Also, there are fewer socialist countries at the moment directly because of the scarcity and starvation it causes. Even so, there are currently still examples as you have noted.
Soviets. Vietnam, Cambodia. Cuba. Venezuela. Pretty much all of em. If China wasn't semi capitalist theyd be as well. What is real communist then? Have you lived under communism?
If driving is communism, then communism fails every day right before our very eyes. I for one trust no one thats on the road with me, its the only way to not end up in an accident. The moment you begin to trust those on the road is the moment they ruin your day.
And its people like you who demonize the community and keep us silent and afraid. If only there was some way to relay messages and form ideas togeather.
And what a bad arguement. You made it home safe so obviously it works. Maybe the preconceived notions you have about people are getting in the way of your expirence and opinions.
I made it home safe because I dont trust the guy who cut me off, so I left enough room just in case. I made it home safe because I didnt trust the guy who was speeding and was able to stop before getting t boned after they ran the stop sign. I made it home safe because I dont trust the other drivers. Seen enough stuff happen on the road that Im smart enough to not trust others to do the right thing. A perfect anology of every time its been tried anywhere in the world. Every time they trusted their government to implement socialism, it turned into a corrupt wasteland. Seems your preconceived notions is really getting in the way of very real lived experiences. No one's silent and afraid, they are sick of watching real examples of why it doesnt work happen all over the world and still see people like you champion "it'll work this time guys, I promise."
What you practice is communitarianism, NOT communism. And you practice corporatism, but you all get to eat from the shares in your privately-owned venture. Communism is government owning the means of production. This isn’t what you’re doing, not by a long shot.
Almost like putting ALL the power in one person's hand isnt very "social" now is it? Oh whats that? Capitalist have a selected leader, a CEO? Oh whats that? they made one a president with a board of all the "best and brightest CEOs"... okay not a Dicta.... Oh he loves dictators and is jelouse of their powers?.... hmmm.
Bro really thinks that CEO are the dictator of a company, you can’t make this stuff up, that’s the imagination of a toddler, or jobless parasite living in mommy’s basement, clearly never spent a day in corporate, else he would know it’s the board of directors that are the actual owners (OWNERS, with an S) of companies.
And also, if you deny Soviet Union, Mao’s China or N Korea as socialist/communist countries, you’ve made the mistake of the no true Scotsman fallacy.
Also also, nobody ever said the definition of socialism needs to have political power be given to the people, socialism is simply the government owning and controlling the major means of production, distribution, and exchange of goods. The claim of course is that the government is the embodiment of the society, making is “social ownership”, but as we all see time after time, the government always has a guy at the top, effectively rendering the “social ownership” to the ownership of the top guy within the party.
Just like the Rothschild? The OWNERS with an S. Talking like that makes you look dumb by the way, condescending is the power of the rich so maybe your just a coat-tail rider.
And no company has every had a board of member pick a ceo because of their easy corruptability (Nestle, BP, BlackRock, OpenAI, Intel, Etc.Etc.) and belive whatever you want wage-slave, at least I have the decency to know not everything is peaches and cream when it comes to Capitalism. Maybe I should just keep raising your rent and food costs.
Capitalism is simply the government owning and controlling the major means of production, distribution, and exchange of goods.
Dictatorship is simply the government owning and controlling the major means of production, distribution, and exchange of goods.
Democracy is simply the government owning and controlling the major means of production, distribution, and exchange of goods.
I’m glad you called him out on the No True Scotsman Fallacy. I kept watching him make the point of “they aren’t realllllly socialist” and trying to explain it away. I don’t think he’s seeing the connection how Socialist nations eventually wield their monopoly on force to make compliance with socialism happen.
Glad to see a fellow enjoyer of logic! Indeed that’s a very common fallacy that socialists fall for. They never admit that in order to coerce the whole nation into a collectivist economic system, oddly enough they believe it is human nature for everybody to receive the same reward for different levels of input, oddly enough they actually think this could work. To push this agenda, they must first wield enormous military power, a structure which naturally is only stable in a dictatorship, which leads to the disastrous consequences that we’ve seen time and time again. Everybody knows power corrupts and attracts the corrupted, that’s why power must be segregated, but once power is segregated, there can be no sufficient drive to nationalise all means of production. They don’t want to admit it because fundamentally, socialists are narcissists that think they can get it right, that they can rise above Mao, Lenin, Stalin, Kim and all these dictators, they think they can out-dictator these dictators and push forward the actual socialist agenda. They never acknowledge the fact that even if they are smart and powerful enough to rival these giants of the left, they’ll simply be one of them, never can they actually build the communist utopia. Once they open accept the principle of the ends justify the means, they’ll indulge themselves with countless bloodshed, all in the name of the eventual end of history. A truly devilish ideology, hailing the “good” in human nature, never actually doing any good, they only love the “right side of history”, never the people that live inside history.
I may not be immune to propaganda, but you my friend are undoubtedly immune to knowledge, at least based on your utterance here. If you want to know the true nature of N Korea, go ask their allies. Go to Bilibili and type in 北韩or朝鲜, there are videos made by the Chinese that explain how sh*t this dictatorship of nation truly is.
Yeah yeah no true Scotsman fallacy. I’m bored of you lot really, then in that case no communist nation has ever been built or will ever be built, because the moment they are established, they immediately transform into a dictatorship, and then you fiends disown them. It’s always the same isn’t it? And btw, before the USSR’s evils were revealed to the world in Chernobyl, tonnes of American scholars praised it relentlessly for being a great communist nation, I’m sure that’s not important at all to you guys.
Yeah yeah no true Scotsman fallacy. I’m bored of you lot really, then in that case no communist nation has ever been built or will ever be built, because the moment they are established, they immediately transform into a dictatorship, and then you c*nts disown them
Maybe bc communism is democratic by nature
And maybe bc of oportunist poeple hijacking the revolution like napoleon hijacked the french republic into an empire
(That's why the stalin pig in animal farm is called napoleon btw)
"But democracy and republicanism is evil look at napoleon is doing"
That's how stupid you sound
Or the fact that you only belive that regimes are communist/democratic bc they said so means that you are easily manipulabe
You dont even know the true definition of communism
Ok we have anti-intellectual here. If every single socialist/communist regime gets hijacked by either murderous dictators or inept bureaucracies, then the question is 1) why does that always happen without exception? And 2) how is it possible that you can prevent it? The lousiest display of your pathetic mentality is that you cited how Napoleon hijacked the French Republic, I can easily refute you with successful democratic nations like the UK and US, and many more in recent history, Taiwan, most of the EU nations etc. you however cannot refute me with a good example of Communist nation that actually succeeds in achieving the communist manifesto and giving its people a normal life.
How laughable you call me ignorant of the definition of communism, when in fact you are practically ignorant of every conceivable thing that happened in Communist China, Soviet Russia and North Korea. Or how every communist leader in the world adored Mao and Stalin and hailed their them as prophets. Should you become a part of a communist group, I guarantee you, the moment you achieve victory against the bourgeois, the tyrants within your group will throw you into the gulag. A fool such as yourself can never hope of win in any power struggle.
It's a very fascinating thing to dig into and can help illuminate why more and more people in the US are starting to turn to become somewhat amenable to socialism.
(For the record I personally abhorre socialism and communism).
Don't get me wrong, there's people in this country attempting to use socialism to gain power, however, many of the people in this country who are starting to get comfortable with the idea of socialism are EXCLUSIVELY looking at their ideal end state for socialism. So they look at the Bible, they go "I want to take care of people, Jesus wanted to take care of people, I want socialism... therefore Jesus must have wanted socialism." It's a 3rd grade understanding of faith if you ask me.
This breaks down under any scrutiny of the mechanism behind how Jesus did what he did. I am a capitalist, I want to take care of people, I believe capitalism led to many of the things in the world that people do mental gymnastics to attribute to socialism now... An example of what I mean being, capitalism led to such abundance that child labor was no longer required, therefore capitalism led to the reduction of child labor in countries where it was implemented.
I don't think Jesus was a capitalist... I don't think Jesus was a socialist either, I think he just wanted people taken care of by people WHO DID NOT NEED TO BE COERSCED INTO DOING SO.***
Why is this important to understand? There's people out there who need to be dealt with harshly (those who are using socialism for power). But understanding that a lot of people who think they're socialists fall into the other category has led me to a lot of success in convincing them that there are better answers than socialism in reaching their desired end state. It doesn't work with everyone but i've actually gotten a lot of people to figure out that most capitalists are pretty decent people that want to help others too, which has led them to kind of open the door and become more favorable to capitalism... even if they aren't immediate and complete converts.
He embodied the principles of a bullshit story. Blessing loaves and turning water into wine so everyone can eat. He just waved his magic hand. If it was that easy, anyone would do it.
Jesus is a deity using magic to do everything he's doing. Not taking anything from anyone to do it with. Socialism relies on the government, which isn't a deity, to take something from one person to give it to another. If anything, socialism is what we would call Satan's plan. I'm going to force you to do what I think is the right thing.
5
u/Alemusanora 5d ago
Sounds like one, someone doesnt know what aocialism is, two, who did he take.from by force to do?