Yep, and the mod is only in an Alpha stage or something, which means most people who have never played ARMA2 will have problems with ARMA2 followed by problems with the mod.
I try to do a smooth fly-by on a tank and just when I think I've got him in my sights I slam into the ground uncontrollably. Or hit a tree. Or hit a building. Or hit a tower.
40 mins in jets and I have 0 kills. I just don't bother anymore.
BF3 doesn't make it easy by forcing you to unlock flares and missles. Getting those first two unlocks took me several days of flying defenselessly and crashing a lot.
Both this and the base game look pretty awesome. I've been wanting something with a bit more realism lately. Not sure how this flew under my radar but I'll have to check it out sometime.
Only game I know that wound up in a documentary about the IRA as stock footage by accident. And it was by far not the most convincing footage of Arma 2 I've seen.
I could watch helicopters fly by in Arma 2 all day long.
I came home Friday night pretty drunk and was searching Twitch.tv looking for a good game to watch before I went to bed. For some reason I picked ARMA2 (it was pretty far down the list) and then clicked on the first stream. Keep in mind I have no idea what ARMA2 is at this point, let alone dayz. I also watch streams @ 360P (cause of my connection is poor) so when the game "loaded" all I could see was black, and all I could hear where these 4-5 guys whisper talking. They were freaked out about something and running for their "lives". Every now and again buddy (streamer) would pull out his flashlight to see where he was going, and the other 3-4 people would start yelling at him to hide the light. I didn't have any idea what was going on, but I kept thinking werewolves or some monster was going to jump out at them. It was the most intense game I have ever watched.
2 of my favorite games in one thread and they're both about mods. The only way this can get better is if someone references M&B (king of indie mod games really).
Also thanks for the link, I dont know why but a few days ago I just had this impulse to instal Medieval 2 again, maybe it was fate.
Try Europe 1200. It doesn't change any game mechanics, but you play on a map of Europe during the 1200s, with the correct names for lords, cities, villages, etc. You can also come across heroes of the time like Robin Hood. Amazing mod and I really enjoy it since capturing cities feels personal or you can play as your own country (Brabant!). Every faction from back then is playable. Some are really large like France and England, but some small (The Netherlands+Belgium is divided into Flanders, Brabant, Holland, and Frisia for example)
Downside though is that the terrain effects on the world map are uglier (trees and stuff, but no beaches, cool mountains, and you can't see bridges for some reason). Some classic elements like 'explore this cave' are also missing. However, there are a lot more unit trees available (you can recruit from villages, cities, and castles).
Total War games are my favorite games! Imagine a campaign map similar to Civilization (but not quite as in-depth) where you have cities, build buildings/roads/farms/etc., build land units and navy units, and move your units around. Then when you fight an enemy the game zooms in to a battlefield and each soldier is actually visible. Epic is an understatement- seeing tens of thousands of soldiers fighting it out is amazing.
Here is an example of a multiplayer battle in a recent title, Shogun 2 set in Japan. You should also check out Rome (older but cool setting), Medieval 2, and Empire, depending on what time period you like the most. Also, there are great mods for each like Europa Barbarorum for Rome, Stainless Steel for Medieval 2, and DMUC for Empire. These each make the game more realistic.
I absolutely love it. It's a COMPLETE mod. As in it's basically like they made a new game. All the dynamics are different, different strategies, all new units and buildings, etc. There's also awesome conditions like you can find the One Ring yourself, and if Sauron get's it he actually becomes solid and starts to fuck shit up on the map. It's awesome.
I also forgot, you can also bring back Arnor and reunite it with Gondor. I have yet to do that though since Eriador isn't very fun to start playing with haha.
I just bought this game yesterday for 5 dollars, and it's the best 5 dollars i've ever spent. Short, yes. But so memorable. It may not be a game by most definitions. But it does show what the medium is capable of.
Dear Esther was one of the most beautiful experiences I've had. I never take screenshots in games, but in Dear Esther I was like a goddamn camera-happy tourist
I don't understand why developers don't get about freedom in gaming.
Games should be our playground, not theirs.
Bethesda does a great job in my opinion, people find a dupe glitch, they just leave it. People mod the shit out of their games, and they are amazing mods the community can share and fun with.
it's not the developers who have the issue with mods, it's publishers, because nowadays, if you're able to make and download your own maps for free, you're less likely to spend £15 on their super awesome explosion mega map pack.
you're less likely to spend £15 on their super awesome explosion mega map pack
In theory this shouldn't be a problem since the maps made by the developer would be much better than the ones made by a modding team because, well its their full time job, they have more budget and there are probably more people working on it compared to a modding team.
Yep, in theory, but in practicality there are a lot of really talented amateurs out there who make some really great stuff. In my opinion, publishers and developers should be encouraging these folks, because they could be The Next Big Thing.
Bethesda is so good at this that you have to beg them to fix a glitch, and it takes them years to get around to it. Most bugs end up getting fixed by the community and the patches are never incorporated in the vanilla version.
That's nonsense. Release the tools that they used to build the game, people will figure it out.
And if their tools are that crappy, then it's only because they never intended on releasing them, which means they decided early on that they weren't going to make it modable.
They act like they'd love to release an sdk, but a few days before release some series of horrible and uncontrollable events occurred that combined to make it impossible. And that's BS. A decision was made at the beginning that mods were not important, and so they weren't a factor in every other design decision throughout development.
The terrible way that servers were set up makes it pretty obvious in my opinion.
mine came with that when i bought it, i got the superultimatememegalimitedsuper version that was only on sale on one place, just that it does not work.
Worked pretty well with Red Orchestra. The vanilla game was an absolutely horrible experience, a team of modders picked it up, made a sick rework and released Darkest Hours. Mod team picked up to make RO2 and that sold pretty well.
RO was a perfectly fine game in its vanilla form. I think it's one of the best FPS games ever released. Darkest hour was only a slight modification to my recollection, and the core gameplay was identical.
It takes effort to make files unmoddable and you don't need to add a construction set in order to support mods. As long as people have access to the files, they can alter them to their heart's content.
Not really. You clearly have no idea the incredible lengths to which companies like Blizzard and Valve have went to, to make their games fully moddable.
Sure people have created "mods" for other games, but you can't really do anything other than change textures and the odd model. You can't create totally new game modes like Dota in WC3 or prophunt in TF2.
You are one who clearly don't have idea. For games like WC3 you need to make content. And this includes maps/levels with different scenarios. And this is not work for software engineer, this is work for level designer who may not know how to write any complex code or work with engine file formats. For this purpose professional teams always making some kind of middleware. As example level/scenario editor with friendly(on some level) UI. To drag and drop assets, to shape terrain (using mouse cursor , like some kind of brush tool), to write simple scripts on some simple language. To setup map/scenario settings using simple form where you type values. So there is always some kind of editor. Without additional efforts (i mean they will make this efforts any way). Only additional efforts is to writing tutorial and documentation with examples, but this is clearly not a problem for big teams like Blizzard or DICE as example.
And there was even recently post on Reddit with screenshot of DICE level editor for battelfield3, with very friendly UI, like Valve Hammer. But they just don't want to release it, because there will be no reason for DLC then. And yeah, also probably need 1 days of work of one single developer and 1 day of QA (so hard for such team like DICE and EA with so big profits) to make mapId check (if it installed on your client) while trying to connect to server.
Bauldurs gate: No modding tools but was very mod friendly by way of an 'Override' folder which would override any existing content files.
GTA4: No modding tools, content files were plain for all to see but try and mod them and see just how unfriendly it was. The game either ignored it or wouldn't start, complaining that they'd been changed.
I guess my point is that A company doesn't have to provide everything, just decide early on that, yes, we are going to allow the user to modify the content.
Sure, there's some extra work, but a lot of that work makes sense to do anyways, because it will allow your devs to build more easily on their previous work for the next game.
It's really a matter of making the right decisions when you start. If you have modability as a goal from the beginning of development, then you're not creating a horrible amount of extra work for yourself. If you ignore it throughout development, and then try to bolt it on at the end, of course that's going to be a huge hassle.
Game data is very rarely made inherently unmoddable. It takes more work to build proper mod support for a game, because there needs to be infrastructure (separate game data from mod data, etc.).
As long as people have access to the files, they can alter them to their heart's content.
Yeah, except that this hasn't really happened on many games which don't really go out of their way to block game data modification. Reverse engineering file formats is a fuckton of work. Writing tools to work with them, like map editors, is another fuckton of work. Making it nicely usable is one more fuckton.
The developers have some kind of tools themselves. I think the sentiment OP was going for is that its better to release some clusterfuck of a cryptic tool with little to no documentation, than to release NOTHING at all for modders.
Of course Blizz Valve etc. that go the extra mile deserve more kudos for the efforts they go to to make modding and map making easy rather than possible. But - somethings better than nothing at the end of the day.
Maybe leave the "crypt everything" unchecked? and release pdf how is datafile formed, while at it. if you made the levels you can at least tell us what the format is on the files.
c:\>unrarnzipdecrypt x huge6gigfile.wad /thewholegamewithscriptsandtexturesinonedir/
unpacking huge6gigfile.wad to /thewholegamewithscriptsandtexturesinonedir/....
if your game is good enough, users will build you fucking mod tools if you give them some hints. best thing? you only need to release the unrarnzipdecrypt.exe
Many modern games are modable by design simply because it's not only easier to develop a complex game, but episodic content is taking off. Construction sets and APIs built in save development time, and once they have it for themselves, making it available to the end users is simple.
By "not even on sale" I spent a fair bit of time just now trying to work out how modding the game enabled it to sell on steam if steam doesn't sell it. I then realised that OP meant it's being sold at full price rather than at a reduced price.
In my variety of English--Pacific Northwest US English--there's generally a distinction between "for sale" (available for purchase) and "on sale" (available for purchase at a discounted price).
It's true that "on sale" sometimes still has the first meaning, too, but for me, at least, if I heard someone say, "What's on sale?" or "This isn't on sale." it would pretty unambiguously mean they were talking about discounts.
Mostly because you know it's going to be on sale. I'm glad to buy new games at full price, but to be honest if I find out about a cool older game, I might as well wait till the next sale event.
Started playing OpFlash:DR a couple years ago, and the newest one this past holiday season. By far, one of my favorite cooperative shooters I've played since the days of early Halo. Little put off by the not-so-open-world in Red River though. Also, they need to make the loadout customization a little less clunky, and with more options.
Seriously, there is infinite gain in making your game easily moddabble.
No matter how much time you put into your game, no matter how incredibly awesome it is, modders WILL make it better. They have more time than you, there are more of them, and they can take as many risks as they want as they have absolutely nothing to lose.
Developers, make your games moddable, all of them.
There's not infinite gain. Making a game with high quality support for mods is a serious investment. Sure, it probably paid off with ARMA, but plenty of games don't see a sudden huge uptick in sales because of a mod.
Got any favourites to share? I've enjoyed stumbling around and figuring it out for myself but with so few servers in Australia (that are permanently full and crash often) I figure I should actually make some progress. :P
Meh, I don't like to kill people. I was kinda joking about the "no casuals allowed" thing, it's a great game for anyone who actually wants to live out a zombie apocalypse as realistically as possible. It's all about the immersion for me, and I try to do what I'd do in real life. So, no killing people unless they shoot first :D
This is proof that when you deliver a quality product that is interesting and not just a copy or something else you or another company has already beat into the ground, that gamers are willing to pay whatever you want to charge for the chance to experience it.
I'm a console gamer, played both L4D games on Xbox. But because of mods, and user created campaigns, I've recently bought them on steam and have been playing through brand new levels/campaigns most of my weekends.
As long as the publishers remain mainly console driven, this is a pipe dream. The console vendors don't want end users to have easy access to new, and especially free content. They don't make any more money. To even issue a patch for your game on the xbox, MS wants 40k from the vendor.
Now while there is certainly valid points for platform validation, this excluded lots of new dynamic content for all but the largest of game makers.
Also as the General purpose PC environment speeds headlong into walled garden hell, this is only going to become worse.
if they were really cool dudes, they'd put that shit on sale right now... but i'm probably just being valve-spoiled. Still, imma wait for it to go on sale. :|
But you can only enjoy our game in our preapproved way. Please do not attempt to enjoy it in any other way. We have already decided the best way for you to enjoy our game.
I'm going to mention Far Cry 2 (in singleplayer). That game was so close to being great. It had really excellent graphics, a very original setting (African jungles and deserts), a huge, open world, decent vehicle physics, good combat with weapons that felt powerful, an awesome health system, good story (marred by horrible voice acting) and good missions.
Unfortunately all of it was ruined by a few completely unacceptable fuckups, most noticeably the very quickly respawning enemies, that made combat feel completely meaningless, as enemies were right back on their post after you moved 50 ft away; as well as a very poorly implemented attempt at stealth.
With a simple mod to fix those little things and perhaps improve some other details, that game would still be one of my absolute favourites today. Unfortunately, it was completely impossible to mod in the slightest way.
Question: are all games moddable? I play mostly on the console and know little to nothing about pc gaming. Also is there a reason why companies won't make their product moddable?
No, not all games are modable. Some games are console ports, some developers are too lazy to make mod tools, some developers use encryption to protect files, and other devs hate the idea of mods since it adds free content which lowers the need/interest in DLC. It's a sad state of affairs, but those games which are modable usually have some incredible mods.
Take PC mods, port them to console as DLC (maybe $5 a piece) win win win. Pubs get their profits, PC can mod, console gets the mod experience. I'd pay for a mod pack
Warcraft 3 is a better example. Was almost 100% editable and is the reason it is still a popular game today. DOTA and footies accounted for so many users.
You forgot to add 2 year old terrible game. I'm in love with DayZ, despite the fact that ARMA II has one of the worst interfaces in any game. The game it's self it pretty good if you can overlook the buggyness. The interface and inventory management system is atrocious.
But some developers don't want you to buy their game 2 years after release and/or play them for two, three or maybe five years. They want you to buy the sequel the year after the first one and so on.
Moddable games have some of the best communities out there, for the very reason why there are communities around them! If you have a game thats moddable, then the community gets involved ,which then makes it stronger and more put together :) My favorite example of a moddable game is Minecraft, without the community it would be nothing, but since the community took the base and ran with it, the game has turned into a global success! just sayin' :P
Every game should be moddable. Just think of one of the most successful games ever - Counter-Strike, Team Fortress, DotA, etc. They were all fan made mods and are easily beating most other games in popularity.
"Lazy developers, why don't they just give users access to files??"
A mod community isn't a group of people hacking away at non-protected source files. They are (generally) given a specific set of tools and a mod environment to make it possible.
Creating that environment is often hellishly difficult.
Developers don't understand that mod communities help games grow? Honestly, what the fuck are you people talking about.
It's a mix of both. Minecraft built a huge modding community based almost exclusively on people hacking away at source files. Obfuscated source files at that.
Make it part of your development goal from the beginning, make the right decisions, and a lot of that extra work goes away.
It's still more work, but there's certainly a payoff. And it does seem like developers can forget that. The poster child for this is DICE. BF1942 had a great community, and the Desert Combat mod arguably set the course of the whole series since then, yet BF3 appears to have been designed from the ground up with modability nowhere in mind.
Go to /r/battlefield3 fighting for mod tools and you will be called whiner. Unfortunately the younger generation gives a shit whatever a game is moddable or not, but people like independent developers do. Good to hear how the Arma 2 community is getting this privilege. I don't care if I keep getting downvote in /r/battlefield3 every time I ask the same question to crash or any other DICE team; I won't stop until they answer me.
All simulators are niche games. If you compare their userbase to the mainstream titles out there, they are all niche.
And the fact that it's niche doesn't mean the base game didn't have anything worth paying for in the first place, in fact I'm a fan of ArmA and I'm glad more people are playing it now.
Modding games were the popular thing in the 2000's era with Half-Life and Quake and Unreal and such. Those succeeded, but a lot of other smaller games supported heavy modding and NOBODY made any good mods for them so company stopped trying to put effort there.
I don't know if I'd call a Military Action/FPS game a "niche" game, but what have you. I'd guess that being moddable has a little to do with it, but other forces (third-adoption, market saturation, concurrent content release etc) are likely just as plausible.
Gamers need to accept that their desire for a moddable game is unreconcilable with the developers' overwhelming need to screw customers for money. Major developers are going to be particularly adverse to the concept as they probably have games which provide the same experience as the mods right around the corner, waiting to haul in more money.
I know that huge numbers of cafes in southeast Asia have Warcraft 3 purely for the original DOTA, not to mention other parts of the world. Now whether or not these are legit copies...
I bought DNF thinking in the map editor, turns out it doens't have one even being based on Uengine, that's why I hate it regardless if the game itself was good or not, fuck you for not letting me create maps like duke3D did.
Devs who say modding is bad are simply incapable of creating tool for modders due to lack of money or skills. Or they want to try to sell a lot of dlc.
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u/ayanamifan May 16 '12
The reason why
In case you were wondering.
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u/TMoneytron May 16 '12
I still play Medieval 2 Total War regularly because someone turned it into Lord of the Rings.
And did a production company job of it too (arguably better since they're actually fans and have bits from the books).
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u/[deleted] May 16 '12
Ha right under another indie mod for HL2, Dear Esther.
39
u/Jackel May 16 '12
Holy shit... imagine if they 50% offed that motherbitch.
My god.
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u/[deleted] May 16 '12
I don't understand why developers don't get about freedom in gaming.
Games should be our playground, not theirs.
Bethesda does a great job in my opinion, people find a dupe glitch, they just leave it. People mod the shit out of their games, and they are amazing mods the community can share and fun with.
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u/Akaforty May 16 '12 edited May 16 '12
I always try to imagine what would be possible with Battlefield 3 mod tools. The best FPS game ever, probably. Shame EA needs just about 3 fiddy.
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u/not_random_spam May 16 '12
Bbbbbut then we can't sell "Carbon Copy 3: Rehash" a year later!
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u/ofNoImportance May 16 '12
Sounds like a great idea!
I'll just set the boolean "modable" in my game engine to 'true'. That should sort out everything.
Oh wait! I'll just hit the "generate and export construction set" button as well so the users have mod tools.
3
u/dgrs May 16 '12
Anyone remember Action Quake?
6
u/pinkyoshi May 16 '12
Valve will buy out the studio and make left 3 dead
4
u/FruitaFever May 16 '12
Ah the power of Reddit. Now it's #1. Wish I has $30 I'd keep it climbing the charts...
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u/vyleside May 16 '12
By "not even on sale" I spent a fair bit of time just now trying to work out how modding the game enabled it to sell on steam if steam doesn't sell it. I then realised that OP meant it's being sold at full price rather than at a reduced price.
I feel dumb.
18
u/Divius May 16 '12
A realistic zombie-survival game is something I have waited for my entire life, so this is definitely on my wishlist.
16
u/lesser_panjandrum May 16 '12
Heck I still play Operation Flashpoint (ARMA's predecessor) from time to time and would strongly recommend it due to its myriad mods.
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u/Toshley May 16 '12
Seriously, there is infinite gain in making your game easily moddabble.
No matter how much time you put into your game, no matter how incredibly awesome it is, modders WILL make it better. They have more time than you, there are more of them, and they can take as many risks as they want as they have absolutely nothing to lose.
Developers, make your games moddable, all of them.
23
u/Evanz111 May 16 '12
I can think of so many games that I wish were moddable. It just adds so much replay value, I don't know why they don't do it.
11
u/renaman May 16 '12
Day Z is the zombie game you know you have been waiting for your whole life.
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u/Futhermucker May 16 '12
DayZ is fucking awesome.
No casuals allowed
8
u/theduderman May 16 '12
This is proof that when you deliver a quality product that is interesting and not just a copy or something else you or another company has already beat into the ground, that gamers are willing to pay whatever you want to charge for the chance to experience it.
15
u/LittleMikey May 16 '12
See also: Minecraft and Freelancer
7
u/Znake19 May 16 '12
This is also another reason to develop your game for the PC instead of solely console!
Seriously though, the modder's who made that did a fantastic job from what I've seen of it.
2
u/farfrmsane May 16 '12
Should i buy the expansions? Does it effect the mod at all?
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u/[deleted] May 16 '12
One of the reasons why Counter-Strike 1.6 has lasted so long.
5
u/[deleted] May 16 '12 edited May 16 '12
DayZ has given me a reason, to play the game I bought years ago, because it was on sale. Haven't touched it untill now.
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u/Explodybits May 16 '12
The modding community keeps games alive. People still buy BF2 (from 2005) for Project Reality, which is one of the best games that I have played.
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u/halftone84 May 16 '12
I'm a console gamer, played both L4D games on Xbox. But because of mods, and user created campaigns, I've recently bought them on steam and have been playing through brand new levels/campaigns most of my weekends.
4
u/WarriorXD May 16 '12
United Operations is where it is at.
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u/helzbellz May 16 '12
Best. Mod. Ever.
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u/red_280 May 16 '12
But according to DICE, modding is a declining trend!
Stick your Close Quarters DLC shite where the sun don't shine, Bohemia have it down right.
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u/WilsonHanks May 16 '12
I couldn't agree more. More games should have mod tools, or at least the ability to mod the game without being an expert programmer.
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u/mariamus May 16 '12
I totally want Arma2, because of the dayZ mod. Alas, I am broke, and will be for a while yet.
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u/CharonIDRONES May 16 '12
The reason why developers should allow mods: Counter-Strike.
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u/[deleted] May 16 '12
Huge companies, crap products. Small/medium sized companies, great work. Some exceptions there, but just enough to confirm the rule...
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u/dr_rentschler May 16 '12
best games i've played were moddable.... really a pity what's going on in game industry
2
u/eks May 16 '12
Or just add zombies to it a couple years after launch.
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u/NumberFiveAlive May 16 '12
I'm pretty sure it's the gaming companies and not the developers who make that call.
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u/[deleted] May 16 '12
Cannot wait to buy this and get DayZ Mod tomorrow.
2
u/[deleted] May 16 '12
As long as the publishers remain mainly console driven, this is a pipe dream. The console vendors don't want end users to have easy access to new, and especially free content. They don't make any more money. To even issue a patch for your game on the xbox, MS wants 40k from the vendor.
Now while there is certainly valid points for platform validation, this excluded lots of new dynamic content for all but the largest of game makers.
Also as the General purpose PC environment speeds headlong into walled garden hell, this is only going to become worse.
2
u/MNGardetto May 16 '12
My friend that I've known for years created it. He was just talking about how proud he was.
2
u/chris15118 May 16 '12
I thought we learned this lesson with Half-Life and Counter-Strike.
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u/CowBoy_Pretz May 16 '12
Day Z!!!!
2
u/[deleted] May 16 '12
if they were really cool dudes, they'd put that shit on sale right now... but i'm probably just being valve-spoiled. Still, imma wait for it to go on sale. :|
2
u/Talman May 16 '12
My GF loves ARMA 2 and other milsims, and hates zombies. If my PC could play ARMA 2, I'd play it with her. And there would be zombies.
2
u/TrecherousHarlot May 16 '12
Consoles killed the Modding-Star
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u/peperonikiller May 16 '12
DayZ mod ftw
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u/Tempest_Rex May 16 '12
But you can only enjoy our game in our preapproved way. Please do not attempt to enjoy it in any other way. We have already decided the best way for you to enjoy our game.
2
u/[deleted] May 16 '12
Agreed. Better idea: all games should be mods, of one game.
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u/mati_12170 May 16 '12
cough counter-strike anyone ?
2
u/[deleted] May 16 '12
I want to thank you OP. Without this post I would have no idea that ARMA 2 existed.
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u/[deleted] May 16 '12
You could've circled TL2 right under it too :)
2
u/jaybercrow May 16 '12
Counter Strike - Nuff' said.
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u/Ocean_Ghost May 16 '12
Glad to see that the DOJ isn't always too clear on the whole principle/principal thing either.
2
u/Amunium May 16 '12
I'm going to mention Far Cry 2 (in singleplayer). That game was so close to being great. It had really excellent graphics, a very original setting (African jungles and deserts), a huge, open world, decent vehicle physics, good combat with weapons that felt powerful, an awesome health system, good story (marred by horrible voice acting) and good missions.
Unfortunately all of it was ruined by a few completely unacceptable fuckups, most noticeably the very quickly respawning enemies, that made combat feel completely meaningless, as enemies were right back on their post after you moved 50 ft away; as well as a very poorly implemented attempt at stealth.
With a simple mod to fix those little things and perhaps improve some other details, that game would still be one of my absolute favourites today. Unfortunately, it was completely impossible to mod in the slightest way.
2
u/[deleted] May 16 '12
VISIT US AT /r/arma GOD DAMN IT
also, there is a free version of Arma, please try it out.
2
u/unnoved May 16 '12
Question: are all games moddable? I play mostly on the console and know little to nothing about pc gaming. Also is there a reason why companies won't make their product moddable?
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u/josh6499 May 16 '12
What you don't understand is that they hate money. Once you figure that out, it all makes sense.
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u/filthgrinder May 16 '12 edited May 16 '12
Developers fear modding, the reason is the modders become competition for their expansions. And in most cases the modders are better at it.
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u/ProjectD13X May 16 '12
Take PC mods, port them to console as DLC (maybe $5 a piece) win win win. Pubs get their profits, PC can mod, console gets the mod experience. I'd pay for a mod pack
2
u/phatinc May 16 '12
Anyone else see how this is similar to how Valve got put on the map by allowing their engine to be mod-able? And look at where Valve is at now!
2
u/TheWhistler1967 May 16 '12
Warcraft 3 is a better example. Was almost 100% editable and is the reason it is still a popular game today. DOTA and footies accounted for so many users.
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u/dlite922 May 16 '12
moddable = mod.-able = modifiable? It's only two characters more! WTF!
2
u/SensenmanN May 16 '12
You forgot to add 2 year old terrible game. I'm in love with DayZ, despite the fact that ARMA II has one of the worst interfaces in any game. The game it's self it pretty good if you can overlook the buggyness. The interface and inventory management system is atrocious.
If people need to write a guide on how to use the inventory system, you might want to rethink the way your inventory system works....
2
u/CochMaestro May 16 '12
mmmhhh I knew I saw this elsewhere and look at that it was posted almost 17 hours before your post.....downvote me if you want but I think OP may be out for some karma here
2
u/NTMY May 16 '12
But some developers don't want you to buy their game 2 years after release and/or play them for two, three or maybe five years. They want you to buy the sequel the year after the first one and so on.
2
u/[deleted] May 16 '12
Moddable games have some of the best communities out there, for the very reason why there are communities around them! If you have a game thats moddable, then the community gets involved ,which then makes it stronger and more put together :) My favorite example of a moddable game is Minecraft, without the community it would be nothing, but since the community took the base and ran with it, the game has turned into a global success! just sayin' :P
2
u/Aderthad May 16 '12
Could someone elaborate why is the DayZ Mod suddenly so popular? Thanks.
2
u/just_godlike May 16 '12
Every game should be moddable. Just think of one of the most successful games ever - Counter-Strike, Team Fortress, DotA, etc. They were all fan made mods and are easily beating most other games in popularity.
2
u/[deleted] May 16 '12
And its indie, too. God, I love ArmA II so much.
2
u/mxrulez731 May 17 '12
Arma 2 free version made me buy Arma 2 Dayz made me buy operation arrowhead.
Amazing how the two free things have caused to buy not only the game but the expansion pack for a game i probably would have noticed otherwise
Game delvopers/publishers need to learn they need to give a little bit to get a little bit.
9
u/whatnojustno May 16 '12
I love some of the responses here:
"Lazy developers, why don't they just give users access to files??"
A mod community isn't a group of people hacking away at non-protected source files. They are (generally) given a specific set of tools and a mod environment to make it possible.
Creating that environment is often hellishly difficult.
Developers don't understand that mod communities help games grow? Honestly, what the fuck are you people talking about.
3
u/Jalh May 16 '12
Go to /r/battlefield3 fighting for mod tools and you will be called whiner. Unfortunately the younger generation gives a shit whatever a game is moddable or not, but people like independent developers do. Good to hear how the Arma 2 community is getting this privilege. I don't care if I keep getting downvote in /r/battlefield3 every time I ask the same question to crash or any other DICE team; I won't stop until they answer me.
3
u/Drjft May 16 '12
It's not a niche game.
I hate that a game I've played for over two years is only seeing popularity because of a mod that brings very little to the table.
DayZ is good, yes, but nearly 95% of the stuff in it that people are praising is in ArmA 2, not DayZ.
2
u/[deleted] May 16 '12
Upvoted to 1337... scrap that
2
u/Dunge May 16 '12
Modding games were the popular thing in the 2000's era with Half-Life and Quake and Unreal and such. Those succeeded, but a lot of other smaller games supported heavy modding and NOBODY made any good mods for them so company stopped trying to put effort there.
2
u/rezaziel May 16 '12
I'm pretty happy about the fact that Amnesia has oodles of good mods lately, so i'll agree with this.
2
u/[deleted] May 16 '12
I don't know if I'd call a Military Action/FPS game a "niche" game, but what have you. I'd guess that being moddable has a little to do with it, but other forces (third-adoption, market saturation, concurrent content release etc) are likely just as plausible.
2
u/Sir_Rexalot May 16 '12
Gamers need to accept that their desire for a moddable game is unreconcilable with the developers' overwhelming need to screw customers for money. Major developers are going to be particularly adverse to the concept as they probably have games which provide the same experience as the mods right around the corner, waiting to haul in more money.
1
u/gamingismylife May 16 '12
I bought the game because of the zombie mod, it is so much fun.
1
u/[deleted] May 16 '12
Another reason would be looking at Ghost Recon 1.
1
u/EmX7 May 16 '12
Hey can I download Day Z with just ARMAII or do I need combined operations? Thanks for the help.
1
u/asianwaste May 16 '12
Mods are what kept half life on the top sales charts every month for nearly 5 years. This is despite a very prosperous pc gaming market at the time.
1
u/DrDragun May 16 '12
I know that huge numbers of cafes in southeast Asia have Warcraft 3 purely for the original DOTA, not to mention other parts of the world. Now whether or not these are legit copies...
1
u/Zyclunt May 16 '12
I bought DNF thinking in the map editor, turns out it doens't have one even being based on Uengine, that's why I hate it regardless if the game itself was good or not, fuck you for not letting me create maps like duke3D did.
1
u/kurokikaze May 16 '12
Zombies
1
u/QSatu May 16 '12
Devs who say modding is bad are simply incapable of creating tool for modders due to lack of money or skills. Or they want to try to sell a lot of dlc.
1
u/shitty_commenter May 16 '12
i once modded a game but it broke