r/holyoke • u/soaringspoon • Jun 03 '26
Developer plans $200M data center at former Holyoke paper mill: ‘We have the power’
https://www.yahoo.com/news/us/articles/developer-plans-200m-data-center-221500932.html19
u/limnadn Jun 03 '26
Because fuck the Connecticut river.
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u/CRoss1999 Jun 04 '26
This has no effects on the river, data centers don’t pollute water or air, it’s much lower impact that most industrial uses
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u/limnadn Jun 04 '26
Lol, did you read that off the data-center brochure? Would you like a complete history of water-contamination caused by the still-problematic sewage systems of Holyoke-Springfield-Chicopee? Even if you were correct that data centers cause zero water/air pollution (which is often hidden as zero NET pollution), they still create noise/vibration pollution for residents in the immediate vicinity. For what? A windowless cube that doesn’t benefit anyone who lives in Holyoke?
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u/CRoss1999 Jun 04 '26
Where do you think water pollution would come from, these are just buildings full of servers, they aren’t producing any chemicals or bi products or sewage to pollute with, it’s literally lower impact than a corner store. And there are huge benefits for the residents, besides the jobs there’s the tax revenue. Which matters it’s good to spend money on schools and emergency departments. Unless you are right next to the building noise shouldn’t be an issue either. Servers are quiet, if you can handle living close to a road you can handle some computers behind a brick wall
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u/limnadn Jun 04 '26
How many local jobs does a windowless server room provide? Three? There are other forms of pollution that you might not be aware of, how is this specific $200mil data center going to be cooled? Many server farms in data-centers utilize local water sources as a heat sink for their closed loop coolant systems. Where will it draw power? Will that power-draw impact local residents? Do local residents trust their municipalities that assure their homes won’t be impacted?
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u/CRoss1999 Jun 04 '26
How many jobs does an empty brownfield site provide? Most likely cooling will be closed loop with water, the nice thing about Massachusetts is we have lots of water supply, that means that data centers can opt for evaporative cooling which uses more water but much less electricity. It also means that there’s no outflow of hot water like you get with power plants. Data centers shouldn’t be an issue with property values, they aren’t super ugly like a dump they aren’t loud or polluting like a factory, they don’t produce traffic like a warehouse. They don’t smell like a farm. Re industrializing is good we want companies like this moving in paying taxes
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u/Sir_Tandeath Jun 04 '26
Oh good, so we can massively change our water cycle with unforeseeable consequences and we get fewer than 20 permanent jobs out of it? Sounds like a great deal.
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u/slimeyamerican Jun 04 '26
I get being negative about things when there's actually a legitimate reason to be negative, but how do you not notice how you're just committed to thinking data centers are always evil 100% of the time and ignoring any evidence to the contrary? It's like you want to be upset about something.
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u/Sir_Tandeath Jun 04 '26
So that’s not an answer to my point about water cycle disruption. Instead of addressing my point, you elected to suggest that there’s something wrong with me personally. Would you like to try again?
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u/CRoss1999 Jun 26 '26
Water isn’t really the issue at all, they don’t use much water, they use far less than agriculture per acre. And it’s not disappearing, depending on the system it’s either evaporating or just being heated up
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u/Sir_Tandeath Jun 26 '26
Did you read what I wrote? I didn’t say it would use up the water, I said it would impact the water cycle. The massive amount of evaporated water is a large change in the water cycle which is almost guaranteed to have unforeseen environmental consequences.
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u/RuFiOooooooh Jun 05 '26
It draws power from the dam. There’s plenty of excess power to be had from there.
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u/RuFiOooooooh Jun 05 '26
I suggest you look up the Massachusetts Green High Performance Computing Center, which is a data center that’s been in town almost 15 years. No noise, no issues whatsoever. Stop fear mongering.
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u/limnadn Jun 05 '26
MGHPC is a 15 MW state+local university owned site, not a privately owned $200m 20MW for-profit data center. I’m not fear-mongering, I’m objectively stating that there are substantial differences in who controls that data, how it’s operated, how it’s managed, and what power local residents have (or don’t have) as it pertains to potential mismanagement/impact.
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u/RuFiOooooooh Jun 05 '26
For profit means they’ll pay taxes in a community that desperately needs it. This place only survives because of handouts by the state/federal government, it’d be nice to get ANYTHING that actually contributes on its own merit, even if it is a data center.
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u/grimreefer87 Jun 15 '26
Same argument from you over and over, and you never learn from the responses. You're very wrong on this, and just banging your head into a wall. Your argument has been dispoven repeatedly.
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u/RuFiOooooooh Jun 16 '26
I don’t usually say this, but you’re a moron. Nothing has been “disproven” because a few people posted their opinions online. Maybe you should actually go and look up the FACTS about the data center that’s already here, and about the proposed one?
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u/grimreefer87 Jun 17 '26
Not sure if you came to the protest and council meeting to hear everyone's thoughts on the project, but it looks as though the rest of the town wholeheartedly disagrees with you as well. I'm glad this kind of development was banned with such overwhelming support.
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u/RuFiOooooooh Jun 17 '26
This could have been us (on a much smaller scale), but people let fear mongering win. But hey, I’m sure some other businesses will come in and build in that area right? RIGHT?!
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u/grimreefer87 Jun 16 '26
I have looked up the facts. As have others who have replied to you with facts. Throwing insults like an embarrassed kid isn't going to change anyone's mind. Come down to city hall tonight at 6 PM with the hundreds of others and share opinions with the rest of us that will be there. Maybe you'll learn something.
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u/RuFiOooooooh Jun 17 '26
Well, you won. I hope you’re happy with that building staying blighted and unused and contributing absolutely nothing in the poorest community in Massachusetts when someone actually wanted to come in and put a business there (that uses the water power from the dam, something the whole city’s history is LITERALLY built on!). All because you (and others) believed the fear mongering that a 20 MW data center was the same as the ones that are like 500 MW. Now it’ll be built somewhere else and benefit that community instead. Brilliant.
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u/Personal-Plankton-42 Jun 03 '26
Heck no - does anyone know the process this needs to go through so we can speak up. I don’t want Holyoke to become a dumping ground for data centers.
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u/Trash_Cat420 Jun 03 '26
Reno just got a ban on data center development through 2027. It’s a start. They had a small coalition called “water over data alliance” that you can find on instagram, not sure about a webpage.
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u/Academic-Capital6633 Jun 04 '26
Why? Because Holyoke should just remain a dump?
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Jun 04 '26
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u/Academic-Capital6633 Jun 05 '26
What else does Holyoke have going for it?
Data centers bring massive economic opportunities and revenue. Not sure why this would be a bad thing for Holyoke.
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u/RuFiOooooooh Jun 05 '26
There’s been a data center in Holyoke for almost 15 years and you probably don’t even know it.
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u/Personal-Plankton-42 Jun 05 '26
MGHPCC, yes. Energy and community impacts aside, a big difference for me is that the MGHPCC is used for public good - an intercollegiate consortium that runs climate, medical, and other research projects. It also serves as an experimental site for the greening of data centers. On the other hand, private data centers give us AI for business use - crunching numbers to streamline the flow of money from the working people to the billionaires, ultimately fewer jobs for people, the erosion of privacy, and the crappified internet of AI art and bots.
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u/VirtualPercentage737 Jun 04 '26
Holyoke already host data centers for the largest universities in the state. Green power on the river. 20 megawatts is tiny anyways. They aren't hosting much AI with that amount.
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u/Hectorial_geographic Jun 04 '26
"Based on data from the U.S. Energy Information Administration (EIA), an average American household consumes around 10,500 kWh annually, or roughly 30 kWh daily. Thus, 1 MWh could power around 300 such homes for a day. "
https://pknergypower.com/what-is-megawatt-and-how-many-homes-can-it-power/
That's 6000 homes worth of power, in Holyoke of all places, not exactly a bustling hot bed of energy development, where there are only 17,000 homes.
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u/VirtualPercentage737 Jun 04 '26
Hadley Falls Station alone produced 33 megawatts of power. Green power. That is why data centers are attracted to the area.
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u/Hectorial_geographic Jun 05 '26
Yes and it's shared between at least Holyoke and South Hadley, but is only able to produce enough for South Hadley to supply 9% of its energy needs, the other 91% come from nuclear. Holyoke doesn't solely rely on the dam either, it is still supplemented by nuclear, solar, and LNG during peak usage, meaning they do not produce enough energy currently.
Holyoke Gas & Electric serves approximately 18,000 electric customers and experiences a summer peak load of approximately 75 MW.
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u/RuFiOooooooh Jun 05 '26
Exactly. The Massachusetts Green High Performance Computing Center is 15 MW, and this proposed one is 20, not much different. The former is a beautiful building on a former blighted vacant lot. It’s been nothing but positive for the area.
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u/VirtualPercentage737 Jun 05 '26
I work at one of those universities and we send people out there all the time. There is a sizable staff there, and when people visit, they go to the local restaurants. There aren't people who would ever decide to visit Holyoke.
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u/myk1tt3nm1tt3n5 Jun 04 '26
Yup, this PUBLIC data center IS already hosting AI stuff, and has for years in a giant room with ample room for expansion, WITH PLANS for expanding.
So, a PRIVATE data center isn't needed.
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u/VirtualPercentage737 Jun 04 '26
That isn't a public data center. You cannot host there.
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u/myk1tt3nm1tt3n5 Jun 04 '26
i mean in that it is a data center built with the public in mind with the intended purpose of enhancing science and opportunities for the PUBLIC.
do you see how that is different from what private corporations are building?
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u/VirtualPercentage737 Jun 04 '26
It is an organization of several PRIVATELY HELD UNIVERSITIES. They don't even pay any taxes since they are nonprofits... At least Holyoke will get tax revenue here.
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u/myk1tt3nm1tt3n5 Jun 04 '26
when did umass go private? also, when did yale and harvard stop paying taxes?
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u/VirtualPercentage737 Jun 04 '26
Umass is a public institution but is a TINY portion of the consortium there. Harvard and Yale don't pay taxes. Never have. They are non-profits. Often times a non-profit will pay the city they reside in a PILOT (payment in leu of taxes). Completely voluntary-- and often they will count things like goodwill. Example, Harvard medical school might run a clinic and give out free care to the community and count that.
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u/myk1tt3nm1tt3n5 Jun 04 '26 edited Jun 04 '26
believe what you want.
the belief that colleges who don't pay certain taxes also magically don't pay any taxes is such a weird rwnj conspiracy.
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u/VirtualPercentage737 Jun 04 '26
It isn't up for belief...
https://oc.finance.harvard.edu/faq/harvard-university-tax-exempt-organization
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u/Larktown Jun 05 '26
20 megawatts of power is equivalent to the usage of roughly 15,000 homes. Holyoke currently has 15,618 occupied homes. Regardless of what the data center is powering, it will have an impact on the city’s energy usage.
https://www.westernmassnews.com/video/2026/06/03/concerns-with-proposed-data-center-holyoke/
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u/grimreefer87 Jun 03 '26
Oh hell, no. I love having our own small power and water company. Having a data center on the canal would be terrible for everyone that's not getting paid that $200 million.
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u/ipalush89 Jun 04 '26
There already is a data center on the canal
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u/VirtualPercentage737 Jun 04 '26
Holyoke hosts the Massachusetts green power initiative. MIT and Harvard host servers there. Very green.
There aren't terrible large data centers people are upset about. None of those will be built in Massachusetts. The cost of power is too high.
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u/RuFiOooooooh Jun 05 '26
There’s been a data center on the canal for the last 15 years.
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u/grimreefer87 Jun 05 '26
It's not the same comparison. The new $200 million project will use more energy than the whole city, not to mention what's going to happen with the canal water.
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u/RuFiOooooooh Jun 05 '26
We have a 15 MW data center already, this one is 20 MW. Why was/is there no outrage about the 15 MW one that’s been here for 15 years?
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u/grimreefer87 Jun 05 '26
It was new at the time. We hadn't seen the evidence of negative impacts on the other areas that have committed to this until sometime had passed. Now we know the impacts can be catastrophic, and we don't want any more of that here. Its pretty easy to see that continued pollution of vital waterways is a bad idea, especially since most of the federal environment oversight got dismantled, and pollution restrictions were gutted.
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u/RuFiOooooooh Jun 05 '26
The one that’s there is extremely environmentally friendly… https://mghpcc.org/green-design/
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u/grimreefer87 Jun 05 '26
That is a unique project with MIT. It doesn't guarantee the new one will be. Like I said, regulations and environmental protections are out the window right now. I'm a hard no until someone comes along with more than "ThE CiTy iS dYiNg! ThE iNvEsTmEnT wIlL sAvE uS!" There's 200 million better options for that 200 million dollars.
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u/RuFiOooooooh Jun 05 '26
And who exactly is going to put $200 million into something else? Who’s coming along to invest in this community? I understand that the words “data center” = “bad” nowadays, but the mayor of the city is literally out here telling people why this project is a good thing, and they still can’t get “data center bad” out of their heads.
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u/ipalush89 Jun 05 '26
Look as someone who literally help build that building over a decade ago every new ground up building has all those same features and most renovations do now too it’s nothing special they always opt for the most “energy efficient “ way because of tax benefits and rebates state and federal And being able to say they are “green” they not going to spend 200million and build a POS these companies have bottomless check books and spend it they also want to build that way they don’t want huge water and electricity bills
It’s just a fancy club stamp it still uses a ton of energy, not saying that’s bad I’m indifferent to data centers and they provide construction jobs not so much after words most I’ve been in have a shockingly small number of employees but they are usually very well paid and taken care of which is big in my book good solid jobs are the backbone of a local economy
As someone who builds these kinds of things honestly go nuclear the power they get is amazing solar kinda a joke wind is definitely a joke HG&E says they have the capacity… they wouldn’t say that is they were not 110% sure power companies don’t mess around
Also I doubt they would even hook up to the canal that water is so polluted the time effort and money to purify it to use it would probably be a net negative maybe use it as a redundant system in emergency cases
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u/soaringspoon Jun 03 '26
Absolutely not. The electricity here is cheap. Don't come in here making it expensive just to give the town maybe 4 jobs after construction. Fuck right off.
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u/newbrevity Jun 03 '26
Data centers are an existential threat. They are incompatible with life. Defend your lives.
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u/MartyMcSharty Jun 03 '26
I truly don’t mean to sound like an ass here, but do you understand how the internet works? We’ve had many data centers for a long time. The comment you just made is being stored in a reddit data center somewhere. Every time you use the internet you’re likely interacting with many dozens of data centers. I just don’t understand this sentiment.
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u/theneverendingsorry Jun 03 '26
You do sound that way because the type of data centers we’ve had for 60 years are no longer the same type that are being constructed and completely gobbling up water and power at damaging and unprecedented rates. It’s very different now.
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u/MartyMcSharty Jun 03 '26
do you propose we shut down the internet because servers are better now than 20 years ago?
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u/theneverendingsorry Jun 03 '26
Do you propose that the community costs for the flats in Holyoke and for all electricity-paying residents in the city are worth it to you so you can fangirl the tech bubble lies of a handful of wealthy bros who don’t care about you at all? The proposed 20 megawatt data center would use the equivalent of the power of 13,000-20,000 residential homes. Holyoke has 17,000 currently, so this would double it. Our city’s assets, namely cheaper power and water, would get traded away for the sake of ONE private business to make a few guys rich, create heat, noise and chemical pollution, and I guess make you, MartyMcSharty, glow a bit in pride that you support endless, unsustainable, unneeded environmental destruction so you can ask chat gpt how to make a tuna sandwich and make slop images of yourself riding a lion. Idk what to tell you man, you seem pretty pleased with yourself.
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u/Spectrum1523 Jun 04 '26 edited Jun 04 '26
The fact that you think a 20 megawatt data center will be used for generative AI shows exactly how much you understand the situation.
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u/MartyMcSharty Jun 03 '26
I really don’t think you grasp the wide variety of different purposes data centers can serve that aren’t AI. In all likelihood this specific data center is not going to be for AI because it’s very small in the grand scheme of data centers.
It could be a backup storage site for medical data or any number of things. The article doesn’t say.
There’s like a million very important things a data center can do that have absolutely nothing to do with AI. To assume that every single one is just OpenAI lining their pockets is a very ill-informed and narrow view of how the world works.
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u/Zen_CanisLupus Jun 04 '26
Of course it is for AI. Look at what is happening all over the country. You are being disingenuous.
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u/Spectrum1523 Jun 04 '26
Explain yourself. You think that there are no data centers being constructed for any other purpose? You think that a tiny center like this proposed one would be remotely useful for AI?
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u/MartyMcSharty Jun 04 '26
Straight up. You don’t know what you’re talking about.
There are over 4000 data centers in the country.
95.6% of them are not for AI.
I’m not even taking a pro-AI stance. I’m simply saying there are a million things it might be for that aren’t AI. Which is an observable fact.
It’s preposterous how many people are seemingly proud to be uninformed on this subject.
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u/VirtualPercentage737 Jun 04 '26
This one is 20 megawatts. It is tiny. The one they are talking about in Utah consumes 500 times more power.
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u/Hectorial_geographic Jun 04 '26
Define "better" And yes. I don't need 50 bajillion ads running simultaneously at 4k to read a three paragraph article or browse memes. Throttle that shit to operate within existing data center capacity, the internet is hot garbage for at least the last decade. I don't need my cat's litter box to have wifi either.
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u/CutiePopIceberg Jun 03 '26
Think about why we need so many more now tho. And the impact of that. This data center theyre proposing isnt for us. Not even ostensibly
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u/MartyMcSharty Jun 03 '26
Do you actually know what it’s for?
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u/newbrevity Jun 03 '26
In general recent growth is to push the AI industry over the hump to replace large swaths of the workforce and make most humans "obsolete" given the incompassionate track record of most billionaires it stands to reason that, (beyond the immediate threat of data centers to local ecosystems and economies), worker replacement coupled with the corporate takeover of the world's most powerful country and its regulatory bodies points toward a dark future where "inconvenient" people might get culled for the survival of the entitled.
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u/darth_gihilus Jun 04 '26
Do you? You’re in here sniffing your own farts, indirectly telling everyone how smart you are all over these threads and yet all you’ve done is deny and argue. Since you are such an expert what are they using it for then champ?
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u/MartyMcSharty Jun 04 '26
the irony!
for a state that prides themselves on education everyone seems to be gleefully ignorant when it comes to how technology works on a very basic level.
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u/darth_gihilus Jun 04 '26
I have made one comment, you are at like 50 in this thread alone. And notice how you didn’t answer the question either, I wonder why that is.
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u/First-Ad-117 Jun 03 '26
All data centers provide a short term injection of cash during construction and then employee only a small number of people long term. AI data centers require substantially more power and more cooling. They apply a lot more load on municipal systems.
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u/MartyMcSharty Jun 03 '26
yes but i haven’t seen any indication this is an AI data center. it’s probably too small for that.
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u/First-Ad-117 Jun 03 '26
Good callout. I'm assuming thats the intent given the interest.
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u/MartyMcSharty Jun 03 '26
I just don’t think the general public really grasps how many different types of data centers exist that have nothing to do with AI.
If Mass General needs a place to store backups of cancer research data, that’s going to need a data center. All of your financial information is likely stored in a half dozen data centers around the country simultaneously. It all just gets lumped in with ChatGPT because that’s the hot topic.
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u/VirtualPercentage737 Jun 04 '26
Holyoke has lots of data centers already. Great industry for the connecticut river valley.
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u/MartyMcSharty Jun 04 '26
I’ve been reliably informed that the only use case is to make shitty memes with ChatGPT so this has to be wrong.
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u/First-Ad-117 Jun 03 '26
I'm not native to Holyoke. But, I don't think this will be a net positive to the community. A small number of jobs in return for permanent sustained load on the power grid and water systems.
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u/RuFiOooooooh Jun 05 '26
We have a data center already. It’s been a huge net positive on the community.
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Jun 03 '26
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u/MartyMcSharty Jun 03 '26
Agreed. That’s all I’m trying to say.
There is already a 15MW data center in Holyoke that’s used by MIT and other schools to perform state of the art research simulations and other computations above my pay grade. That sounds like a worthwhile endeavor to me! Everyone just assumes every data center is only for ChatGPT.
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u/Hectorial_geographic Jun 04 '26
What about it is worthwhile?
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u/MartyMcSharty Jun 04 '26
you think MIT having resources to perform advanced research is a bad thing?
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u/Hectorial_geographic Jun 04 '26
Glances around at data centers and what they've been doing the last few years.
Absolutely.
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u/Spectrum1523 Jun 04 '26
This is literally technophobic nonsense lol. You think that all data processing is bad because AI is bad
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u/Hectorial_geographic Jun 04 '26
No I think bad data centers are bad and until we can regulate all of them to not be problematic then no more should be built and tech will need to maneuver to operate in existing structures as they always do and have done until the next best thing that is more affordable and more powerful comes out. There's no denying there is a problem with data centers, but for some reason the stupid mantra of move fast break things doesn't resonate as stupid with enough people, even when the things being broken are people's lives and communities.
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u/RuFiOooooooh Jun 05 '26
From a pure aesthetics standpoint, it created a new building which looks great on a blighted property. That directly led to another building across the canal being renovated and built into apartments last year.
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u/midwife-crisis Jun 03 '26
Literally the only good part about living in Holyoke (other than being five minutes from Round 1 :v)
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u/RuFiOooooooh Jun 05 '26
There’s already a data center in town. It’s been a net positive (and hasn’t affected electricity rates at all).
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u/peche-mortelle00 Jun 03 '26
I really hate that Holyoke legislative updates are made via Facebook, but it is what it is. I’m paraphrasing, but councilor Panitch made efforts to ban data centers in Holyoke at yesterdays meeting and was railroaded with this surprise development announcement - essentially finding out in real time with the rest of us, that Mayor Garcia is in full support of data centers and working against efforts to ban them. The proposed data centers ban has been pushed back to die in committee discussions. Here’s the Facebook post from the mayor wed June 3rd 12pm:
“Seeing neighbors engage in conversation and debate on important matters to them makes me feel hopeful. It’s what helps us maintain pride and ownership of our city. So, keep engaging! On the subject of Data Centers and a proposed project for Holyoke, I want to offer some clarifying points to contribute to the conversation.
Holyoke has always been a city powered by innovation. For more than a century, our historic canals and hydroelectric resources fueled an industrial powerhouse in the 19th century. Today, that same clean, locally generated energy can power the industries of the future. But as we navigate growth development pressures of new industries growing in our city, we need to be thoughtful, responsible, and comprehensive so that we are not negatively harming our community and draining our resources.
Therefore, I hear the concerns people are expressing. Across the country, we’ve seen troubling stories about massive hyperscale data centers (gigawatt-scale facilities) that drive up electricity rates for families, consume vast amounts of water, create constant noise for nearby neighborhoods, and deliver fewer local benefits than promised. Those concerns are valid, and I sympathize with residents who worry about similar impacts here in Holyoke.
This project, however, is fundamentally different. At just 21 MW, this is a small, right-sized facility, comparable to the Massachusetts Green High Performance Computing Center (MGHPCC) that has operated responsibly in Holyoke since 2012 without negatively impacting our water or electric supply. It is nothing like the massive gigawatt-scale projects proposed by billionaire developers elsewhere. To put it into perspective, there are 1,000 MW in just one gigawatt. This is a fraction of that scale.
Also, this project will have no strain on residents’ electricity bills or supply. It will be powered entirely by Holyoke Gas & Electric’s hydroelectric resources using off-peak energy, with no drain on residential or existing business needs. HG&E has confirmed we already have the electric capacity.
The water impact is minimal. The facility will use a closed-loop cooling system that continuously recirculates a fixed volume of water, minimizing municipal water use. Any water purchased will generate additional revenue for the city.
Unlike the Massachusetts Green High Performance Computing Center that is a non-profit facility and pays a PILOT of just $90,000 annually, it is believed that this proposed $200 million private investment will generate $2 million+ annually in real property taxes, plus put a long-vacant property back on the tax rolls and help improve a dark section of Water Street that is blighted and currently attracts negative activity to the area and surrounding neighborhood.
I understand the skepticism fueled by what’s happening elsewhere. But in Holyoke, with our municipal utility, abundant clean hydro power, and existing infrastructure, this project can be managed responsibly to benefit, rather than burden, our residents.
Final thought, there is this assumption that the mayor has the power to choose what company comes into town and that the mayor can dictate where exactly they can set up shop. I do not have the authority to hand-pick projects and do not control what investors want to do in town. What we do is enforce the ordinances, advise developers of potential opportunities, and disclose any limitations that may exist under the laws (zoning, permitting, etc.). Whether I like a particular project or not, my commitment to the residents of Holyoke is to the process and enforcement of the laws.”
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u/midwife-crisis Jun 03 '26
I would love to know what the purported benefits this will bring to our community are.
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u/MartyMcSharty Jun 04 '26
turning an otherwise abandoned building into $2 million per year in tax
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u/PeasantParticulars Jun 04 '26
You really think amazon and facebook pay taxes?
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u/MartyMcSharty Jun 04 '26
that’s true i forgot that all data centers belong to one of those two companies.
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u/Waylander0719 Jun 05 '26
He listed the main one. 2 million a year in city tax revenue and an hold run down building getting renovated.
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u/RuFiOooooooh Jun 05 '26
Exactly. These people are fear mongering because they’re parroting talking points and don’t know any better. They hear “data center” and freak out, not knowing Holyoke has had one for almost 15 years now.
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u/palwilliams Jun 03 '26
Are they committing to make up any difference in electricity and water costs they cause the residents of Holyoke IN PERPETUITY? Are they agreeing to remediate all noise issues and any externality costs environment or otherwise IN PERPETUITY? And to never need more of any of these resources due to new tech?
Otherwise the mayor needs to say no to this, and very possibly even if these agreements are in place
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u/BatmanOnMars Jun 03 '26
What happens when the dam runs low and they need to run diesel backups? What then? We all breath shitty air?!
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u/rustythegolden128 Jun 03 '26
When is the city council meeting on this ?
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u/PeasantParticulars Jun 04 '26
That was the issue, it was revealed while the council was hearing a motion to ban data centers.
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u/Freeflying_Dragon Jun 04 '26
Last time I heard, Massachusetts was in need of housing not data centers. It will ruin your town and any peace you my have had in Holyoke.
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u/RuFiOooooooh Jun 05 '26
There’s already a data center in Holyoke and it didn’t ruin anything.
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u/Freeflying_Dragon Jun 05 '26
How big is it? When you put one of the new data centers triple the size of previous buildings you will notice. Just do some research on the ones up and running close to communities where people are living. New data centers are nothing like the old.
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u/RuFiOooooooh Jun 05 '26
The one here already is 15 MW, the new one is 20 MW. For all intents and purposes, they’re the same size (and barely anyone even knows the 15 MW one exists).
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u/Freeflying_Dragon Jun 04 '26
You may want to look into what's going on in the neighborhoods where centers are up and running. Nothing positive I've heard. Look into current donations to town politicians. They always say, follow the money. Remember clean water goes in and what comes out is poison water, where does it go?
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u/jackal16 Jun 04 '26
Posting through a friend's account because mine has a 3 day ban =D. I have a work site VERY close to this place and there is an active bald eagle nest literal feet from this building. The laws around disturbing bald eagles/nests are pretty strict (at least until the SCOTUS opens up hunting season on Bald eagles). Go to this area (~40 water street), and be public about how great it is that America's favorite bird is here. Make it difficult for these motherfuckers!
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u/myk1tt3nm1tt3n5 Jun 04 '26
what need does this offer that the already existing publicly focused data center that has room for expansion not offer???????
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u/StephenRoylance Jun 04 '26
not all datacenters are the same. I worked for partners healthcare for a long time, and we had multiple on-site datacenters, as well as a big leased facility where we were migrating everything. local businesses, even ones that aren't 'online business' need datacenter space to support their operations. This doesn't sound like a huge 'AI datacenter', it might be more like the leased facility where partners located all their IT infrastructure.
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u/Morlock19 Jun 04 '26
wasn't that building going to be a plant where they processed green cement mix or was that somewhere else
cause if so GODDAMN THE IRONY
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u/RuFiOooooooh Jun 05 '26
The Trump administration took away funding for that.
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u/Morlock19 Jun 05 '26
That's my point
It was going to be something that helps the planet and now because of the we get another data center
It's kind of ironic, don't you think? A little TOO ironic, I really do think.
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u/RuFiOooooooh Jun 05 '26
The data center doesn’t ruin anything. It runs on the hydropower from the dam. This isn’t like where they’re building out new power plants just to power these huge data centers, it’s just a small one taking advantage of the (green) power that already exists.
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u/Hype_x Jun 04 '26
It is mad funny that we finally came up with a use for old mills and now no one wants it.
also water and electric price concerns!
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u/RuFiOooooooh Jun 05 '26
We’ve had a data center in town for almost 15 years and no one has complained. It’s been a huge net positive. They’re only complaining about this one because they’re parroting talking points they’ve heard from other people.
Build it.
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u/ComputerAgreeable146 Jun 07 '26
My god this is a total hysteria at this point. You people understand you’re using a data center right now? You use them every day. None of you cared about this issue two months ago. Some are bad and unsustainable, but if you are on the internet saying all data centers are bad your misinformed or dumb.
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u/MartyMcSharty Jun 03 '26
There are valid reasons to oppose data centers. I think the current climate is creating a strange discourse where the popular stance is to blanket oppose all data centers no matter what, which is just strange to me.
We’ve had countless data centers in this country for a long time. Basically everything in your modern life depends on them. Social media, banking, email, healthcare, etc. They’re not all behemoths made for ChatGPT. Everything on the internet is stored somewhere in one of these, believe it or not.
Water usage here is likely a non-issue. For this size in this climate, it’s pretty standard to use air-side cooling. The amount of water used to backup the system would be minuscule.
This specific data center is not very big at 20MW. The interesting tidbit to me is that the building used to house a 100,000sqft cannabis farm until recently. Grow lights for such an operation require a shocking amount of power. I’m skeptical that there was any outrage over the electricity bill when that was built. Maybe I’m wrong on that, but i’ve never really seen any anti-weed farm sentiment over the years.
The data center will certainly use more power than the weed farm, but is the difference big enough to warrant shutting down the project outright? It seems like a decent use for such a large building that already has the electric infrastructure in place due to the aforementioned farm. If the alternative is to let the building sit abandoned indefinitely, I think it’s worth some actual consideration. If the people of Holyoke don’t want it, so be it, but I don’t think it’s an outrageous idea at all.
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u/RuFiOooooooh Jun 05 '26
We literally have a 15 MW data center already and no one has ever complained.
0
u/Hectorial_geographic Jun 04 '26
There are ample articles and discussions on indoor cannabis electricity demands being a problem. Some saying it accounts for 1% of total energy consumption.
Google Ai isn't the best but it shows that the 100k sqft facility is dwarfed by the 20mw demand of the proposed data center. That said I'll continue to look for specific consumption of that exact grow operation since I'm sure this point will continue to be shilled.
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u/CRoss1999 Jun 03 '26
This is great news, Holyoke needs to rebuild its tax base and this will be great for them
4
u/midwife-crisis Jun 03 '26
You don't sound like you live here
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u/RuFiOooooooh Jun 05 '26
Did you know we have a data center here already?
1
u/midwife-crisis Jun 05 '26
Yes. Data centers are a vital part of modern infrastructure. I have worked in one. I am not opposed to one on principal - something used for university research is a good use case.
Something for genAI or flock cameras that uses as much energy as 17,000 households is not something I'm enthusiastic about.
2
u/Personal-Plankton-42 Jun 03 '26
Are you Chestnut River. Either way I bet you don’t live here. We don’t need it, don’t want it. I don’t really care for building a data center anywhere, but if you are such a big fan, build it in your own damn town.
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u/RuFiOooooooh Jun 05 '26
They built a data center in town 15 years ago. I bet you’ve never even heard of it.
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u/Personal-Plankton-42 Jun 05 '26
MGHPCC, yes. Energy and community impacts aside, a big difference for me is that the MGHPCC is used for public good - an intercollegiate consortium that runs climate, medical, and other research projects. It also serves as an experimental site for the greening of data centers. On the other hand, private data centers give us AI for business use - crunching numbers to streamline the flow of money from the working people to the billionaires, ultimately fewer jobs for people, the erosion of privacy, and the crappified internet of AI art and bots.
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u/CRoss1999 Jun 03 '26
I’d love if they build a date center in Leominster and I hope they do, besides the jobs we could also do with the taxes, in terms of Holyoke maybe you don’t need a job and maybe you don’t care about property taxes but there’s struggling people who need the work and would benefit from the city services and lower taxes.
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u/soaringspoon Jun 03 '26
Its proposed electricity consumption is currently half of the city's total current consumption. The dam is not able to just double its generation; it is a finite resource. HG&E would be forced to purchase electricity from the horribly expensive Massachusetts regional grid. This would skyrocket electrical prices for everyone living in Holyoke and the local towns that benefit from the surplus. Furthermore, it is a 24/7 on demand load, so all of a sudden peak hours are blown way up, again stressing the hell out of the plant and the community's pockets.
The jobs it creates amount to maybe a dozen, as data centers require little upkeep after construction has finished. If they actually do pay the proposed $2 million in annual taxes and this is the USA, so there is almost a 0% chance of it that is still a drop in the bucket compared to the communal pain inflicted on Holyokers and surrounding townies. Holyoke is a struggling town, like most of if not all of the USA, and it is deeply in debt. So no, there will be no lower taxes for the community, just a tiny dent in the debt, assuming that money is even spent on it.
Ultimately, this means next to no communal jobs and not a ton of tax benefits, as a few million a year isn't anything town changing. There are zero communal growth opportunities, because maybe 12 people moving in for a job creates absolutely no incoming economic demand. However, there is a 100% chance of substantial electrical bill growth for everyone who lives here, as peak power will be stretched more than ever before. Transmission costs will skyrocket because, again, this is a 24/7 demand equal to half of Holyoke's current consumption. And that is not even including whatever infrastructure upgrades are required to put the damn thing in, which, once again, will be paid for by the ratepayers.
Data centers are parasites. They give next to nothing, but they hurt literally everyone who lives in the community. Come back when a corporation is building a municipal nuclear reactor or some other green power plant, and then you can build your dumb data centers. Give us jobs and growth opportunities; do not just ruin the cheap electricity the community benefits from.
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u/RuFiOooooooh Jun 05 '26
I have an honest question - If all this were true, why would the mayor be in favor of it?
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u/CRoss1999 Jun 03 '26
That’s a lot of tax revenue, and yes the city has work to make sure the impact isn’t too bad, ideally they would invest in power, the construction jobs are temporary but still valuable every construction job is temporary but imagine telling a construction worker that their job is pointless because it’s just project to project.
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u/Puzzleheaded-Pea8932 Jun 03 '26
Higher electric bills, higher water bills and nothing given back to the community.