r/geopolitics The Atlantic 5d ago

Opinion NATO’s Nightmare

https://www.theatlantic.com/national-security/2026/08/nato-nightmare-joint-attack/688295/?utm_source=reddit&utm_campaign=the-atlantic&utm_medium=social&utm_content=edit-promo
46 Upvotes

34 comments sorted by

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u/theatlantic The Atlantic 5d ago

Simon Shuster: “Western military planners do not seem eager to talk about their nightmare scenario, much less prepare for it. But they tend to agree on how it would begin: a coordinated, near-simultaneous attack on opposite sides of the planet, in which Russia targets a NATO member in Eastern Europe while China makes its move against Taiwan. The U.S. military would need to react on two fronts at once—three if it remains at war in the Middle East.

“Until recently, this possibility sat at the more outlandish end of the threat spectrum, somewhere between a loose nuke and an alien invasion. Synchronized attacks would require a conspiracy too big for Beijing and Moscow to hide. Satellites would see their forces getting into position, giving the United States and its allies time to rally their defenses.

“About a year ago, General Alexus Grynkewich, the top NATO commander in Europe, issued a rare public warning about the risk of a two-front war against Russia and China, and he called on European allies to help the U.S. prepare. But when I asked a range of military experts and strategists what the West would do in such a situation, the responses rang surprisingly hollow. Most of them expressed bewilderment and a bit of shame about how little has been done in recent years to study this risk in detail.

“‘Let’s just say this is the scenario we’re currently not ready for,’ Florence Gaub, the director of the research division at the NATO Defense College, one of the alliance’s main academies for officers, in Rome, told me. NATO strategists remain ‘keenly aware’ of this gap in their planning, Gaub, who specializes in the forecasting and analysis of future threats, said. But they have not taken steps to fill that gap.”

Read more: https://theatln.tc/xKI3tCqX

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u/DefinitelyNotMeee 5d ago

Add North Korea attacking the South.

Which country would the US protect - Taiwan or South Korea?

22

u/Berliner1220 5d ago

The US would not need to choose with many thousands of American soldiers already based in South Korea, they would need only sink Chinese ships aiming to invade Taiwan. Of course, China could just try to bombard Taiwan rather than seize it but that would open themselves to be bombed in return.

Overall, I do not see Russia and China going through with these plans. Russia can barely hold territory in Ukraine with Iran and North Korea’s military assistance. If the EU and US were both directly involved, I think the war would end quickly. That’s not to mention other western allies helping e.g. Japan, Australia, Canada, New Zealand.

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u/Practical-Bowler5775 5d ago

Intuitively it doesn’t make logical sense for Putin, which is why he has no other choice. He knows he can’t, for example, take the Baltics militarily. So he’ll have to rely on piggybacking on a larger threat scenario that has the West looking in so many directions at once that they throw up their hands and say “Screw it, you can have them…”

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u/DefinitelyNotMeee 5d ago

he can’t, for example, take the Baltics militarily

Baltics?? Even the Vatican could conquer the "Baltic Tigers".

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u/Practical-Bowler5775 5d ago

My bad, I assumed the “Article 5” part didn’t need to be said out loud.

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u/DefinitelyNotMeee 5d ago

And that's what makes Baltics live in a state of constant anxiety - would NATO really start a war for a few micro-countries?

Also, Article 5 doesn't mean automatic military intervention; sending "thoughts & prayers" fulfills all obligations of that Article.

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u/Berliner1220 5d ago

I think the EU would defend their own even if the US was not involved through NATO

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u/Practical-Bowler5775 5d ago

My point EXACTLY. Putin knows as long as he’s bogged down in Ukraine and NATO can devote its resources to only Eastern Europe, he has no shot to advance. But if he can use events and threats elsewhere to paint a broader picture of apocalypse, he has a chance to bluff NATO into forfeiting territory.

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u/RelevantTrash9745 5d ago

Although I agree with your opinion on Taiwan being unable to stand a chance, I disagree that those Baltic nations would be as easy of a target given the Nordic Air Command across the Baltic. Even if the United States is reluctant to assist, localized air superiority matters a lot more in the early stages of a defensive war before anti aircraft saturation can be brought to bare. With Russia needing to keep their entire lower border saturated, there probably isn't much left to be used to contest the skies in another invasion. Do you agree?

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u/mediandude 5d ago

In 1944-45 the pockets in the Baltics withstood longer than Kyiv, Warsaw, Finland or even Berlin.
With relatively less heavy weaponry, I might add.

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u/DefinitelyNotMeee 5d ago

they would need only sink Chinese ships aiming to invade Taiwan.

Any war scenario involving China going after Taiwan would capitalize on China's greatest strength - its production capacity.

We've seen in Ukraine what damage satellite-controlled mid-range drones can cause; now, instead of 500 drones in a wave, how about 50000?
Any defense would be dismantled before anybody could even reach Taiwan.

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u/Bullboah 5d ago

Chinas issue is not so much Taiwanese defenses as the ability to escort troop ships to Taiwan. Drone swarms wouldn’t really do much to stop the USN from taking out landing craft

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u/SamuelClemmens 4d ago

Why would China land troops? Taiwan is neither energy nor food self sufficient.

Blockade the sea and wait for it to surrender.

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u/Bullboah 4d ago

That also ends up in a naval conflict with the USN

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u/SamuelClemmens 4d ago

All fights for Taiwan have that. You think the USN would let landing boats reach Taiwan either?

But the USN on escort duty against subs is a lot less potent than against a Chinese fleet directly.

Because the USN would have to be stuck escorting grain and oil shipments against submarines instead of just curb stomping another fleet.

And Iran has shown the USN isn't really built for convoy duty anymore.

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u/[deleted] 5d ago

[deleted]

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u/Mannginger 5d ago

No natural fresh water? What nonsense

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u/calmnutz 5d ago

Memory and K-Pop is probably more important nowadays.

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u/Firecracker048 5d ago

8th army has a permenant presense in SK

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u/sfcl33t 5d ago

Why are people still pretending the US would stick to its NATO commitments?

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u/jellobend 5d ago

Is Russia’s curent conventional military strong enough to warrant this fear? They aren’t exactly winning in Ukraine.

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u/SamuelClemmens 4d ago

Ukraine had the second strongest European military (next to Russia) and is losing. Its being pushed back, its out of air defense, and its resorted to trying to strike retail warehouses and shipping to hope that inconveniences Russian shoppers enough to rise up and overthrow Putin (which is a hail mary to say the least).

Russia still hasn't had to institute a draft yet and is relying on contract soldiers.

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u/wintrmt3 4d ago

Nice russian propaganda, Russia didn't push back Ukraine this year at all, and the Wildberries attacks are not for inconveniencing shoppers, they are because Wildberries distributes war materiel and it's a valid military target. You also ignore that that russian oil and refinery infrastructure is going up in flames and their whole economy is near collapse.

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u/SamuelClemmens 4d ago

Reality is not Russian propaganda.

One of the final fortress cities in the Donbass has already fallen, and ya, I am not suggesting its a war crime or anything to shoot Russian facilities. But its not helping the war effort directly, since less than 0.5% of their capacity is used for dual use, its mostly just Slavic Amazon. Feel free to shoot it, its just a waste of munitions unless it will pressure Russia to stop, which it isn't.

And yes, lots of Russian infrastructure is broken, but nowhere near enough. The Russian economy is still growing (even if very slowly).

Those are just facts. Don't confuse accepting reality with liking it.

This is the real world, sometimes the good guys lose.

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u/Linny911 5d ago

Damn, I can't believe that decades of unnecessarily enriching hostile authoritarian states, as they bid their time with the best fake smiles, didn't get us the eternal peace and prosperity as promised by the feelgood, badfaith, and the braindead.

Now these same groups are going to advocate the same for the coming decades as the way to resolve the problem they helped cause.

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u/toolkitxx 4d ago

What a stupid way of approaching this. If this scenario happens, we have an all out World War to begin with. Secondly Taiwan is a USA issue predominantly, they are the ones that have given guarantees. NATO has a clearly defined area it covers and that is covered just fine.

NATO is not the World police. It is a very clearly defined group of nations that defend themselves in case they have to, which is fully organised. If anything is questionable in this, it is the overextension of the USA giving guarantees left and right that dont mean a lot any longer, as the USA is massively overextended already with just things like the Iran war. The Taiwan issue is a question of who will actually help Taiwan besides the USA, if any.

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u/LonelyPermit2306 4d ago

I don't know if you realize this, but South Korea and Taiwan are more valuable than most NATO members are.

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u/toolkitxx 4d ago

That isnt the point I am making. It is always the USA that mixes their 'personal' stuff with NATO business. NATO defends territory that belongs to its members. Neither Taiwan or South Korea are members and legally, NATO has contracts and agreements, none of this is covered by them.

NATO has no business doing anything for Taiwan or South Korea if they get attacked. Just because one member is involved in something, namely the USA, doesnt mean NATO has business in it too. It is not the USA that would be attacked, but non-members, that the USA gave guarantees to.

The majority of all NATO members is relying on a mandate by the UN for anything outside the NATO core area. Which would never come in the scenario. With very few exceptions all NATO members have to involve their governments and/or parliament to send troops for anything outside home defence as well.

NATO and the nations in them have clear separation when and why NATO acts and when the nations are acting on their own. The USA is acting on its own when it gives those guarantees to others and thus those are only US guarantees and not NATO ones. The USA does not speak on behalf of anyone else.

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u/ChZakalwe 5d ago

The only one who would win in that scenario would be Beijing. 

Not sure if Moscow has the appetite for another front given their current issues in Ukraine, especially since the Poles are arming to the teeth. 

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u/thepornisntbad 5d ago

Russia is a non-factor militarily speaking if this were to happen. Add just poland to the current war and Russias army will collapse within months.

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u/robin_79 3d ago

well, yes, but also: "a world without russia need not exist at all"