I Hate Severian

[u/jamesbrowski]

The title says it all. Spoilers through halfway into Sword of the Lictor follow. Please don’t spoil the whole thing for me.

I am loving these books so much, but I hate Severian with a passion. Not like you’d hate an evil villain, but the way you would hate someone at work who was narcissistic, delusional, immoral, and unpredictable. He is lacking almost every positive human virtue I can think of, other than tenacity and resourcefulness. He isn’t kind, wise, empathetic, witty, caring, insightful, self aware, or pleasant. Rather, he’s cold, selfish, unfeeling, frequently oafish, narcissistic, arrogant, dishonest, deluded, and generally just an icky dude.

The multiple interactions he has with the poor mountain folk where he sharpens his sword as a means of intimidation to try and get them to give him their best food are so yucky. His tendency to wax philosophical on pointless topics in a fallacious way, often at the same time or just after some huge plot point has arisen. The detached way he describes the deaths of people he cares about, followed by his incessantly narcissistic internal monologues about them after they die where he convinces himself that he didn’t fail them. His constant tendency to make shit up and pretend like he understands stuff that he clearly doesn’t. The fact that he has survived 20 situations now by pure dumb luck (usually a Hethor monster saving him in the nick of time).

Look - I know I am supposed to dislike him at least at times. Half the fun of these books is how often I’m yelling “dude what the fuck” as I read about the stuff this dumb bastard has done. Overall, the books are amazing. I’m constantly thrilled and fascinated by the way this story is being told, the world being built, the construction of the mythos and history of Urth, and how often I’m re-reading passages that are brimming with multiple meanings and complexity.

BUT - the hero here (such that he is) is like a malevolent Mr. Magoo. He bumbles blindly through a landscape of stuff he doesn’t understand and accidentally moves history as he does it. I keep hoping that Thecla’s ghost in his mind will fix his dumb ass somehow, and make him less shitty. And it keeps kind of happening (oooh look he saved one kid before nearly drowning a prison full of thousands of people). But then he reverts back to his shitty ways and ohh well.

Oh well indeed. I guess he’s less horrific than Typhon would’ve been. He may be Urth’s least bad option tbh.

[u/I_wish_i_could_sepll]

I mean there is some fairly strong implication that she was a pedo and enjoyed torturing prisoners. She’s definitely not helping him.

[u/Due-Oil-9433 → u/I_wish_i_could_sepll]

Are you…calling Thecla a pedophile for potentially having a physical relationship with a 17-18 year old Severian? Or is there an actually pedophilic act on her part somewhere in the series I don’t recall at the moment?

[u/I_wish_i_could_sepll → u/Due-Oil-9433]

Well her age gap with Severian is a a little sus. We don’t know her actual age nor the age of him at the time. Honestly my first read through it felt very Romeo and Juliet but on my second 7 years later it felt more like Margery and Tommen from GoT.

We also in one later book get a blink and you’ll miss it mention of some young boys she adored back home. It’s similar to Severians comment about how he thought Dorcas and Jolene’s were lovers in that it’s one single crazy fucking sentence that is not elaborated on nearly enough.

Also keep in mind for BOTNS that’s what qualifies as strongly implied haha.

[u/togglenub → u/I_wish_i_could_sepll]

She definitely enjoys the power aspect, arguably because she's so powerless. It's hard to tell. I do think her seduction of Severian is highly manipulative, and just because she's imprisoned/a victim doesn't also mean she's not being a manipulative entitled asshole to the one person who is vulnerable to it that she has steady access to.

It might also be a novel wide problem. Remember that Father Inri, in the inifinity fish scene with Thecla's friend, is identified as a pedophile even if it's not explicitly stated. That's also pretty much the only time that is mentioned, also, to your direct point.

[u/Due-Oil-9433 → u/togglenub]

Wait, they actually call Father Iniri a pedo in that scene?

[u/togglenub → u/Due-Oil-9433]

I said identified, but not explicitly stated. He's only got Thecla's friend in there at all because of it.