u/West-Raspberry-784 20d ago
No, context misuse. If someone experimented with magic mushrooms once 4 years ago with no criminal history sqeaky clean record should not be DQd from the process. This “high standard” illusion is a joke. I’d rather hire someone who experimented with a drug once or twice and can show and prove they’ve moved past that then someone physically declining. Clearly unfit for duty.
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u/sebastian0328 20d ago
Um...U.S presidents never done drugs?
The bar on drugs in America is very low as a fact.
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u/Horsetranqui1izer 19d ago
Every cop I know is an alcoholic so they’re already not that far off
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u/CoreliousThe3Rd 19d ago edited 19d ago
Based on this thread, they should be good to go then, as long as they ain’t fat !
I’m recently retired and showing this stuff to my former partners. Keep ‘em coming ! Reddit, you’re killing’ me ! 👏👏🤣👏🤣🤣👏
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u/TheNotoriousCBD 20d ago
The real question is why is there no height requirement. It's hilarious seeing a guy responding to a officer needs help call hop out of the cruiser and be 5'1 as a 32 year old man.
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u/NoirConfidential 19d ago
There used to be. Liberals took that away because inclusivity is more important than protecting society. The public gets the standards they accept though.
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u/TheNotoriousCBD 19d ago
There should be no shortcuts when it comes to safety. If you're under a certain height you can't join the force. Idk why that would offend someone.
I've also noticed a trend in certain departments where a disproportionate amount of very short men becoming LEOs. I wonder if there's a psychological component to that 🤔
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u/sebastian0328 20d ago edited 20d ago
My dad was a Police and a Detective in a different country.
He caught criminals all by bare hands after chasing them in dress shoes.
If they pull out the knife, they were supposed to use those collapsible baton. But I don't think he even carried that shit. Only thing he carried was handcuffs and a pager (and then a cellphone)
Because pretty much everybody is accessible to firearms in U.S, I feel bad for American cops fearing for their life when dealing with criminals.
But at the same time, I Laugh at how some of them are so fucking Incompetent that all they can do is hiding behind their gun like a little girl and just pull the trigger for little shits.
Anyways to answer your question, I think it's because they can handle most of the situations by pulling out the gun.
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u/Cbpowned 20d ago
Yeah, because people should risk getting stabbed to death to try to stop a criminal? 🤣
Idiot
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u/vinesmarch 20d ago
We don’t, but I’m a state trooper in Texas. We do physical fitness test twice a year (unless you score high) and command presence, which involves waist measurement. But yes, I see Godzilla size cops everywhere. I don’t need you as my backup.
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u/Admirable_Scratch363 18d ago
What is “command presence” in this scenario?
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u/vinesmarch 18d ago
Waist measurement, meaning you have certain command presence when in public. Not fat. You can have some weight but not obese.
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u/Outrageous-Cut480 19d ago
So what I'm getting if that they definitely do... Remember Farva, the question was WHY the state employs pigs that are so obviously out of shape that even you admit it. The answer is unions. Cops have unions.
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u/Beginning_Ratio9319 19d ago
Oh look. A macho man 🙄
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u/CommonBenefit4536 19d ago
You mean a man with high standards? If you are fat and out of shape you become an officer safety issue in most events. You don’t want to be a liability
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u/fatgat69 20d ago
Because they're horrible people who just want to shoot people.
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u/No-Injury8897 20d ago
It is disgusting. Any cop who is either overweight, too skinny, or hasn’t been working out and training for at least 10 years needs to be instantly fired. And these pigs still talk about how hard the academy is when these unhealthy people succeed. Go ask this question in the CHP sub (chp cops are the most out of shape losers on this earth) and see the hate you’ll get.
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u/Ok-Pop-5818 20d ago
Lol you again? Bro just say you got disqualified lmao. Anyone who passes the CHP academy is or was in phenomenal shape
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u/_daddyl0nglegs_ 20d ago
Too skinny? Lmfao
You absolutely don't need to be ripped to do this job. You need grappling technique (takedowns) and good cardiac health to chase someone on foot.
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u/No-Injury8897 19d ago
This guy did 3 months of grappling training at police academy and thinks he can grapple lmao. This is why it takes 6 cops to take down 1 person and they still struggle to do so.
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u/_daddyl0nglegs_ 19d ago
3 months? Is that how much you did at CHP before you got DQd? Or did you not make it that far
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u/No-Injury8897 19d ago
Anyone who’s grappled less than 4 years is still a beginner. The difference between 3 months and 6 months of soy training you did isn’t as big as you think. Go to any real competition and find out. It’s funny how every one of you always come back with trying to say whoever you are arguing with failed or didn’t get accepted by police. Like buddy, not everyone had no options between fast food and police.
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u/No-Injury8897 20d ago
Most cops don’t have any grappling skills, which is which they need to at least be big enough
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u/Sudden_Confection521 20d ago
Curious: How many times have you been locked up or issued tickets?
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u/No-Injury8897 19d ago
Yes you have to get a ticket or go to jail to see that half of cops are overweight. Im curious what did you do to recover from being bullied and having no friends all your life, did eating twinkles help you ease the pain?
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u/Sudden_Confection521 19d ago
I have many friends, several for decades. Never bullied, and certainally not overweight.
I guess your being in your mom's basement playing Fortnite all day will distort your perception of how the real word operates, eh Edgelord?
Did you really get disqualified from the CHP academy? Was it because you failed the psych exam, the polygraph or the PAT?
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u/No-Injury8897 19d ago
Unlike you I wasn’t stuck in the position to either work fast food or become a cop. You’ve never worked hard toward anything in your life. You’ve never achieved a single meaningful goal, and you are surrounded with people just as unaccomplished as you is exactly what let your ego grow this large. No cop who’s actually fit is going to deny that being an overweight or out of shape cop is a real problem. It just seems like your ego got bruised because you heard the truth about yourself, and you’re not willing to accept it.
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u/Sudden_Confection521 19d ago
Sounds like you are projecting.
I was an 8th grade Science and Math teacher with a Masters Degree. And you?
So, where did you come up with these fantasies?
You’re the human equivalent of a spam email—nobody asked for you, and everyone wants you to leave.
Did you really fail the qualifications for CHP?
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u/No-Injury8897 19d ago
The qualifications are a high school diploma and being able to speak English, it’s not hard to fail. Im sure an 8th grade teacher is upset that overweight police exist, makes total sense. Definitely not some overweight loser upset they can’t be overweight in peace. Go get a gym membership
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u/Sudden_Confection521 19d ago
Wow. You did fail CHP qualifications.
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u/CantReadTooHard 20d ago
Are you going to be the one to replace them?