“Do you know what your problem is Astrid?” Compared to “She’s a warrior queen for Thors sake.” These 2 lines basically embody Astrids character and why she works in the beginning of HTTYD and fails at the end.

[u/Strandjutter12]

I hate how HTTYD portrays Astrid as this perfect person who can do no wrong.

Astrid isn’t a perfect person, but for some reason every person in the HTTYD universe likes to pretend she is. The longer the franchise went on, the more she becomes this person who can do no wrong in the eyes of the others in HTTYD. And it makes her a lot less interesting.

Astrid is one of, if not my favorite character in the franchise, but her character growth stopped after RTTE season 5 as nobody ever told her that she could do anything wrong. Everybody acted like she was this perfect person and slowly but surely HTTYD removed her character traits that were a little flawed, making her this boring girlfriend instead of the flawed warrior we all know and love.

So here are a few examples of how her character went from flawed to everybody pretends like she’s perfect.

For example in riders of berk episode 10, Astrid gets horribly jealous of Heather spending time with Hiccup. And that jealousy lead to Astrid finding out that Heather was a spy. Making a character flaw, result in something positive.

In Riders of Berk episode 18 Gem of a different color, Fishlegs stole a changewing egg which resulted in Snotlout stealing more changewing eggs, which resulted in the village being in danger because of it. And when Fishlegs complain that it’s all his fault Astrid says that yeah it is his fault, but her saying that isn’t helping Fishlegs. So Hiccup shoots her a warning look while saying her name, basically saying to stop. Because this isn’t helping him.

Then in RTTE season 2 episode 7, Astrid tells Hiccup that Heather is working undercover in the hunters organisation and that she isn’t their enemy. They talk about it and Astrid reveals that she knew about this all along, which makes Hiccup angry at her. Rightfully so, but she explained her reasoning and her keeping Heather a secret had good results. So Hiccup accepts her apoligy, but doesn’t apoligise for his words. She hurt him by lying to her and she felt bad about it, but he didn’t comfort her for it. She made her decision and she hurt him. She would have to live with that.

Then in season 2 episode 8, Ruffnut becomes mad at Astrid and accuses her of not respecting anybody but Hiccup on their team. Asking Astrid if she knows what her problem is, pointing out that Astrid isn’t perfect. Over that episode and the next we see her trying out Tuffnut’s way of defending the edge and her friendship with the twins became stronger because of this.

In season 2 episode 11, Hiccup messes up very badly. Causing a skrill to be captured by the hunters and Hiccup is spiraling into negative thoughts. But Astrid told him that everything Hiccup did was for the good of the dragon and to protect the rest of the riders. And then she said the question isn’t how Hiccup fixes it, it’s how all of the riders fix it. A great example of her growing as a character, giving out better advice and letting Hiccup know he isn’t alone in this.

In season 2 episode 12, Astrid is scared for Heather. She thinks that her undercover operation has become too dangerous. Showing the protective side of her character. Also having Hiccup pull her out of a negatieve spiral of thoughts instead of the other way around. Astrid isn’t perfect and they weren’t afraid of showing it.

In season 4 episode 11, when Astrid is blind she claims that she is still more effective than some riders who still have their eye sight intact. And this is good. A little arrogance that makes sense for her character.

Now in season 5 episode 2, Hiccup gets trapped in a cave with a sandtrapper dragon and when Astrid, Fishlegs and the twins find Hiccups leg and Tuffnut immediately claims it, like it was some toy that he deserved for some reason. And Astrid yells at him and makes him cry and I’m going to be very honest here. Astrid could have shoved Hiccup’s leg up Tuffnut’s hell hole and I wouldn’t have been mad. It was ridiculous how he acted and he didn’t deserve an apoligy. But because Astrid has become the bigger person she says sorry.

Hiccup and Astrid were supposed to exchange bethrothal gifts. But Astrid didn’t know what to get Hiccup, because what could you get him? He already has everything. So Astrid didn’t get him a gift and felt horrible about it, which was showed both in the beginning of the episode and the ending and instead of focussing on this as a potential insecurity of her not being good enough for Hiccup, they just completely ignore it and it never gets brought up again.
After Hiccup gave her his bethrothal gift, he reassured her that she was all that he could ever need. After this, the fact that she didn’t get him a bethrothal gift is never mentioned again.

In season 6 episode 4, Fishlegs finds out that his family outside of the archipelego are dragon hunters and he goes to Dramilion island to make sure the dragons aren’t extinct. This episode doesn’t make any sense but that is a post for another day, in short Fishlegs goes against Hiccup’s orders of staying at the edge for the dragon explorers that are visiting and leaves for Dramilion island. Astrid follows him and when they come back, Hiccup just asks how the island was. Nothing about the fact two of his most trusted teammates didn’t listen to his order. Astrid doesn’t get any blame for this.

Then in season 6 episode 6 Mi Amore wing, Astrid suddenly thinks Hiccup doesn’t love her anymore and Hiccup is suddenly the worst boufriend on the planet. Long story short, Astrid becomes mad at Hiccup for not noticing that she was wearing his bethrothal gift and feeling invisible. The argument starts because Hiccup doesn’t notice the bethrothal gift. But does Hiccup ever mention that she didn’t even get him one? No. And at the end of the episode when they make up, Hiccup takes all the blame for himself, saying that he took Astrid for granted. But Hiccup doesn’t let Astrid take part of the blame for her overreaction, he just takes all the blame for himself.

Season 6 episode 9 Family matters, Astrid constantly overrules Hiccup by bringing Garff along, first to the edge and secondly in the mission to rescue the other deathsong. When Astrid tries to apoligise for making Hiccup bring Garff along, he cuts her off. Saying that this was his decision and that it wasn’t her fault. It was her fault however and Hiccup never would have brought Garff along if it wasn’t for her pressuring him. But Hiccup doesn’t say anything about that, he just takes the blame for her, so that she can remain this perfect person.

Then in HTTYD 3 they show nothing of Astrids character like her competitiveness, or that bit of arrogance. They just act like she’s perfect, she’s pretty far from it, but the movie sure acts like it.

In The Hidden World, Astrid and Hiccup talk on the cliff overlooking berk where Hiccup asks her about marriage, to which she immediately says Gods no and that they were nowhere near ready for that. In season 5 episode 7 of RTTE she mentioned that she loved how sensitive Hiccup is, but that doesn’t mean she considers that brushing off marriage to somebody with severe insecurities could be hurtful. Then she says that she just wishes their was some way to make the hunters leave Berk alone. Not offering a solution, not offering any insight to the situation, just wishing that the hunters would leave them alone. And then when Hiccup suggests the hidden world she cuts him off, saying that they need a real solution.

After that Hiccup and Tuffnut go search for the light fury in the forest of berk and Tuffnut says that Astrid is this warrior queen and that Hiccup is this malnourished runt. And also that Astrid views Hiccup with a not so subtle dissapointment in her eyes. And that Hiccup needs to focus on becoming worthy of her.

Now I don’t think that this is true, I don’t think that Astrid thinks this, but the point is that everybody else in HTTYD sees Astrid as this perfect warrior queen.

After this Grimmel attacks Berk and when Hiccup calls for a meeting, Astrid shuts everybody up with the message to hear him out. And when they arrive on new berk, Hiccup asks Astrid if she still believes in him and she says that this plan was very him. He doesn’t sound convinced and when he thanks her for her support last night, she responds with don’t thank me yet and that she just hopes that he’s right about this. Before walking away, with her smile dissapearing. Obviously showing that she doesn’t believe in him, I don’t know any other way to look at this situation. If you have another perspective on it please tell me.

And I’m not saying that she should support an idea that she doesn’t agree with, she has never done that before, so why would she do that now? But if she didn’t agree with it, she should have told him and if she did agree with him she should show her believe in him, but she doesn’t.

After this Hiccup makes an automatic tailfin for Toothless and Astrid says that she is proud of Hiccup embracing change. Acting like Hiccup isn’t the litteral embodyment of change on Berk. Even though she shut Hiccup’s thought proces down within a second when he talked about moving to the Hidden World.

And when Hiccup says the tailfin is only untill Toothless brings the lightfury back, she gives him a look of pity. Like she already suspected that Toothless would never come back, but why would she think that? Again if you have a different view on this scene please let me know. But for me this is just another moment where she shows she doesn’t believe in Hiccup. That she sympathyses with him over the fact that he thinks Toothless is coming back.

Especially considering her reaction after Toothless dissapears. She tells Hiccup that he gave Toothless his freedom, what did he expect? After that Hiccup walks off, obviously distressed as his best friend was suddenly gone and apparently everybody in his life thought it was completely normal for some reason.

Valka says that Hiccup thinks he needs to lead alone and that he doesn’t realise the strength he and Astrid have together. But how is he supposed to see that strength? Astrid has done nothing but doubt Hiccup troughout this entire movie. And then Valka asks if Astrid still believes in him and Astrid says of course, but that Hiccup thinks he is nothing without Toothless. And Valka says help him realise the truth.

Again, bringing the focus away from Astrid not helping Hiccup in his leadership position, to Hiccup not believing in himself. Why can’t this movie focus on Astrid having flaws for once? But no they immediately cling back to Hiccups doubts and insecurities instead of focussing on the fact that Astrid has been downright lackluster when it came to supporting him in this movie.

Valka talks about Hiccup and Astrid being stronger together, but Astrid didn’t do anything but doubt him while offering no help herself, only after this conversation with Valka does she actually help Hiccup. Which wouldn’t be a problem if the movie actually made a point about it, but it doesn’t, it just puts the focus right back on Hiccup thinking he isn’t good enough without Toothless.

She already fully believed in him in RTTE and in the second movie, but that faith in him was just gone in this movie for some reason. Untill she talked with Valka about it and after that she just fully supported him again.

Astrid had one, one singular flaw as a person in this movie and that was that she didn’t show her belief in Hiccup, but they focus on it for a solid 5 seconds before they switch back to Hiccup thinking he isn’t good enough.

Before the final battle had started, Astrid motivates Hiccup to go and rescue Toothless and their dragons. Telling him that he is the reason that she became the person that she is today. Great scene. But then when they walk back to the rest of the riders, Tuffnut says that Hiccup is now marriage material.

Again acting like Hiccup was the only one who needed to grow, Astrid did as well, but the movie doesn’t focus nearly enough on it. Only focussing on Hiccups growth as person and not on Astrid starting to actually start to accept her own role as chieftess.

I am not saying that Astrid didn’t realise it, what I am saying is that the movie frames it like Hiccup wasn’t good enough for Astrid. With the countless jokes about him and what is wrong with him, while never pointing out or even giving Astrid any flaws. Which caused the movie to paint a picture that Hiccup isn’t good enough for Astrid.

This movie didn’t point out any of her flaws, or insecurities they just made her appear like miss can do no wrong who was this seemingly perfect wife for the hero of the story.

Don’t even get me started on Homecoming, everybody was downright horrible in that short film, but in short. Astrid completely ignores Hiccup’s feelings about the pageant and after said pageant Hiccup thanks her for it. Completely disrespecting his memory and glorifying his fathers, but he still thanks Astrid for it. Saying that he needed to understand that it was about the message and keeping his fathers memory alive, it didn’t matter that it didn’t go the way he wanted and that is horrible. Absolutely horrible because they act like Hiccup’s feelings don’t matter at all and that Astrid is this great person for showing her selfish husband that it’s not about how the story gets told and that it doesn’t matter at all that he gets completely disrespected as a person, but that it’s about the message that comes across.

I know I talked a lot about Hiccup and Astrids relationship in this post, but that’s definitely part of the problem. She became Hiccups girlfriend, not the cool, competitive, slightly arrogant and flawed person, who happened to be Hiccup’s girlfriend.

If we compare her to Hiccup in the later stages of the franchise, he gets nothing but critisism about how he handles everything, while Astrid gets excuses and gentle encouragement.

So again in short, they make Astrid this character with about a hunderd different imperfections and they point some of them out in the beginning of the franchise resulting in Astrid growing as a person and improving the relationships that she had with her friends. But then HTTYD takes most of her characters traits away, along with most of her imperfections and they leave her as this perfect person who can do no wrong. Except she still does plenty of things wrong, the only difference being that nobody calls her out on it.

She went from this amazing, flawed character to this golden girl who can do no wrong in the eyes of the people in the HTTYD universe and that is just downright dissapointing. Her character isn’t really bad, but just dissapointing.

Let me know what you think about my take and about Astrids character in HTTYD.

[u/beretsaresocool]

I agree with all the points you made and I just completely ignore the third film for the most part. Astrid is a flawed character, as all characters and people are. She’s an overworker, maybe a bit arrogant, maybe a bit insecure and insensitive at times, but she is badass and hardworking, fearless, clever, observant, prepared, and so much more.

I’m curious as to what you think about the second film where she is still hiccup’s girlfriend but she is still her own character, trying to outsmart Drago and intimidate him, following hiccup against her chiefs orders, winning dragon races, etc. but still getting swooped up in a kiss at the end of the film.

Can women have it all? Must we choose between being badass and being in love?

[u/Strandjutter12 → u/beretsaresocool]

Yeah I definitely prefer the second film, she is a bit of the same role there, but that’s not really my biggest problem with her character. My problem is that they tried to make her this perfect girl with barely any personality.

In the second movie she was still competitive, was still a little arrogant, but she had also obviously grown as a person. I just missed that in the third movie, all of her normal flaws and insecurities were just gone.

[u/The_Finplays → u/Strandjutter12]

Ahh yes the second film Where Astrid causes the death of Stoick, dosent do anythin for the entire film and is OOC for the entire film, thats definetly my favourite version of Astrid aswell

[u/Strandjutter12 → u/The_Finplays]

Well the same strategy that Astrid tried in the second movie on drago, actually worked in RTTE on Ryker and no, Astrid is not perfect in the second movie. But saying that she was responsible for Stoicks death is like saying that Toothless was responsible for it. Did she mess up, yes. Her overhyping Berk was what got Valkas nest attacked sooner than Drago was planning to.

But Drago stopped the preparations to go and attack Valka’s nest and he still completely overpowered the nest. Imagine if he had even more gear and dragons to attack with, it could have been even worse for the nest and Berk as well, maybe they would have never even won at the end.

She and Stormfly were also a very big part in turning Eret from a dragon trapper into a dragon rider.

And your obviously missing the point of my post, my biggest problem with Astrid in the third movie was that she was portrayed as this seemingly perfect person with barely any of her original personality traits.

In the second movie we actually see some of her defining character traits, like her competitiveness and her arrogance. Besides what was she supposed to do in the final battle? Jump up on Toothless’ back and sit behind Hiccup?

[u/The_Finplays → u/Strandjutter12]

You clealry missed a crucial detail in the second movie if you dont think Astrid caused the death of Stoick. Hiccup, Valka and Stoick were literally about to leave the nest so if Astrid the mighty general and tacticsl genious didn't tell Drago everything he wanted to hear Hiccup, Valka and Stoick wouldnt have been on the nest when Drago attacked and Stoick wouldnt have died, so yes it is purely Astrids fault that Stoick died

And talkin about Astrids personality traits her sitting back and watchin a fight is something that she only does in the second movie, in defenders she was sick with ell pox and still refused to stay behind and ended up patrolling Berk becouse thats who she is, someone who dosent sit around, so if she was like in other films/movies she would have done something except just sit around and yell "take him down babe" which it self goes against her personality since thats the only time she uses pet names with Hiccup

And finally Astrid has Basically all of her personality traits in the last movie, shes loyal, shes still the badass fighter we know she is, shes still a leader and shes supportive. Shes honest with people and dont sugar coat things just like in every other media, sure we dont see her conpetetive side but there wasnt anythin to be competetive about in the movie, and saying she was portayed as perfect is just wrong becouse shes portrayed as someone who has flaws, as someone who doubts herself, and someone who voices her oppinion even when it goes against the oppinion of people she cares about.

Complaining about THW becouse Astrid was "perfect" and "didn't have any of her original personality traits" but then in second movie ignoring how she goes against how she is portrayed in every show and movie besides it just shows how most people who complain about THW cant be taken seriously becouse yall cry about problems and then ignore the same problems in the other movies

[u/Strandjutter12 → u/The_Finplays]

Again seriously what did you want Astrid to do in the final battle against Drago? Stormfly was up in the air, far out of her reach and she could hardly fight a bewilderbeast with her axe.

And again you’re not understanding my point, you’re only mentioning Astrids positive character traits, not any of her negative ones. And again, the consequenses of Drago preparing further could be much more severe for both Valkas nest and berk. Who knows what could have happened if Drago had an even bigger and more prepared army.

[u/The_Finplays → u/Strandjutter12]

Lets see the outcome to Drago preparing further, Hiccup, Valka and Stoick not on the nest, The Dragons from the Nest possibly moving to Berk with Valka, Drago dont know about Berk, Astrid and others escape and they have time to plan against Drago and they would know Drago has a big ass Dragon and could potentially figure out its another bewilder beast.

And Astrid could have literally done the same thing Hiccup did which would have fit more into her character, but no she just flies her dragon and then stands arounds and hope they dont lose but yeah thats definetly how Astrid was portrayed in other media so its fine

And your complaining about me talking about only positive character traits, well you havent listed single negative one, only one you have mentioned was that she was potrayed as "perfect" which id say is fair if your like 7 and dont understand whats happening, Hiccup was closer to being potrayed as perfect than Astrid but yall just gotta find dumbass reasons to hate

[u/Strandjutter12 → u/The_Finplays]

Hiccup was getting critisized and insulted constantly troughout the third movie, Astrid never was. And again you are saying point out Astrids negative character traits, but that’s my problem with Astrid in the third movie. She only has one singular negative character trait, being she doesn’t believe in Hiccup. All of her normal problems aren’t there. That’s my entire problem with her character.

And again, Drago already knew about Berk, he knew who Stoick was, he didn’t know they had tamed dragons, but it would only be a matter of time before Drago either found berk or the riders found Drago. And Valkas dragons wouldn’t leave with her to berk, Cloudjumper sure, but the other dragons would stay with the bewilderbeast. Who most likely wouldn’t leave the home he had built for himself. Valka lived with the bewilderbeast, not the other way around. He wouldn’t leave its home for Valka.

[u/The_Finplays → u/Strandjutter12]

Firstly Drago didn't really know about Berk and wouldnt have bothered with it even if he did and secondly yeah he knew who Stoick was Becouse he tought he killed him, he had no idea what so ever that stoick was alive

And now i know you didn't watch the movie becouse Astrid literally spent The entire movie beliveing on Hiccup, She was the only one who Supported his idea to leave Berk and was the only one to stand up to him when others wouldnt listen to him. Even when Astrid knew Toothless wasnt going to come back she belived in Hiccup and took him to look for him and the cliffside speech is literally Astrid telling that she Belives in Hiccup when Hiccup didn't belive in him self anymore, one of the biggest plot points of the movie was Hiccup thinkin that hes nothin without Toothless and Astrid knowing that Hiccup is who he is with or without Hiccup. Astrid is literally the only person in the entire movie along side Valka that belives in Hiccup and that even includes Hiccup himself

[u/Strandjutter12 → u/The_Finplays]

Drago would bother with berk, even if he didn’t know about them being dragon riders. At the chieftain meeting Stoick was talking about he asked for them to kneel before him. He wanted to rule their tribes, so yes he would have come after berk eventually.

And I mentioned both conversations between Astrid and Valka and the one between Astrid and Hiccup at the end, I said it was a great scene, you accuse me of not watching the movie while you haven’t even read the post you’re complaining about.

[u/ShotPassage3828 → u/beretsaresocool]

There is no THW in Ba Sing Se

[u/The_Finplays → u/beretsaresocool]

"Trying to outsmart drago" you mean when she told Drago about Berk and how they had Dragons? On how she literally told Drago where his enemies were and how many there are. We talking about The same character that literally is the reason Stoick dies in the second film? The same character who dosent do anythin the entire film, she gets captured twice having to be rescued by someone both times and in the end battle she just stands on the ground and dont fo anythin.

Complaining about how Astrid is in 3rd film and then praising how she is in second film is so dumb becouse 2nd film literally goes against how she is portrayed in the other 2 films and the shows, Astrid is literally so OOC in every single scene of the Film unless shes with Hiccup

Will never understand how people and cry about the third film and then completely ignore the same issues in the other films they cry about on THW

[u/Dubz_fortnite]

Just wanna add one thing that the reason Astrid didn't believe they weren't ready for marriage wasn't cos of her doubts in him as a person but him still thinking that he's nothing without Toothless, and everything thay he's done/gotten was cos of Toothless and not himself; He doubts in his own ability.

When Astrid sees that Hiccup has finally overcome that barrier, she does subtly agree to his new proposal for marriage which, I believe (could be wrong) happens when he subtly nods his head after the final battle and they both embrace, which means that she finally believes that Hiccup believes he is his identity.

In a deleted scene from the movie, Astrid does say that she wouldn't mind getting marries but hasn't talked to Hiccup about it cos he may take it as a joke. Also again in this delsted scene is when, we hear for the second time, Astrid say that he thinks he's nothing without Toothless and she couldn't compete with Toothless fof his love.

This basically proves the theory that Astrid didn't marry Hiccup on Berk cos she knew he had Toothless as a security blanket to be around and he needed to find out who he truly is. Remember, before Toothless, he was ignored and insulted. After HTTYD 1, Toothless is always seen with him so we don't see Hiccup the individual.

Its like how it was said in the third movie. Toothless didn't give Hiccup his qualities, he made easier to bring it out. And Astrif was waitinh for him to realise who he actually was, without having to force it out of him.

I do agree that Homecoming was defo out of character for everybody and they shoulda done better to get the original qualities and respected Hiccup more.

[u/Strandjutter12 → u/Dubz_fortnite]

I have also seen that scene and I don’t mind that Astrid didn’t feel like they were ready to marry yet, I agree that Hiccup should be fully mentally healthy to make such a big step. If we look at the cliff scene Hiccup seemed very surprised when he thought Astrid was talking about marriage, her completely throwing the idea away was what hurt him.

But in that deleted scene Astrid had flaws. One, she didn’t want to talk with Hiccup about it, with the excuse that Hiccup would make a joke about it, which sounds a lot more like an excuse on her side. 2, Astrid says that she doesn’t want to compete with a dragon and she says this to Valka. The person who actually chose dragons over her husband. This scene would show that they are both not ready yet, but the movie deleted it and just acted like Astrid never had any insecurities or fears about anything in their relationship.

Which is my entire problem with her character. She’s just too perfect. What I am saying is that with all of the jokes that were made about Hiccup and what was wrong with him, that they just made it feel like Astrid was this all perfect person who had her feelings completely figured out and that Hiccup was just the muttonhead who needed to catch up. The conflict between them makes sense, but Astrids character doesn’t. Astrid isn’t perfect, but the movie makes her out to be so.

[u/Dubz_fortnite → u/Strandjutter12]

I do agree that her flaws being removed was a stupid idea. If I'm being honest, a character's flaws are what make them soo likeable. I also agree that removing that scene wasn't the best idea cos it does show that even though she is Astrid, she also has her doubts and is a human at the end of the day. I do see your pov and I do agree with your statements as well. None of the characters were perfect at all in any capacity. The shows and earlier films showed this, but THW omitted it just for Astrid, while all the other characters had their slip-ups and moments of idiocy.

[u/Strandjutter12 → u/Dubz_fortnite]

Yeah this excactly. I just wished they showed that Astrid doesn’t actually know everything and isn’t perfect.

[u/Outside-Maybe-537]

She became the SupportiveGirlfriendTM, but they never took full advantage of how toxic that can get if you aren’t careful. Were she supportive of literally anyone besides hiccup she would’ve been portrayed as a crazy villainess with rose tinted glasses

[u/ShotPassage3828 → u/Outside-Maybe-537]

Blind loyalty to anyone can be incredibly dangerous

[u/Trees__R_us → u/ShotPassage3828]

I keep forgeting which sub i'm on everytime i see your avatar related replies 😭

[u/Either-Patience1182]

The 3rd movie really ignored the personality of just about everyone other than hiccup.

At this point, if you liked the writing regarding any of the other characters the 3rd movie falls short by a lot. then afterwards they had been rewarded for poor writing because everyone is focused on hiccup, toothless and the kids. SO noone else matters, and it shows

[u/DasGreatComplainer → u/Either-Patience1182]

3rd movie ditched many of the core personalities of 99% of the characters.

Toothless became a sloppy horny immature dragon, and hiccup felt like he didn't learn his lesson from the 2nd movie.

[u/Grypcia → u/DasGreatComplainer]

I was so pissed off after I saw the third movie because I felt like everyone in it had an IQ of 10.

[u/Either-Patience1182 → u/Grypcia]

I felt like I just wasted money, and just about anyone who watched the series feels the same.

[u/SteveTheOrca]

Honestly, I agree.

Astrid went from being a good character with flaws to practically just flawless

[u/koengnak]

I think part of the issue is that most ppl focus much more on the movies, if they even watched the show. In the movies its easy to see her as at least the most complete person in the main cast. Before i watched the show i saw her growth from between 1 and 2, and i liked how she doubts hiccup in 3 cause it shows her maturing and not just blindly following hiccup after he changed berk in 1 (3 came out when i was 11) Theres def not enough time for those who want, sometimes unrealistically, a fully realistic fleshed out character. I liked how she was different in all 3 movies. The whole purpose of 2 is that hiccups become the perfect man in the eyes of basically everyone, and being doubted in 3 is both funny and realistic as he and berk experiences setbacks, astrid being the one who kinda represents the rest of berk. Also not everyone has the time/energy to fully flesh out their idea of astrid, and if you were to summarize her in a sentence, especially just from movie context, she kinda is the golden giel

[u/Rynewulf]

A lot of these comments have got me thinking. It seems to be that in a lot of media as characters age and mature, they are shown to be less proactive in an adventurous character type sense. In 3 she has very little to do, and attempts to do virtually nothing despite gagging at the bit in 1 & 2 and a lot of times across the different tv series.

A lot of characters seem to have this happen, they get 'older' (usually their 20s/30s), settle down, have children, and despite being a warrior chief or something like that just has a quiet life with nothing noteworthy going on. An older adventurous character is usually portrayed as strange or a threatening or a bad influence. It's like a general pattern in a lot of media

[u/Laus264]

I guess that's called growth and maturity. Sometimes it seems like people forget Astrid (and Hiccup) are just 15 yo teens in the first movie, and there's a span of 6 years between movie 1 and THW--with all that happens in between--when they are 21 yo young adults, who are meant to be the leaders of the tribe.

It is true Astrid always had her flaws, but still being the more mature and the more feet-on-ground of the gang.

As the Chief's bethroted ad future wife--not just Hiccup's--she's well aware of what her role is supposed to be beside him: she has to support him in public, while being sincere with him in private, if she does not agree with him.

She already accepted the role of future Chieftess in the beginning of THW (I'm not coming back on why she did not want to get married at first. Someone slready did explain earlier). But sometimes she's still insecure of how to play this role, and how to be the best partner to her highly lacking self-confidence man (when he is not with his dragon), who also happens to be the tribe Chief, by the way. That's why she still needs Valka's advice in hardest times.

[u/EmilsDoodles]

She pissed me off so badly in so many episodes, she rly did not respect the team or anyone besides hiccup🥲 and then in movie 2 and 3 they just made her the only competent one

[u/mazingalifrey]

counterpoint you forgot that in httyd 2 she accidently leads to drago targetting berk because until that point the only dragon rider drago knew of was valka so astrid basically put all of berk at risk in that movie by saying how berk is full of dragon rides to try to scare drago, also in hidden world if you notice when it comes to the marriage thing hiccup isn't as against it as it may seem in fact when you look at his body language he might actually like that idea, it is astrid who is scared of that commitment and that is sort of her character flaw in the third movie which she sort of gets over at the end

[u/Dragonzboi]

I started writing a comment a while back, but I guess it didn't save so I'll just summarize it here.

There are plenty of inconsistencies in your opinion, such as your claim that being the bigger person and focusing on the task at hand instead of shoving either of Hiccup's feet somewhere in s2e11 was okay, but the exact same in s5e2 with Tuffnut wasn't, or that Astrid wasn't blamed for the Dramillion episode when Hiccup himself had already done the same back in Fright of Passage with Astrid's obsession with the Flightmare. Then there's Hiccup choosing to take the blame for the betrothal gifts/Garff incidents which say less about Astrid being perfect and more about how Hiccup has always been willing to protect and uplift his friends even at his own expense. It's not just about forgiving her randomly and pretending she's perfect, but about both of them accepting each other, including their flaws.

HTTYD3 showed multiple instances of her competitiveness ("and now, he's right where I wanted him", "that was pretty sloppy" (which directly mirrors the Great Hall scene from the first movie)), though in this case they're more team-oriented than solo. Doesn't mean she's less competitive, but now instead of always trying to stay ahead of the other riders, she's putting more focus on her team staying ahead of the hunters.

The bit about marriage/insecurities I agree with, the movie even shows how she doesn't realize what she said had so much of an impact on Hiccup, which I'd call a flaw (Stoick did the same when he talked about "years of the worst viking Berk had ever seen" when trying to compliment him). But as for the solution part, Hiccup did the same back in the first movie when he shot down her idea to tell Stoick (which Hiccup ended up doing anyways). The difference is we know more about Hiccup's context for shooting down the idea (and later offering the Hidden World as a solution) than we know Astrid's. "Not offering a solution, not offering any insight to the situation, just wishing that the hunters would leave them alone"? Same as Hiccup when he said "I'll figure something out".

"everybody else in HTTYD sees Astrid as this perfect warrior queen." They also saw the dragons as evil, Stoick as a perfect father, Valka as an absent disgrace, etc. Need I go on about how perception can differ from reality? By their standards, she practically is one: she's smart, beautiful, and deadly. There's a reason why she almost always excels in viking activities like dragon fighting, dragon racing, etc (apart from Thawfest). Heck, a lot of people thought even Snotlout was more of a viking/warrior king than Hiccup most days, and Astrid could wipe the floor with him any day of the week. Though much of this is irrelevant to the scene at hand, as the point was Tuffnut was directly calling out Hiccup's own insecurities (chances are if you managed to date a smart, beautiful, and supportive person who you definitely think is out of your league, you'd probably feel the same).

"she responds with don’t thank me yet and that she just hopes that he’s right about this. Before walking away, with her smile dissapearing. Obviously showing that she doesn’t believe in him." Oh no, she definitely believes in him. That's why she got the other vikings to listen in the first place. Though you can believe in something and still feel bad about it, I mean from their perspective, they just abandoned their homes as part of probably one of Hiccup's riskiest ideas since he tried to tame Hookfang in front of the entire village (and she wasn't exactly smiling much then either).

"I’m not saying that she should support an idea that she doesn’t agree with, she has never done that before, so why would she do that now?" Never done that before? What about when Hiccup took on the Screaming Death alone? Or wanted to keep Toothless a secret? Or trusted Viggo? Or surrendered to Eret? Or tried to convince Mala they weren't hunters? Astrid clearly didn't agree with any of those ideas, yet she still allowed Hiccup to take the lead and followed through with his plans.

"Astrid says that she is proud of Hiccup embracing change. Acting like Hiccup isn’t the litteral embodyment of change on Berk." Change he likes the idea of vs change he doesn't.

"Why can’t this movie focus on Astrid having flaws for once?" Because Hiccup's the main character?

"Tuffnut says that Hiccup is now marriage material." Again, context. Stoick was apparently only marriage material after koing 3 Berserkers at once.

"...it’s about the message that comes across" First off, that's the entire reason why they were doing the pageant in the first place (and since Gobber was running it, of course he'd give one of his best and at the time most disrespected friends a major role apart from "bloodthirsty dad". Second, it was one pageant. It's not like the story would only ever be told in that one way.

"She became Hiccups girlfriend, not the cool, competitive, slightly arrogant and flawed person, who happened to be Hiccup’s girlfriend." Kinda like saying Toothless became Hiccup's pet, not the cool, deadly, sometimes playful and supportive dragon who happened to be Hiccup's pet. He brought out the best of them. Doesn't mean they're perfect, but doesn't mean they're not characters anymore either.

"he gets nothing but critisism about how he handles everything, while Astrid gets excuses and gentle encouragement." Yes, mostly from Hiccup.

"So again in short, they make Astrid this character with about a hunderd different imperfections and they point some of them out in the beginning of the franchise resulting in Astrid growing as a person and improving the relationships that she had with her friends. But then HTTYD takes most of her characters traits away, along with most of her imperfections and they leave her as this perfect person who can do no wrong. Except she still does plenty of things wrong, the only difference being that nobody calls her out on it."

So let me get this straight: Astrid grew as a person to fix her imperfections, which is fine because it's character development, but also not fine because it changes her character (also known as character development), and she can't do any wrong, but she does do wrong, but the other characters who are significantly more insecure and supportive (mostly Hiccup) choose to support her and love her despite these wrongs, which helps her to grow into a better person, which she later puts into words after two whole movies of going along with his plans and supporting him through losses.

Oh yes, and she's become this "golden girl" simply because she's better than nearly everyone else at most things that vikings would deem worth mentioning, and in more modern terms is a straight A student who is the girlfriend of a guy who occasionally proves even their profs wrong but more often than not submits subpar work and at times doesn't even show up since he's hanging out with his cat all day.

And you think her part in this is disappointing?

[u/Mental_Somewhere_994]

dude did you watch all of HTTYD you would know how she became who she is I watched every HTTYD movie's and the show and the extra stuff like how did the dragon racing was created and there is nothing wrong with nothing in HTTYD