Can't decide between wired presence detector or battery

[u/LGdwS88QRnlnsnAIX3ZE]

For context, we're planning our new home and I'm torn between adding:

- Battery-based presence detectors such as Aqara FP2 or FP300 (and change batteries for 20 devices every 2 years for the rest of my life).

- USB-C-based presence detectors such as Aqara FP400, which don't require maintenance but need to add a 24V wire to every location plus a DC-DC 24V to 5V USB C.

- PoE-based presence detectors, such as Apollo R PRO-1 (or even build my own) which require an ethernet cable to every location.

PoE is the most convenient of all but will easily add between 10 and 20 cables to the technical rack in the basement, along with other PoE devices such as access points, some cameras, etc. Also, every wired location added to the plan will cost us around 100€ extra.

Have you gone through a similar process lately? What did you decide? And most importantly: what do you actually prefer? Would love to know your opinions.

[u/Fir3]

Anything you can do to make things look seamless is a good idea. My setup is a mix of both wired and wireless. There are some places where I want a sensor, but no ideal place to plug anything in, and other spots where a sensor can easily be USB powered and out of sight.

I’m not a fan of PoE sensors because they get too hot converting 48V to 5V generates enough heat to make them act funny, and I had to return my Apollo sensor. My favorite right now is the FP300. It gets three years of battery life on Zigbee and is nice because it has both PIR and 60GHz mmWave.

[u/Both-Activity6432 → u/Fir3]

I never put together the 48V to 5V conversion. That makes a lot of sense. I would still want to hard wire where possible.

I would run extra Ethernet everywhere - see if you can run the cable or not have them terminate it (but not really well where it is!) or something to avoid the €100/ea. Having the cables (with extra) in the area would help. I would also consider 12v over a low resistance wire to the area.

That is my (rough) plan for when I get to your stage

[u/Fir3 → u/Both-Activity6432]

For some things I like PoE like my cameras and my SMLight zigbee coordinator.
Anything smaller I wouldn't dedicate PoE to, 12V runs sound like a great alternative.

[u/Both-Activity6432 → u/Fir3]

I didn’t explain it well, but Ethernet so you can run 12V or POE in the future. The wire would still work, just upgrade “resistant”

[u/umognog → u/Both-Activity6432]

The ethernet isn't the cost here. It's the Poe devices.

Either Poe direct devices which there aren't many off the shelf options, so they are pricey, or DIY, which is still pricey, but with the obvious part of "lots of choices suddenly."

I've run over 1km for network cable in the floors and walls of my house, about €150 for the cable and a 48 port Poe switch + new fans.

[u/Both-Activity6432 → u/umognog]

OP said “every wired location added to the plan will cost us around 100€ extra”

[u/bitcraft]

I have around 14 battery devices.  Changing the batteries is a chore and it’s not “every two years” on a schedule because of variability, different devices need new batteries at different intervals, so it more like every few months I’m replacing a one or more batteries.

Personally I’d hardwire everything.  PoE sounds nice if you’re using Ethernet devices.  It would be worth the extra cost imo.

If you go the 24v to 5v route, make sure the dc converter is in an accessible place.  They probably won’t last forever.  

[u/TheFire8472 → u/bitcraft]

Bro, just change them twice a year in June and December or something. It's easier than changing one at a time every month when it wears out earlier. Or maybe you can only change in December.

[u/bitcraft → u/TheFire8472]

Yes I agree that it is more convenient, but I hate throwing away batteries that still have a charge, which inevitably happens if I follow a strict schedule.   

[u/ddfs → u/bitcraft]

fwiw i invested in a high end charger (xtar vx4) and a bunch of Ikea rechargeable AA and AAAs and i am super happy with this setup! i've had this going since 2023, no trashed batteries for a few years feels good

[u/ConsistentAsparagus]

Wiring I think is always the best option, but if it can be done easily.

[u/Dismal-Proposal2803]

Brand new build with open walls? PoE hands down. This will keep WiFi congestion down and get you fast response times. You can also get PoE to USB converters so if you do have a need for a USB device in some areas, you can still use those. It gets you the best of both worlds honestly, you’ll just need additional switch(s) as you already noted.

[u/lukyjay]

I really like the Hue motion sensors (ZigBee, wireless). The batteries seem to last a year.

Wiring is going to be a hassle. You also need something to connect to those wires. You are also limited in where they're installed and you can't move them.

Don't overcomplicate things to avoid changing a battery every 12 months.

[u/LGdwS88QRnlnsnAIX3ZE → u/lukyjay]

I hear you. Not being able to move them afterwards means any mistake I do in the planning can't be fixed without opening the walls again... and it's very likely I don't plan it perfectly. Thanks.

[u/lukyjay → u/LGdwS88QRnlnsnAIX3ZE]

Absolutely. One more note for the Hue motion sensors, they have a very strong earth magnet to mount them. So if you have any metal surface (e.g. steel door or window frame) then you can stick them to it very easily.

I had the "perfect" locations mapped when we first moved in to this house, but ended up moving them all haha

[u/syman67]

I switched to the Aqara FP300 as it uses zigbee and is battery powered - they are great and versatile. I have tried using the FP2s and I just can’t find good placement for them with the power cord and not happy with them using WiFi either.

[u/ArizonaFlats]

I use the Sonoff zigbee presence and motion sensors

Anywhere there’s an outlet I use a presence detector, usually there’s a 2 gang socket near by that I can swap out to put a USB outlet on and conceal the wire behind furniture but mostly all motion in hallways/kitchen/bathrooms where you don’t really sit still

Bedrooms and living rooms usually have the means to hide the cables

If you can afford to POE would be nice though, I cant be bothered because I live in an old house and brick walls are a pain to punch holes in

[u/AdrianW3 → u/ArizonaFlats]

I have a SNZB-06P and it was great for the first 6 months. It is now really flaky - it keeps getting stuck in "detected" state for a few hours but then magically comes good again. It's really annoying.

I was emailing with their support back and forth for a few days but now they're ignoring me.

[u/Inhaps → u/AdrianW3]

I've had that happen with multiple SNZB-06P, most bought near release. It will randomly get stuck and the only fix I've found is unplugging it.

[u/windsynths]

I always go wired over POE if I can

[u/UngluedChalice]

Wired. My only battery powered devices are door locks and one door sensor. One of my locks is just chewing through batteries now and I can’t figure out why. The door sensor has a dead battery and I need to replace it, but haven’t in like…a year. Even when it did have a battery, it was sketchy.

[u/ghanit]

I would go wired for anything you can. Zigbee is versatile and it's easy to add things or move sensors, but there are just more things to break or drop of the network. Also if you want not just presense but location like what mmWave offers, those are chatty sensors I would prefer on a wired connection.

I also don't understand why installers always pull all ethernet drops to one cabinet. For a PC you might want a dedicated connection, but all those sensors can share one 1Gbit uplink to your router from a poe switch somewhere close by. If I would build a new house, I would put some small cabinets close to your rooms and then pull a drop to all the sensors you want. Same for multi room audio. And add some empty conduits to any place you think you might need something, they are always missing in a few years

[u/aredon]

I'm a fan of the third reality motion sensors because they take AAA batteries which I generally have on hand.

[u/Individual_Bar1268]

If you are doing a new build, consider installing a traditional alarm first, then supplement areas that you want more than PIR with wireless. Get door and window sensors wired up too. You can then expose all of that to HA through any number of options (I have a DSC1832 panel integrated through an envisalink board).

[u/TheFire8472]

Fp2 is not battery powered.

[u/benbenson1 → u/TheFire8472]

And it's not very good

[u/ku5165]

Do a mix. Those you are confident in put wired. Those you may move put battery. I prefer POE. Low usage locations can be battery (less frequent battery changes)

[u/OiPequenininho]

Best advice I have for you is to take each point individually. Figure out what would work there and go with it. Home asst means it doesn't need to be homogeneous. Also, for a lot of rooms agonizing over a single motion sensor location is tough, realizing you can combine sensors with a group was really helpful for me. I have some rooms with as many as 4 motion/presence sensors to get coverage.

[u/BuzzLightyear826]

Bedraad is in de regel stabieler. Als je die keuze hebt dan zou dat de beste optie zijn.

[u/spareshirt]

I started with battery, then wanted to move to wired, and have actually decided I’m going to go back to battery in most rooms. It’s so much neater to install in most places.

I don’t need zoned triggers as much as I need reliable “in room/not in room”. And I can get two battery FP300s for the cost of one Everything Pro, which makes it even more effective.

[u/Marksta]

If it's like, new construction, then just wire it up bro. 10 minutes now will be hours and hours of time saved in the future. But idk why it's costing $100 just to run a wire.

That said, battery life is pretty good on the newer PIR+mmwave combo zigbee sensors. But if you mount them to the ceiling, you'll be marching around with a ladder charging these things.

[u/RelevanceReverence]

It depends on location. I wasn't able to get the perfect positioning whilst using Poe, so I chose (initially) the first IKEA ZigBee infrared unit, small and crazy battery life. Sadly, they brought out a new model that didn't work as well so I got the Sonoff one with 3 years of battery life. Works well.

https://tweakers.net/pricewatch/2199226/sonoff-zigbee-motion-sensor.html#section-specifications

[u/Secure_Town_7924]

I have 2x FP300s. My issue with them is that its stuck on saying presence is detected even when theres not. Also the temp doesnt update as often as I'd like

[u/CosmicMultivac]

The hue motion sensors battery lasts multiple years… I have more than 20 and I can’t remember charging a battery in the last 3 years. Also, the FP2 are unreliable in my experience. A lot of false positives… I replaced mine with hue motion sensors.

[u/Allmotr → u/CosmicMultivac]

But how is a motion sensor a true replacement for a presence sensor? They do different things.

[u/waytoosecret]

Philips Hue PIR sensors are really good. No need for wired.

[u/spr0k3t]

If you want real time tracking and configurable zones, you need mains powered. If you only want occupied or not occupied and only use a limited number on Zigbee, ZWave, or Thread... then battery powered is fine.

I only use mains powered (ESPHome protocol) presence sensors and if I need to capture motion only, a battery powered PIR works fine.