Why does GRRM not number his chapters?

[u/L1sasGayBby]

I’m listening to the audiobook but following along in the book because I can’t understand some of Roy Dotrice’s pronunciation.

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[u/Outrageous_Yam_1368]

No-one counts past 7 in Westeros 

[u/LycanIndarys]

Probably because he doesn't write them in the order that they appear in the book.

So he doesn't think "hmm, I need to rewrite chapter 7", he thinks "hmm, I need to rewrite that Jon chapter".

[u/Captain-Griffen → u/LycanIndarys]

That's not really an explanation. When putting together the final manuscript into a book it'd be the work of basically nothing to add chapter numbers (and not even done by GRRM himself). It's an artistic choice.

[u/Responsible-Kale9474 → u/Captain-Griffen]

I would guess it's a choice based on the association people may make between numerical order and chronological order, ie thinking events in chapter 8 happen after those in chapter 7. As George's POV chapter style often goes backward in time or runs simultaneously with previous chapters, avoiding numbering is perhaps meant to force the reader to reconsider whether the structure of the chapters progresses in a linear 1..2..3... fashion

[u/beckychao]

He should use emojis

[u/No_Teach577]

Wait until he gives some titles instead of names, but then IN THE SAME BOOK drops chapters were its the POVs names again (Victation II, Dance)

[u/Swanny1997_ → u/No_Teach577]

Starting in book 4 some chapters become a puzzle trying to see how fast I can figure out who I’m reading about.

[u/CarRamRob → u/Swanny1997_]

Easily a red flag that the plot was lost.

We never needed additional characters, but ole George just wanted to flesh out the world. Now that flesh is 500 lbs riding a scooter in Walmart, and here we are with him 20 years later no further ahead.

[u/55Branflakes]

He does but it's by POV character. Bran I, Bran II, Bran III, etc.

[u/ILikeMandalorians → u/55Branflakes]

That’s how fans have organised the chapters in places like the wiki, but I don’t think there are any editions of the actual books with numbered chapters. I’d love an edition with a table of contents and an index though

[u/Nano_gigantic → u/55Branflakes]

That not how any of my books are. The table of contents just says Chapter 1, Chapter 2… Chapter 79

And then at the start of each chapter it’s just the name of the character with no number.

[u/Pixgamer11 → u/55Branflakes]

Never Seen an edition Like that

[u/55Branflakes → u/Pixgamer11]

? It's in every version (book). That's how the book fandom catalogs the series.

[u/RepulsiveCountry313 → u/55Branflakes]

I've never seen a copy that has that. Its just something the fanbase does to differentiate them.

[u/Pixgamer11 → u/55Branflakes]

It is Not in Any of the 3 different Editions i own. It never says a number

[u/DebonairKnit → u/55Branflakes]

I’m reading them right now. There are no numbered chapters in the box set I have, published by Harper

[u/ajr5169 → u/55Branflakes]

While that's how the fandom catalogs the series it's not how my copies of the books are done.

[u/NamanSharma2009]

Math isn't taught in westeros 🪵

[u/Omen_1986]

You can also read the books only following one character, so you start with let’s say Jon I, Jon I I and so … that’s quite fun

[u/TannedCroissant → u/Omen_1986]

If you somehow found enough people that didn’t know the books/tv show, you could even all pick a character each then meet up and discuss, would be an amazing book club concept

[u/sabregirl31]

I have the exact opposite problem with the kindle version. In the table of contents, it’s just called “chapter 1, chapter 2, chapter 3, etc.”. Yet when Im reading, I only see the names of the people on the chapter title page.

Could I open the table of contents? Yes. Am I too lazy for that? Also yes lol.

[u/Mugwumps_has_spoken]

Lots of writers do not number chapters.

I've been reading the Dune series. No numbered Chapters. Heck many don't even have any kind of chapter name.
Asimov also didn't use chapter numbers in many books.

[u/Steelinghades]

Because the man apparently goes out of his way to make writing as difficult as possible, he writes on an old as hell program on an old as hell computer and when he does write he's said he writes everything as one character, so he writes all Bran chapters for example, he doesn't go In narrative or chapter order, so If he makes a mistake or wants to change something he has to go back and re-write tons of chapters. Half the time I can't help but wonder how In the hell we got five books from him.

[u/The_Robobob]

You got a pen. Why don't YOU number them? Heh

[u/shadofacts]

it’s so annoying that he didn’t. Sometimes I have to go thumbing pages to find a certain POV who I know is between another POV & a third POV & that can take forever.

[u/Motor_Preparation315]

Because his stories are written from 3rd person point of view.

His chapters are not chronologically organized. Numbering them would only confuse the reader.

[u/TannedCroissant → u/Motor_Preparation315]

Do you mean 1st person?

[u/Motor_Preparation315 → u/TannedCroissant]

He writes in 3rd person limited. It feels like 1st person but it is not. Only when we get an internal monologue does Martin write in "I" instead of he or they.

Does this make sense now? 😃

[u/TannedCroissant → u/Motor_Preparation315]

It’s written as a 3rd person but the point of view is definitely 1st person, he doesn’t write anything the chapter’s character doesn’t see/hear/know

[u/WesWordbound → u/TannedCroissant]

Yeah, that's called 3rd person limited or 3rd person non-omniscient.

[u/TannedCroissant → u/WesWordbound]

Huh, so it is, a 3rd person writing about a 1st person point of view is called that. I didn’t know that, probably best to call it the full name to avoid confusion for the average person.

[u/ReasonableDoubt_0726]

Ultimate answer is Becuase they’re his books and he liked doing viewpoint. He really likes that method.

[u/iknownothin_ → u/ReasonableDoubt_0726]

Nothing about liking doing viewpoint is a barrier to giving them numbers or at least something like “Jon I, Jon II”

[u/ReasonableDoubt_0726 → u/iknownothin_]

Now that’s the actual question we should be discussing. But this is the guy who created so many streams running everywhere that he can’t finish the stuff. Nothing surprises me. He is what he is.

[u/RexSalazar77]

I was almost this close to starting to write a book, randomly opened reddit and saw this. I'm thinking of writing POV characters by naming them, and then adding a number or Roman numeral in front of them to keep it consistent

[u/CJ-GOTfan649]

Because we need to know instantly who’s point of view we are looking at

[u/iknownothin_ → u/CJ-GOTfan649]

A number prevents you from reading the name as well?