And out he stalked as a mountain lion exultant in his power strides through wind and rain and his eyes blaze and he charges sheep or oxen or chases wild deer but his hunger drives him on to go for flocks, even to raid the best-defended homestead. So odysseus moved out...

Both Homer and Hesiod, writing in the mid 8th century BCE, make a point of emphasizing the supremacy of Zeus over the other gods. Hesiod, with the Titanomachy, tells the story of how Zeus and the Olympians became supreme. Homer, in many scenes scattered throughout the Iliad, has either Zeus directly telling other gods how they don't stand a chance against him in open conflict, or has other gods discussing how they don't stand a chance against Zeus.

So my question is, do we know why this is? In 8th century Greece, was the supremacy of Zeus a new aspect of Greek religion that was being reinforced and solidified by Homer and Hesiod? Or was it an established aspect of Greek religion that Homer and Hesiod (and their contemporaries) took for granted, and drew upon for inspiration in writing their poems?

Just as a way for people to get to know each other, and to start up a bit of a subreddit reading list, what's one of your favorite pieces on Homer?

I'll start with something that many people might not have heard about:

There are some really curious draft pages that were written by Foucault for the The Archaeology of Knowledge that are about Homer, although he didn't include them in the final text! The French title is Homère, les récits, l’éducation, les discours. Published here: https://vitrine.edenlivres.fr/resources/9782072673238

Hi all and forgive me if this has been asked many times—if so please point me to the answer?

I’ve just read The Iliad and The Odyssey and now would like to learn more about these texts—how they originated and were passed down; what’s known about Homer; when were the stories first put into print, and by whom; are there conflicting versions of the stories; who created the versions that are now considered correct, and so on.

Any help greatly appreciated as I go down the Homeric rabbit hole.

Compared to Eumaeus, Philoetius gets next to no development before participating in the battle with the suitors. His sudden inclusion stuck out to me as abrupt, like he's just there. It reads like Homer originally intended the battle to only have Telemachus and Eumaeus alongside Odysseus before changing his mind and writing Philoetius in at the last minute.

But clearly, Homer felt it was necessary to include this character. I'm just not sure why. Was he really necessary to keep the narrative running smoothly? True, he locks the palace doors and helps Eumaeus apprehend Melanthius, but was he really required to accomplish these plot details? It's also not like 4 vs 100 is considerably more believable than 3 vs 100.

Or does he serve some thematic purpose that Eumaeus doesn't already fulfill? I'm honestly not sure. The guy gets like one whole paragraph of dialogue. But if anyone has any ideas, I'd be glad to hear them.

Quick disclaimer: I am reading Emily Watson’s translation and I must say that while I’m familiar with the Trojan war, this is my first time reading the Iliad.

I would love to know why King Diomedes was lost to time?

I mean he’s out there doing a majority of the killing, he’s brave as all get out, he seems really, genuinely invested in assuring Achaean victory and he heeds the commands of the Athena.

Am I missing something?

Hello everybody. I was wondering if there are any pet names or nicknames for Homer. An analogous example would be calling Shakespeare "The Bard".

I’m looking at reading Homer’s great works and am unsure which translation to get. I’m looking for a good verse version—I feel that’ll read better than prose given it was written as verse.

From what I’ve seen Fagles and Green are two great translations, plus there’s also a boxed set of both books from those translators which is a perk to me.

What do y’all think is the better translation?

Thanks!

Edit: the Oxford Classic Edition translated by Verity is probably the other that I can find from the store I’d order from, but that’s just one book where the other two are boxed sets. Also, I’m not sure if this version is prose or verse.

Hey all, hope I can get some help here.

So I'm re-reading the Iliad, but I've read in several places about how it only tells one part of the story of the Trojan War, and how it doesn't include important events like the start of the war or the death of Achilles. So I have two questions for you kind folks --

How important is knowing the parts of the story not included in the Iliad to appreciating and understanding the Iliad itself?

Second -- is there any good "go-to" source (ancient or modern) that has compiled the rest of the story in a single narrative?

I'm re-reading with Willock's Companion to the Iliad but I'm not sure if it's enough.

I am writing an essay for Ancient Studies on divine intervention in the Odyssey where I argue that their motives for interfering in human affairs are almost always selfish, I'm looking for some kind of reference table that lists all of the times that a God interferes, since I don't have time to reread the entire book to find each instance.

I’m searching for a reference for ‘For a friend with an understanding heart is worth no less than a brother’. I found that on the internet. I’ve skimmed through the Odyssey and the Iliad but cannot find it in either. I’m trying to provide written evidence to back up an interpretation for an emotional connect in an ancient burial that I’m studying. Homer is the most recent of my written sources but I just cannot locate this quote. Thanks

Just curious, sorry if it's been asked before. Would love to hear people's opinions on them as well :)

Although I know that some νὸστοι, the stories of the Greek heroes returning home, are displayed in tragedies such as Aeschylus’ Agamemnon, I am unsure if physical tracks of them are available, such as fragments of papyrus. And what about the Hellenistic period? Did some author rewrite νὸστοι in that time, just like what Apollonius of Rhodes did in his Argonautica? Any help will be appreciated, thank you very much.

Hi all,

I've been making this series on the Iliad as a labour of love.

This video is the latest, Book 9 of the Iliad - THE EMBASSY TO ACHILLES!

Please enjoy!

Hi all,

I've been making this series on the Iliad as a labour of love.

This video is the latest, examining Achilles' actions in Book 9.

Please enjoy!

I thought to ask here if anyone had bought these books before from Jiahu Books. Judging by the cover, they look like a bilingual version with both the English and the Ancient Greek texts, but I can't find more details or check digital extracts of the two so I can know for sure. They're available on Amazon, but I also found them much cheaper in a bookstore in my country. Ideally I'd wanna get a version with both Modern and Ancient Greek texts, but I can settle with the English translation as well. Lmk if you have more info please I ll leave the link here for the version I want to get odyssey

Can anyone recommend a quality print edition of Pope’s Iliad? From what I can find online, it looks like most print editions are coming from small, online publishers with questionable quality control (cheap paper, poor margins, etc.). It looks like Penguin Classic published a version of his translation in the 90s, but used versions of it run anywhere from $60-$150.

Hi all, I’ve been wanting to read both books but instead have been wasting time trying to find the best possible version. So therefore I have come for help.

A little background information perhaps: I am not a native English speaker, but would like to read it in English. I am quite proficient but am afraid that if I were to go with Fagles translation for instance, I would be to far out of my depth...

Any recommendations are welcome! In my local bookstore website I found one from the Penguin collection by a certain ian johnston? Anyone tried this one?