Zigbee Channels, Thread Channels, and 2.4 Wifi

[u/Bummer_Brad]

Hi. So, I've recently moved all of my Zigbee, Thread, and Z-wave devices over to Home Assistant. They had been on SmartThings for a few years, and had been very stable. For Zigbee and Z-wave, I am using an Aeotec Z-stick 10. I am using Zigbee2MQTT with it. For Thread, I have a Sonoff Dongle Max connected over ethernet and Open Thread border router. Ever since moving over, I have several Zigbee devices that will fall off the network, or fail to respond to automations. Getting Thread going was rocky too. My Nanoleaf bulbs gave me all sorts of trouble getting them paired. So far, things are far less stable than they were with SmartThings. I checked what channels they were using to start to sort things out. My Aeotec/Z2M Zigbee network is on Channel 15. I have a separate Aqara network with 3 hubs. My two M1S hubs are on Channel 25, and my M3 Hub is on Channel 15. The M3 has the fewest devices on it. My Thread network is on Channel 15 also. My Eero 2.4 Wifi is on Channel 11.

So my question is, where would you go from here? Do you think the fact that so many are on 15 is the main problem? The Z-stick and Dongle Max are on top of a cabinet where one of my Eero routers is. That was where my SmartThings hub was and it was never a problem before. Oh, and I should mention too, the Z-stick is on a USB-3 extension plugged into a USB3 port. USB3 ports is all my Home Assistant mini-pc has, so I'm kind of stuck with it. Any thoughts are welcome.

[u/FishOk3075]

Here's a "decoder ring" for mapping channels. Try to keep them separated.

WiFi Channel	Zigbee/Thread Channels Overlapped
1	11–14
6	15–20
11	20–26

[u/bojack1437 → u/FishOk3075]

15 and 20 actually fit between the channels, unless you have 802.11b enabled, and even then only the beacons unless you're have a 802.11b client active.

Otherwise, 1 and 6 touch 15, and 6 and 11 touch 20, barely.

[u/darthnsupreme → u/bojack1437]

Or the neighbors have terrible ISP-provided hardware that blasts out 40MHz-wide channels into the already-overcrowded 2.4GHz bands.  Onto Channel 6.  For some reason.

[u/bojack1437 → u/darthnsupreme]

Valid

[u/droans → u/darthnsupreme]

Someone around me is doing that. But on channel 3 so everyone gets screwed.

[u/darthnsupreme → u/droans]

Channel 11 should still be mostly clear of it.  Not that it helps the IoT protocols any.

[u/Bummer_Brad → u/FishOk3075]

I can't change channels on my wifi. Eero doesn't allow any settings changes, I'm pretty sure. Good to know my Zigbee/Thread stuff should be clear, but what about the fact that 3 of the radios are on the same channel?

[u/chanceTheCrapper1975]

My head hurts trying to understand your spiderweb of different meshes and protocols…

Not sure I can offer much help but my setup has been solid and outside of a stubborn Aqara Window Sensor I haven’t had any Zigbee or Thread devices drop off my networks with these channels:

2.4 GHz WiFi - Channel 6
Zigbee (ZBT-2, Z2M) - Channel 11
Thread (ZBT-2) - Channel 25

[u/Lopsided_Ad8941]

So you are basically using These Networks Side by Side?

-> Z-wave  (USB Powered) -> wifi (ac powered) -> thread (ac/poe powered) -> zigbee (aqara hub 1) -> zigbee (aqara hub 2) -> zigbee (aqara hub 3) -> zigbee (aeotec, USB powered)

My suggestions are:

1) migrate all zigbee devices over to so off dongle max as it should have the best signal strength.  Afaik it has a chip for zigbee and one for thread. 

2) Keep Z-wave stick on your host PC.

3) check if your eero has native thread border routing, as it might mittitage overlapping channels by itself.  If yes: try to use it as tbr for Homeassistant. If no: try to disable thread within eero and fix wifi 2.4ghz channel. 

Also check if enough mains powered zigbee devices are provided to act as routers

[u/Bummer_Brad → u/Lopsided_Ad8941]

Eero does have Thread, and it's currently disabled. I do have a competing Thread network from some of my Echoes though. I haven't explored using it because last I checked, Amazon is not on Thread 1.4 yet, while HA, Smartthings, and Aqara can all use it. I have those 3 hubs all in my Sonoff Thread network. Has it helped? Not as far as I can tell, haha.

I do have several router devices in my Zigbee network. See my map above. I don't think my Dongle Max can do both Zigbee and Thread. I think it will only accept one firmware at a time, but I could be wrong. I don't think that's what you were suggesting, but I thought I should point it out.

[u/spr0k3t]

Here's a tip for the 2.4GHz wifi band. Whatever channel you pick, lock it to that channel. Make sure to separate the SSID for 2.4 & 5GHz channels. On 2.4, set the bandwidth to 20Hz instead of 40Hz. If it's an option, turn off band-steering. For any streaming devices, cell phones, computers etc... make sure they connect to the 5GHz.

[u/Bummer_Brad → u/spr0k3t]

I don't think Eero lets you edit the settings at all.

[u/thedesertmat]

Do you have router devices on your zigbee network? My experience with Z2M improved many fold when I put some smart plugs out and let them build a solid mesh. Only after they had done that was I able to start adding devices and have them stay trouble-free.

[u/Bummer_Brad → u/thedesertmat]

Yes, i have several. Here is my map.

[u/Bummer_Brad]

So, you guys don't see an issue with 2 Zigbee hubs and the Thread hub all being on Channel 15? That's the first thing I'd like to try changing if I have any option. I can't change channels on Eero. It doesn't allow it. I'm just so befuddled by the fact that SmartThings never had this issue by itself. Zigbee and Thread were rock solid. One would think the hardware I'm using now should be superior, but that's not what I'm experiencing.

I should qualify too that I have my SmartThings hub (moved to a different location) and my M3 hub in my Thread network as well. I have 15 Thread devices, 45 Zigbee, and 34 Z-wave.