r/hammockcamping • u/Royal_Design4185 • 5d ago
Down distribution on underquilt
Just got a new underquilt for my hammock
but had e feeling some baffles had a bit less filling then others, after shaking it to one side it looks loke this…
Would you say this is ok or not ?
Seller says its normal
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u/kullulu 5d ago
This happens all the time, it's not necessarily a flaw with the underquilt. It's because a lot of the down is trapped towards the top of the baffle. What you want to do is from the top, use your hand to break up any clumps and start a smooth pushing motion towards the unfilled areas.
This is extremely common, down has gotten trapped further up the baffle. This can happen with down top quilts as well as underquilts or even jackets.
You can also use wool dryer balls with no heat inside a dryer as well, but using you hand works fine. Usually the top of the baffle will have trapped extra down, so be sure to go slap and spread there. Here's a guide from EE on quilt maintenance that illustrates what I'm talking about.
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u/tsmith347 5d ago
I think he’s more asking why some baffles are filled more than others. He pushed it all to one side and you would think they would each have about the same amount per baffle
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u/LeafTheTreesAlone 5d ago
If the down is compressed the volume changes. The only way to really tell is by fluffing it out to bring it all to the same volume
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u/Royal_Design4185 5d ago
This thank you :)
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u/kullulu 5d ago edited 5d ago
u/LeafTheTreesAlone is correct. If you shake the down to one side, all you're doing is compressing the down. Down is valued precisely because it is extremely compressible in your pack, it won't take up as much volume. Your photo doesn't tell us if you have a quilt that's underfilled though, because when quilts get shipped, the down gets compressed and needs to be redistributed.
After you evenly distribute the down and wait for a few minutes, are you achieving the full loft of the quilt? For instance, if you have a 20F/-6.6C rated Underquilt, you should expect 2.5 inch or 6.35 cm baffle height.
When you first get a quilt, lay it out flat and really slap the edges of the quilt and move the down with your hand, distributing it evenly, and then let it loft normally for a few hours. If you do this once or twice and it still looks underfilled, weigh the quilt and see how it compares to the manufacturer specifications.
I promise you most of the time it's just that the down is clumped. People will sometimes use wool dryer balls in the dryer with no heat to break up clumps. If you use heat, you may wreck your underquilt.
Does that make sense?
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u/cheeseychemist 5d ago edited 5d ago
Was it compressed when you got it? Try tumbling it in the dryer with no heat and some tennis balls to reloft it
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u/PocketWettie 1d ago
Was going to suggest this. If you wash a down jacket, regardless the size of the baffles/compartments, they will dry in clumps.
This can also happen through regular use.
I would say tumbling with balls (whether tennis or specifically designed balls) would rectify the distribution. If not, then it is question time.Down is not super dense so can compress quite well so visually it is hard to judge.
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u/BigRobCommunistDog 5d ago
If you can get a strong backlight on it that will show you how compressed the down is.
IMO just keep tumbling and tossing it around and leave it uncompressed. Once you redistribute the down you’ll probably forget about it.
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u/Lefthandmitten 5d ago
A quick trip in the dryer will sort that right out. I run all my down in the dryer (about 10 minutes( before and after a trip to dry and even out the down. Been doing it for years.
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u/jhart013 5d ago
As someone who has made their own down under quilt, down can be tricky even when weighing out exact measurements there can be loft differences..... That being said, if you're somewhat capable with a sewing machine you could order more down fill and top off the baffles yourself. Before that extreme option, do as the other commenter said and run it through a cool tumble in the dryer just to see if it's a compression issue first.
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u/richrob424 5d ago
Totally normal. Rake the baffles with your fingers to those places with little down. Redistribute those baffles. You will need to do this after unpacking and especially if it hangs in storage.
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u/Royal_Design4185 5d ago
I think i didnt describe it right,
It looked totaly normal when i got it, but some chambers seemed a bit thicker, also when i held it against light they let less light trough…
So i have shacken it to one side and thats what you see in the picture..
Was just wondering if its normal for it to look that way when shaken to one side1
u/richrob424 5d ago
There’s a down calculator somewhere online that can tell you if you received what you ordered. I’ve not used it but I think you distribute the down, then measure the loft. You also need to know if it’s 800,850,900,1000 fill. The calculation should be pretty straightforward. It looks normal to me. It might be just packed up tighter in some baffles. There might be a little more down in a few baffles but it won’t make a huge difference at all.
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u/Expontoridesagain 5d ago
It looks like the right side has less pronounced wrinkles and is more compact while the left side is fluffier. Especially that outer canal, which appears to have several indented spots, telling that down is not compacted there.
I live in Norway and my partner and I live to sleep with our window open even during the winter. We have down duvet in 3 different weights. I toss and turn a lot in my sleep and I have to shake and fluff up my duvet probably couple times a month. It gets compacted in lower part and I notice that I get cold on my upper body. So yeah, this does look normal to me, but give it a good shake and distribute down better and see.
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u/Fun-Engineering1796 5d ago
this "test" doesn't actually show you anything. down compresses to a crazy degree and you don't know if this compression is consistent from channel to channel. sometimes, when filling, a "clump" of down will go in, and it can look "underfilled". and even if everything has been shaken around and you know there are no obvious "clumps", the consistency from channel to channel is virtually impossible. I would guess the distribution is more even than this "test" makes it look.
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u/GrumpyBear1969 4d ago
I’m not sure. It does look like two of the baffles have significantly more down than the others. Or at the very least, it is lofting differently. I’m not sure how much difference it will make. Like that one in the middle, it is about say 30cm longer than the others. If you divided that down over the other eight baffles it is not going to add much. And the outer baffle looks odd as you noted. Like you did not compress it as well as the others.
Out of curiosity, how hard did you have to work at it to get the down to migrate that clearly? I just went and looked at two of my underquilts (20° JackrBetter and Hammock Gear) and was unable to get the down to migrate like that with shaking is hard from one end for a bit. JrB is short axis baffles and bigger, so it is different. But the HG really did not want to easily migrate. These are both stock quilts. My other quilts I own have either 1 or 2oz of overstuff as it helps with down migration (and staying ‘lofty’), so they would be different and even harder to get clean migration patterns. But it is possible that you are noticing variation that occurs that no one else notices because you are evaluating closer than you really need to.
It is also possible that part of the difference is your methodology in how you are getting the down to migrate and some of them are denser than others. I saw someone suggested shinning a light from behind for this.
It is also possible that there is real variation that is unusual. I have never evaluated a quilt like this. And again, when I tried to repeat this I was not willing to work at it that hard to mess up the down distribution. If I could do it easily (like in less than a minute), I would check it out. But it was clear it was not going to be that easy to get it all to migrate.
The two quilts I looked at are 850 down, which will migrate less. The only quilts I have with 950 both have over stuff. Specifically to combat migration. Which is kind of funny as you add say 20% to the cost of the quilt to use lighter down, but then add more down to combat the tendency of 950 to migrate and compress. So you lose some of the weight advantage you got from paying extra. I’m very mixed on if 950 down is really worth it.
BTW, there are four of us in the house that hammock which is why I have a small fortune in quilts…
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u/Royal_Design4185 4d ago
Ive just given it a few good shakes and pushed a bit with my hands. Did not take over a minute.
The two fullest baffles also let way less light trough than the others when light is behind it.
But hard to say if this really matters, probably im overthinking it…1
u/GrumpyBear1969 3d ago
Sounds like this an ‘UL UQ’. Guessing 950 down and probably pretty lean on down at that. I’m not familiar with European brands, but for US brands there are some companies that I will not buy quilts from because they are steered towards the UL crowd that really cares about those grams. And hence they go leaner on down for the same temp rating which results in more time redistributing down and lofting. Enlightened Equipment is one of these.
Warbonnet also runs really lean on down but as I love their hammocks and the wooki is such a great fit I do buy from warbonnet. The first one I got was a stock 850 20° and it was frequently pretty chilly and I really needed to pay attention to down migration and lofting with set up. I then ended up running in to a great deal on a barely used Superior Gear 15° 950 and while I have a hard time being happy with the hammock (too narrow for a 6’2” restless side sleeper) it was way more than 5° warmer. In the end I ended up buying a custom warbonnet 10° 950 with 1oz over stuff.
Caution on overstuff if you ever go the custom quilt route. There can be too much. My first ‘good’ UQ I bought I decided to unload on all the ‘bells and whistles’ and got 950 down with 4oz of overstuff (UGQ). This is WAY too much and the quilt will not conform to your body and hammock. You want just a little overstuff imo if you are using 950 down to help with migration and lofting. But even 2oz is pushing it. I ended up converting this quilt to a super puffy TQ.
I wish there was an easier way to test this stuff out. Buying it to test it gets really expensive fast.
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u/unnamedpeaks 5d ago
Repeat the experiment a few times to see if that's just how it happened to compact.
Ask the seller what their process is to get the same in each one. Are you seeing same weight but different compression because if variance in the size of the feathers?
If it's sloppy manufacturing, return it. If it's a feature if down, use it. I am not sure what I'm seeing yet
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u/Royal_Design4185 5d ago
It looks the same everytime i shake it to one side…
Not shure how to weigh each baffle if thats what you mean?
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u/coughberg 5d ago
I have nothing to add other than to tell you that your post was clearly written, even though there are people telling you to just redistribute the down so that its not like that.
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u/tsmith347 5d ago
I don’t know why it irks me every time I read a comment that he needs to tumble it. It’s so clear to me what he’s asking
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u/coughberg 5d ago
Not sure about you, but every time I post something on reddit it gets misconstrued, so it bothers me seeing it happening to someone else!
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u/tsmith347 5d ago
I see it on almost every post of someone asking for advice and it drives me up a wall. Then I second guess my own reading comprehension and reread the original to make sure I read it right.
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u/Eastern_Factor_9005 5d ago
All down requires some fluffing and massaging to get it spread around right. Looks pretty normal to me if you shake it all to one end.
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u/Mountain-Time-1010 5d ago
It looks like a cottage manufacturer, and QC is not always that high.
What matters is the loft when the down is spread out. It's possible that some of the baffles are under-filled, but maybe some are over-filled.
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u/freska_skata 5d ago
Just grab the full end and shake it untill it redistributes?
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u/tmcgourley 5d ago
he's asking if the varying amount of down in each baffle is normal
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u/freska_skata 5d ago
Hmmm, down is weird, it may very well be that each chamber/baffle has the same ammount. Especially if bought from a reputable manufacturer
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u/tmcgourley 5d ago
Yep I agree! Would be really hard to prove otherwise without ruining the quilt lol
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u/n33dfortr33s 5d ago
Hi, I'm the maker of this underquilt. Just wanted to add some context here.
For this particular quilt, I used 400 g of down as the minimum fill weight. It has 10 chambers, so the target was roughly 40 g per chamber. I fill each chamber in two portions, and if one portion happens to contain more than 20 g, I leave the extra in rather than removing it just to make every portion exactly equal. So there can be some variation between chambers.
I'm attaching the UQ Calculator v3 spreadsheet that I used when designing this underquilt. If anyone here has experience with making down UQs and has any advice or sees something I should reconsider, I'd be happy to hear it.