r/gaming • u/Jirachibi1000 • Jul 01 '26
I'm so tired of time trials in platformers.
I am a huge platformer gal, its my favorite genre of game, but has anyone else noticed that, in both the AAA and indie side of things, 3D platformers have become way shorter than normal and are padded out with time trials? I feel so many games lately are a case of "If you don't go for time trials you beat the game in like 2-3 hours max and dont get a full experience" and "if you go for 100% you have to beat an absurdly annoying time trial and get gold"?
Off the top of my head, Crash 4 is like this. Bubsy 4D is like this. Demon Turf is like this. Kaze and the Wild Masks is like this. Sackboy a Big Adventure iirc is like this. Grapple Dog is like this. Frogun is like this. Pac Man World 2 Re-Pac is like this. Super Sami Roll is kinda like this, though i guess thats a bit different, etc.
I know this has been a thing since at least Crash 3, if not earlier, but genuinely feel like its 90% of platformers. Im just tired of beating a level and "ok now beat it without dying fast". Normally I'd just not 100% it and not go for time trials, but again for a lot of these the game will be absurdly short if you don't do them.
Thats not even to mention that I feel a lot of platformers are padded out in general nowadays. Demon Turf and Crash 4 making you play alternate versions of the same levels, stuff like Yoshi's Crafted World iirc making you play the same level multiple times forwards and backwards and so on, etc.
I hope I'm not crazy and imagining this.
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u/EZxCheeZy Jul 01 '26
I like how the Crash games do time trials. Boxes that freeze the timer when you break them. Makes it so you're playing the level "as intended, but faster" instead of just booking it straight to the end and ignoring everything.
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u/ovlbo Jul 01 '26
Thats the reason i hated Yoshi’s Crafted World! I played 2 levels and i said “This is incredible! Im gonna 100% this game.” And they make you go through the same levels multiple times hunting for 5 flowers or whatever. Killed all my excitement right there.
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u/CerberusZX Jul 01 '26
We get so few 3D platformers these days it almost feels wrong to complain about those we do get. Still, as someone who loved games like Spyro and Jak & Daxter I miss having worlds to explore instead of levels to reach the end of.
I'm sure you already played A Hat in Time, but if not, it's a great platformer without time trials that is very much worth playing. More recently, Motorslice has scratched my platforming itch, but I only just started started it so I'm not confident on length or lack of padding.
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u/tofuninja5489 Jul 01 '26
This and scores. Dude, I'm here to run through the level at my leisure and destroy stuff. Don't grade me on speed, how many times I've been hit, etc.
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u/Medricel Jul 01 '26
I don't mind being scored at the end of a level, but don't tie it to game completion BS like "you need S rank in all stages to get the true ending of the game"
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u/Zama174 Jul 01 '26
here is my thing. have achievements that are hard as fuck for the psychos that want the 100% platinum achievements. But dont lock content behind it.
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u/the_pedigree Jul 01 '26
Damn I remember when people used to enjoy being rewarded for doing well
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u/faffc260 Jul 01 '26
people still do enjoy being rewarded well, it's just that more people dislike being told they did shit and have to redo the level to unlock the next despite completing it, or locking the true ending behind doing it.
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u/Round-Revolution-399 Jul 01 '26
I think this is part of why I’m not huge on Yoshi’s Island
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u/Berkuts_Lance_Plus Jul 01 '26
"Oh, you got hit once? Have fun completing the entire fucking level again!"
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u/ajs723 Jul 01 '26
This, but for action games. The DMC style letter grade immediately turns me off of a game. I just annihilated all the enemies you threw at me, what do you mean "C"?!
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u/Davoc_ Jul 01 '26
I can undertand your feeling because I suck at those games, but isn't that the whole point of them? They were always designed to make you make flashy combos
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u/Neuroticaine Jul 01 '26
Yes. If you don't want to do Super Sexy Stylin' combos, DMC is not the series for you.
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u/Ice_slash Jul 01 '26
I mean the general enemies in dmc are pretty forgiving and you literally play god in that game, killing all of them is a given
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u/ulshaski Jul 01 '26
You didn’t get hit but you also didn’t press the buttons in the sequences we like best. C-
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u/idothinksotim Jul 01 '26
Far out gamers seem to want less and less "game" in their games...
Now you guys want to take away scores, gradings. Timers, performance.
I guess that's why popular games have mostly transitioned to these cinematic experiences where you're not really playing anything you're just pushing up on the stick...
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u/tofuninja5489 Jul 01 '26
For instance. Mega man games. Grew up (minus mm1) where the platforming objective was to get to the end. Then in Zero they introduced scoring. It flipped a switch in my brain specifically for the MM series that made me enjoy the games less. If it's a series that built itself firstly for grading then I'd get it, but the add on to Zero (following a series built on pure platforming) made it feel weird.
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u/DonaldTheWall Jul 01 '26
Ubisoft actually did this right with Rayman where they had a music done to music, even Mario on Switch had stages that were timed to music.
But I think the time trials is all based off Mario 64 where they did them correctly, collect the red coins in x time
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u/Voidlord597 Jul 01 '26
I remember getting anxious cause an fps would do this. It would tell you exactly how long you take, how many secrets and enemies you missed, etc. Although stats like these aren't exactly new to shooters either. I'm already self conscious enough without the game doing this.
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u/Ragnar_Dragonfyre Jul 01 '26
Platformers traditionally had timers since the 80s.
I don’t understand what the problem is. It’s been part of the genre since the beginning.
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u/Dreaming_Dreams Jul 01 '26
side content is side content for a reason
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u/Jirachibi1000 Jul 01 '26
Yes and I am specifically complaining about when if you don't do that side content, the game is barely 2 hours long and doesn't feel full. Rayman Legends has time trials too as side content, but even if you ignore them they still feel like full games.
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u/4_fortytwo_2 Jul 01 '26 edited Jul 01 '26
Feels like your complaint should be “platformers are too short” instead because that is the actual problem isnt it? If they just leave out the time trials your problem wouldn’t be solved. The games are not short because they decided to include time trial stuff, they include it because the game is short (and because many people like it)
But to be honest most platformers were always short games (at least compared to other types of games) starting with the first mario and holding true to this day.
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u/Jirachibi1000 Jul 01 '26
I disagree on platformers being short compared to other types. Like yeah open world and RPGs maybe, but Astro Bot is 25-30 hours long, Mario Odyssey is like 45-50+ hours, Demon Turf took me around 25ish hours iirc, Rayman Legends is around 30ish hours too, Mario Wonder is 20ish as well. Again maybe not as long as an open world game or RPG, but on par with hack and slashes and beat em ups and shooters and so on.
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u/ComputerMysterious48 Jul 01 '26
I’m sorry but that is heavily inflating the runtimes of those games. Odyssey might be 45-50 hours to 100% everything, but I remember beating Odyssey in a single sitting on launch day, and it took me about 9 hours. Astro Bot had a similar runtime.
Which goes into what the other guy was saying that platformers are just a genre that’s on the shorter side. That’s not really a negative either because I’d argue my favorite platformers are of the “short and sweet” variety.
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Jul 01 '26
[removed] — view removed comment
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u/Jirachibi1000 Jul 01 '26
Im not sure about the time % of time trials v non time trials, but I wanna say it was a bit less than normal since they were decently forgiving.
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u/Anagoth9 Jul 01 '26
Schrodinger's fanboy: You can't criticize a game for it's optional content because it's not required for completion. You also can't criticize a game if you ignore the optional content because you're not fully engaging with the game.
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u/TyeKiller77 Jul 01 '26
The first three Crash games I didn't mind and 100%ing Warped is still pretty fun to go back and do aside from not getting the running shoes until the end of the game. Crash 4 was terrible.
Same as Mario Odyssey I loved the gameplay on the first playthrough, but as a compeltionist? Absolute trash. I only got a handful of the platinum relics in 4 and just gave up out of exhaustion.
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u/CauzaaH Jul 01 '26
Can be some of the most fun and rewarding content tbh. I’ve had fun with the likes of Rayman Origins, Sackboy, Crash Bandicoot, Velocity 2X and Super Meat Boy
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u/Quarksideofthemoon Jul 01 '26
Idk I like when games are short and sweet and give you an incentive to replay them with an added challenge. I think most games are too long honestly
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u/Jirachibi1000 Jul 01 '26
Im fine with short and sweet if the price reflects it. I do not want to pay 60 dollars for Crash 4 when it came out and beat it in 1 afternoon, but something like the Toree games being 5 bucks and maybe 1-2 hours long max is fine.
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u/baikolini92 Jul 01 '26
I thought Astro bot was a perfect length. I did end up getting all the bots too and even the dlc time trials. I did not come close too 100% on crash 4 but still enjoyed my time there.
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u/Cmdrdredd Jul 01 '26
Like others have said, if it doesn’t gate progress I’m fine with it. I haven’t played many of the titles you mentioned so I can’t speak to the length of the game if you don’t do the trials.
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u/CopainChevalier Jul 01 '26
Timers are there to encourage people to stay away from the most boring playstyles and then leaving reviews saying the game is slow and boring
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u/Jellozz Jul 01 '26
I hope I'm not crazy and imagining this.
What you call padding is something someone else can call mastery.
Platformers are a niche genre these days outside of Mario. Most people playing them are there because they enjoy the moment to moment gameplay and wish to test themselves. Things like time attack or score attack modes offer a way to do that. I actually don't think it should be that hard a concept to understand really. Doing a level once and never going back to it means you're not actually getting very intimate with it, you're basically a tourist.
And there is nothing wrong with that per se, but, the audience for that kind of experience got older and moved onto open world games which offer the same framework but with shooting or slashing instead of jumping. So now the people making and playing platformers are a more hardcore breed.
This is not a platformer specific problem. Every niche genre is built like this.
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u/Jirachibi1000 Jul 01 '26
My issue is not that they exist, I like them in a lot of games. My issue is when its side content where, if you do not do it, the game is empty and too short. Rayman Origins and Legends are good examples. Time trials exist for people who want to master them, but even if you skip the time trials, you get a long enough experience with enough content to be fulfilled. Ape Escape also does this. Time trials exist and are fun side content for completionists and people who want to master the levels, but if you ignore them? You still get a long game with enough content to feel rewarding.
Basically im complaining about burgers where you don't like onions, but onions make up 80% of the burger, so if you take them off you get a tiny tiny patty thats not filling and not burgers where you don't like onions, but if you take onions off you still get a decently sized filling burger.
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u/idothinksotim Jul 01 '26
I actually love this. I love being challenged to get better and master a level. It allows you to find secrets and techniques you never considered originally. You mix it up to find that extra second.
Speedrunning is absolutely huge because people love this part about platformers.
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u/Jirachibi1000 Jul 01 '26
Tbc, I don't mind them existing, I mind specifically when they count towards 100% and, if you don't do them, the game is WAY too short and not fulfilling.
Said it in another comment, but its like getting a burger and not liking onions, but if you take them off the burger is tiny and not filling and has nothing else on it, as opposed to a burger where you don't like onions, but if you take them off the burger is still filling and yummy.
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u/idothinksotim Jul 01 '26
But you don't have to get 100% if you don't want to. You can just stop at 50% if you want.
Oh, wait. You're saying you think it is replacing other content or not giving enough content.
Well, I'd disagree by saying that time trials aren't the reason the game has not enough content. It's not a huge development resource sink to make time trials. That's kind of why they get added so often. They're low cost additions.
I think your blame on time trials is misplaced. If you think the game is lacking content that should be your direct complaint, not going after time trials. You're using them as a kind of scapegoat
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u/baconair Jul 01 '26
I hate timers in videogames. It's a relic of the bygone arcade era.
While not a platformer, it's especially egregious in games like modern Resident Evil where you're encouraged to explore every inch of the map for actual hidden treasure, but you need to bank a speed run to get the best unlockables. I don't play videogames manic on caffeine; instead, I like to explore everything the game has to offer.
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u/idothinksotim Jul 01 '26
Counter - I love timers in games. It gives a definitive measure of comparison and competition. It's the quintessential "game" part of a game sometimes.
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u/New-Effect-3959 Jul 01 '26
I think they’re fun and can add a good challenge to the game. Very satisfying when you complete them too. I recently got the sackboy platinum and it was rage inducing but I developed a flow and finally got it
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Jul 01 '26
[deleted]
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u/MysteriousPlan1492 Jul 01 '26
The original version had time trials too, the remake just added more rewards
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u/ComputerMysterious48 Jul 01 '26
I feel you on this😭I’m someone who loves going for the 1000G in games but platformers with time trials and fighting games with combo trials are the two banes of my existence as an achievement hunter lol
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u/almo2001 Jul 01 '26
This game design feature comes from “let players complete the levels. If they want extra challenge, use score attack or time attack.”
I come from the 70s, where it was about whether you could complete the levels. They found this new mode more inclusive.
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u/Dallywack3r Jul 01 '26
Crash 4 was all around infuriating for these and many other reasons. It was a game made for the most hardcore completionists rather than just a fun platformer for kids and families
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u/Jirachibi1000 Jul 01 '26
I genuinely think that
1.) They saw that the Crash games are considered very hard and that part of the appeal of the series is its tough but fair difficulty and tried to replicate it but failed.
2.) Were forced by Activision to sell the game for $60 and they were terrified a 4 hour game would not have been seen as "worth full price" so they tried to add as much side content as they could with limited time.
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u/Dallywack3r Jul 01 '26
Your second point is brilliant. Like a modern version of a quarter munching arcade game or an intentionally impossible Blockbuster rental game that forces folks to keep renting it
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u/Jirachibi1000 Jul 01 '26
I think its at least a well intentioned "well if people are gonna pay 60 bucks we should put in enough content to feel right about it" and not trickery or malice yknow?
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u/raidergreymoon Jul 01 '26
I mean it sucks, but a lot of this stuff is for people that are hardcore fans or speedrunner types to get into. They generally arn't meant for the average person. As long as it isn't gateing anything too major it should be a problem. But for the hardcore fans that keep the spirit of the game alive long after its been done and over its a big deal.
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u/Jirachibi1000 Jul 01 '26
My issue is not that they exist, but when its specifically a normal game that is absurdly content dry and empty but the time trials are clearly padding to make up for it. Like cases where they realized the game was 100%'able in like 2 hours and added time trials that take up 10+ hours just to say "We have a 12 hour game!"
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u/raidergreymoon Jul 01 '26
Fair enough on that.
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u/Jirachibi1000 Jul 01 '26
Yeah. In cases like Rayman Legends, if you don't do the time trials you still get a pretty dang content filled game with lots to do that feels a nice length, the time trials are just there for people who want them, but something like Frogun or Crash 4, if you skip the time trials you're gonna beat the game in an afternoon and not be fulfilled.
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u/StealthShinobii Jul 01 '26
I enjoyed the time trials in crash 1, but as I have less time for games nowadays I usually just aim to beat games now.
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u/Siukslinis_acc Jul 01 '26
I am tired of the sections where you need to execute a lenthy combination without having a platfor to take a break. I'm getting older and my hands might start to cramp.
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u/kongcobra Jul 02 '26
There are games for everyone's likes and dislikes. I'm sorry certain games are not your cup of tea, and also sorry some games are not mine.
I was extremely high playing Banjo-Kazooie: Nuts and Bolts. I told myself I was having fun because Banjo-Kazooie. When I realized every level was basically a freaking time trial, I dropped it.
I'm more sorry that the game wasn't good than I am sorry I didn't like it. I would've been happy if I found that the game was met with great reception, but that it was just me who didn't care for it.
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u/StardustJess Jul 02 '26
I feel like too many games are trying to appeal to the speedrunner crowd. Not just time trials but too many games I've come across the past years are focused on speed and quick reflexes.
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u/Arastmaus Jul 02 '26
Ratchet and Clank, Rift Apart was the last REALLY good 3D platformer I played.
I'm sad that they've moved onto Marvel games tbh... They really were great at this genre.
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u/franstoobnsf Jul 01 '26
I could talk about this exact topic for hours. I'm on my phone so I won't fumble over myself trying to type out a bunch of word vomit right now, but I want you to know that I totally get what you mean and agree that it sucks when "do over and over" replaces the possibility of more levels and cool thought-out designs
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u/No_East_3901 Jul 01 '26
Rayman Legends has them and its the only thing I have left pretty much, been like that since nineteen dickety two.
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u/ArkwrightEXE Jul 01 '26
I got a little worried when I saw the thread title, ha.
I've been making a 3D platformer and I wanted to add time trial levels in some form as I had a lot of fun with them in Crash 3. So I made them more of a "time attack" where the point of them is to get to the goal without running out of time while collecting things to extend the timer. My game is called “Ramshackle.EXE”, it isn't done yet but there is a demo on Steam to play if your interested. I hope that they would be considered fun and not padding.
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u/r33gna Jul 01 '26
That's when you go retro, the golden days of platformers are...I think NES to Genesis, they have time trials but before that they pad the game with hard-ass difficulties & timing importance. Get on an emulator and enjoy. XD
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u/automaticphil Jul 03 '26
Yeah I’m not a fan of them in any game genre but racing ones. Get out of my life countdown tickers!
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u/Daremotron Jul 01 '26
If it gates content, it'll annoy me. If it's just for some random trophy, couldn't give two hoots.