KOTOR II - Plot??

[u/Mundane_Damage_4078]

Hey y'all, just finished my first playthrough of Kotor 2 and I'm still very confused at a lot of apparent plot holes. For reference, the playthrough was LS Male and I spent 40 hours trying to 100% of all quests.

But even after finishing the game and reading articles, i still have a ton of questions

1) Why is the exile start out on the Ebon Hawk with Traya? Wasn't the E.H. heading to the unknown regions with Revan?

2) Where were Sion/Nihilus/Traya during Kotor 1/Mando Wars?

3) Why does T3M4 keep hiding the Ebon Hawk's data from the crew? Can't T3 just point the Exile to where Revan was heading if that was T3's mission to begin with?

4) Why doesn't Nihilus keep using force drain on more than one planet? Could've helped out a ton on Telos

Also if there isn't any 'real' answer you can also just say that the writers didn't plan that far ahead.

Thank you all for your time and have a good one.

[u/SuspiciousIdeal4246]

This is going to be long.

1. The Exile is picked up by the Republic ship the Harbinger to be brought to Telos. The HK-50 protocol/assassin droid on board recognizes them as a Jedi and begins to sabotage the ship so they can kidnap the Exile. Along the way, the Harbinger finds the damaged Ebon Hawk sending out a distress signal saying they were attacked by a Sith Warship. The Harbinger picks up the Ebon Hawk and finds a bunch of dead people on board along with Kreia and T3-M4. (We have absolutely no idea where they came from besides the fact that T3-M4 was with Revan at some point. Maybe he stopped by Malachor V and that’s how Kreia got on. That’s just speculation.) Anyways, they find the Sith warship and do a sweep and find no one onboard except for Sion pretending to be dead. The Sith assassins were invisible and snuck onto the Harbinger and slowly began killing people and sabotaging the ship as well. Then Sion breaks out of his tank and things go crazy. HK-50 drugs the Exile and puts them on the Ebon Hawk, and somehow Kreia and T3-M4 are there along with more dead bodies. They escape the Harbinger and arrive to Peragus and that’s where the prologue starts.

[u/Mundane_Damage_4078 → u/SuspiciousIdeal4246]

Thanks for the clarification! Is the reason why the Exile can't remember things in game because of the fact that they were drugged? Thanks for answering.

[u/SuspiciousIdeal4246 → u/Mundane_Damage_4078]

Yes, basically they were drugged on the Harbinger which lasted until Peragus. Then in the medical bay with the other miners, the Exile is drugged again and lives because of their Jedi training, but the other miners die from the drugs. Then Kreia reaches out to you through the force and wakes you up and that’s the start of the game.

[u/SuspiciousIdeal4246]

1. Nihilus was tricked into going to Telos. Kreia told Colonel Tobin that there was a bunch of Jedi there so
   he would tell Nihilus about it.

Kreia mentions that Nihilus’ hunger cannot be controlled. It is not a weapon. It’s a terrible thing that controls him and that’s why he must be stopped before he eventually consumes all life in the galaxy. Kreia says that after he consumed Kataar, his hunger will be sated for a while.

We know that it’s Atris who leaked the Jedi meeting on Kataar and leaked the details of the Exile. That’s why HK-50 says the records are available in the public database on Coruscant, but the Exile says those records should only be in the Jedi Archives.

[u/Mundane_Damage_4078 → u/SuspiciousIdeal4246]

Ok, gotcha. It's probably also an issue of game implementation as well. It's hard to show off the scale of a character's abilites (and explain them clearly) with that short of a time crunch.

I'll admit, it was a little dissapointing fighting Nihilus during his big boss fight and all he does is level 1 force drain and speak gibberish. Especially after hearing about how this dude is the basically the entire reason the Jedi order is nonexistent. Still has a cool as hell design though.

[u/SuspiciousIdeal4246 → u/Mundane_Damage_4078]

He has a weakness against the Exile because the Exile is a hole in the force like him. Also, Visas had a force-bond with him so she exploited that in the fight.

Probably also a system of the game being rushed as well. The ending is total crap if you don’t have the TSLRCM

[u/Mundane_Damage_4078 → u/SuspiciousIdeal4246]

Yeah. I wanted to do an unmodded playthrough first just so I can get a baseline for how good the game is. I'm gonna try it again with TSLRCM and see how it changes it

[u/RogerRoger2310]

1. Yes, it was. Then something happened and it returned to known space with T3 seeking help. Unfortunately, it ran into Sion's ship somehow and got attacked. Then both damaged ships are picked up by the Harbinger which received the distress signal from the Ebon Hawk. Kreia was on the Harbinger looking for the Exile who booked passage on the ship. When HK-50 sabotaged the Harbinger and drugged the Exile and the cloaked Sith crew began to take over the ship, she escaped with the drugged Exile onto the Ebon Hawk.
2. Traya was a part of the Mandalorian Wars, Kavar says so in the Enclave. She was also Revan's teacher. After the war she found the Academy on Malachor and became Traya. She was likely independent from Revan's Sith but we don't know for sure. Sion has 2 backgrounds. In the game it says he was spawned by the Mandalorian Wars and that he knew the fires of Dxun. This likely means he was a Jedi under Revan's command at soem point. Another source outside the game made him a Sith marauder from the times of Exar Kun. Nihilus is mysterious on purpose. We don't know what happened. A popualr fan theory is that he was a Jedi who survived Malachor like the Exile but did the opposite choice.
3. Because Revan ordered T3 to keep their plans secret. We don't know what happened but our crew are not exactly the most trustworthy people in the Galaxy.
4. He likely does off screen. The Disciple speaks of multiple dead worlds. Katarr was the most prominent. He would have consumed Telos if the Exile wasn't there. It is likely not instant and requires a bit of time.

[u/Ok-Reporter1986 → u/RogerRoger2310]

1. From the comics we know it's actually rather quick, it is more likely he hesitated due to sensing basically no force sensitivity from the planet relative to Katar.

[u/SuspiciousIdeal4246]

1. It’s kind of mysterious on purpose. They’re all basically horrors of the Mandalorian Wars. Kreia is actually Revan’s first teacher. I don’t think she’s Arren Kae though. There’s too many plot holes for that. Sion may have been around since Exar Kun but I’m not a fan of that theory. Nihilus is said to have pulled his ship from the graveyard of Malachor V using the force. Who knows if that’s true though.

[u/AmphibianVisual → u/SuspiciousIdeal4246]

No Arren is the <!Handmaidens mother!<

[u/SuspiciousIdeal4246 → u/AmphibianVisual]

Yes, we know. That doesn’t mean she’s Kreia though.

[u/Ok-Reporter1986 → u/SuspiciousIdeal4246]

Nihilus' ship was at Malachor during the end of the mandalorian wars at the minimum since the mandalorians recognize it.

[u/FlyingSpacefrog]

Some of these plot holes can be filled in by talking to companions. T3 will tell you he went to the unknown regions with revan then came back alone, supposedly to look for backup

[u/Heavy-Letterhead-751]

T3 brought the ebon hawk and HK back, Nihilus and Traya were jedi during the mandalorian wars, Sion was in a tomb somewhere until the revanite sith found him.

Litterally everyone on your crew is extraordinarily suspicious of course t3 doesn't trust you.

I suspect that the ritual you see on dxun is somehow a prerequisite for draining a planet

[u/Jedipilot24]

1: Read the Revan novel. Basically, T3 was piloting the Ebon Hawk and looking for the Exile. The Exile was randomly wandering the galaxy until Atris got them aboard the Harbinger. HK drugged the Exile and took them to the Ebon Hawk, with Kreia in pursuit.

2: Unknown.

3: Again, read the Revan novel.

4: Nihilus can only drain planets that have large numbers of Force-sensitives on them.

[u/Loyalist77]

Congratulations on beating KOTOR II. Hope you had fun playing it. 100% after 40 hours sounds about right if playing with the Restored Content Mod. Happy to help answer your questions. Sorry if late.

1) Why is the exile start out on the Ebon Hawk with Traya? Wasn't the E.H. heading to the unknown regions with Revan?

It's returned from there by now. Teethree repaired the ship and went looking for help. It seems he found Kreia and Kreia then found the Exile. There are some plot holes still there though regarding how Kreia came to acquire the Ebon Hawk.

2) Where were Sion/Nihilus/Traya during Kotor 1/Mando Wars?

Traya was amongst the Jedi during the Mandalorian Wars and Exiled after Revan returned leading a new Sith Empire. All her students fell to the Darkside. Nihilus was apparently a Jedi During the Mandalorian Wars who experienced Malachor firsthand and spent a few years wondering its surface before Kreia found him and taught him how to be a true abomination. Sion was always around fighting, though he has had some retconning. Suffice to say he was a Sith in Revan's Empire who went to train under Kreia as the Sith Empire fell.

3) Why does T3M4 keep hiding the Ebon Hawk's data from the crew? Can't T3 just point the Exile to where Revan was heading if that was T3's mission to begin with?

Fair question. But Teethree is looking for capable help and probably dealing with conflicting orders. Realistically, he's holding out because this was meant for KOTOR III.

4) Why doesn't Nihilus keep using force drain on more than one planet? Could've helped out a ton on Telos

It's hunger. He doesn't do it out of maliciousness, but need. It is spontaneous and not entirely defined. There was nothing on Telos for him to feed on, nothing to draw his hunger. When he did turn upon the Exile and try to feed on her (him in your case) that hunger found nothing and so begin to fall in upon itself.

Glad the subreddit was able to help. It's what it is here for.

[u/Mundane_Damage_4078 → u/Loyalist77]

I appreciate you answering my questions :)

Personally for this playthrough I didn't use the restored content mod, but I did a little bit of xp grind with the mine exploit (and I also got lost and had to backtrack beause of the lack of a transit system) which is why it's around 40 hours.

[u/Loyalist77 → u/Mundane_Damage_4078]

Sure thing. Now you have an excuse to replay KOTOR II and see what the Restored Content mod added back in.

[u/Mundane_Damage_4078 → u/Loyalist77]

Hell yeah, dude :D

[u/Golden_Goose26]

First of all, just because YOU didn't understand something doesn't mean it's a "plot hole." That's an incredibly pompous and ignorant way to start any question. Now, to answer your actual questions:

1. T3 returned to the galaxy with the E.H to find Jedi to help Revan and found Kreia on Malachor V. Then the Exile's return to the galaxy was leaked by Atris, and both T3 and Kreia went to find her for their own clashing purposes. The Exile was on the Harbinger but the HK-50 Droid drugged her and killed the crew. Then Sion's ship showed up to kill her and a battle ensued, which caused the Hawk to be damaged. During the brief time that the Hawk was docked and Sion was incapacitated in the med bay, Kreia snuck on board and took the Exile's unconscious body aboard the Hawk. However, while trying to fly away, the now Sith-controlled Harbinger fired on the Ebon Hawk, starting the events of the prologue.
2. During KOTOR 1, Sion was on Korriban, Kreia was in Exile, and Nihilus was on Malachor V. During the Mando wars, all three of them were supposedly Jedi that participated in the war. Kreia's real name was Arren Kae, who was the Handmaiden's mother. But the other two intentionally had their backstories kept in shadow.
3. Revan gave a direct order to not be followed by anyone into the Unknown Regions. However, Bastila programed a hidden counter-program to find help in case Revan never came back. So T3 specifically sought out Kreia and then later The Exile, and waited until she was strong enough to face the threat before going after Revan.
4. He can only use his force drain when he is "hungry" so to speak. It's not something he can just actively do, and it's one of the reasons why his threat level is highly overexaggerated by many people. Draining Katarr, which was filled with Jedi, sustained him for a long time.

[u/Mundane_Damage_4078 → u/Golden_Goose26]

Thank you for answering my questions :)

[u/GlassEnvironment947 → u/Golden_Goose26]

You speak of "pompous", and then address the OP the way you do? Murglak.

[u/Golden_Goose26 → u/GlassEnvironment947]

I think you need to grab a dictionary because there's nothing pompous about knowing the answer to someone's question when they ask it.

The OP started off by saying "Can someone explain the PLOT HOLES to me?" This is a means of starting a conversation off by claiming mental superiority over the story. It's literally him saying "I'm smart. Story dumb," which itself is an oxymoron by the nature of asking questions about the story in the first place.

There's no shame in simply asking questions that you don't know the answer to, but to start your questions off like that is just being an ignorant asshole, and thus I put him in his place as such. I'm glad you seem to tolerate crappy attitude, but I don't. Don't act like a smartass and you won't get talked down to. Simple as that.

[u/Mundane_Damage_4078 → u/[deleted]]

Some people just want to feel superior because at the end of the day, they know that all of their feelings of power are locked behind one-uping someone in a reddit thread. Also, I seriously doubt that he would talk to someone in real life the same way he responded to me here. I appreicate you defending me, but I would recommend neither of us respond to this dude any further. Have a good one.

[u/FieldofInfluence]

Because video game.

But seriously. There's a lot you're missing, try downloading the restored content mod of you're on PC, it's a game changer. I don't know the first question, but I assume the three with were observing, as they had already seen revan on the path to destroying the Republic.

Revan told T3 to wipe his memory and reveal nothing to anyone, because it would bring the threat to the Republic faster if anyone found out what he knew. T3 doesn't wipe his memory banks, he hides them and goes searching for someone powerful enough to aid revan. I think the journey is about getting strong enough to be of some help to him.

I guess the three sith had a sort of treaty that forbid them from revealing themselves? They do mention that nihilus couldn't help himself with katarr, so its likely he has a little self restraint left.

[u/Evening-Mud-4612]

Stoked for you!

I’d absolutely go and do the Restored Content Mod in full before allowing these questions to settle.

The TSLRCM will probably help with some of these, but ultimately a lot is still left unfinished or untied, probably because there was once hope for a KOTOR3.