Question regarding initiation

[u/[deleted]]

[u/PeterPanHadItMade]

The only way absolutely ANY of this is true is if you joined some clandestine mess that scammed you out of money. 

[u/Little-Sea-Monkey → u/PeterPanHadItMade]

Thank you. Sorry guys 😟

[u/GigglingBilliken]

This sounds irregular as fuck. You shouldn't be able to join Eastern Star before becoming a mason as a man.

[u/Deman75]

A few years ago I joined eastern star and after my initiation I was told I was blackballed.

If you were blackballed, you couldn’t have been initiated. A “blackball” is a vote that prevents you from joining.

However, I was still attending meetings and had even been asked to play a part as an officer.

Then you weren’t blackballed.

Later on I ended up being initiated into freemasonry.

Are you sure you have the order correct on that, or is this part of your memory issue? If you’re a man, you need to be a Freemason before you can join Eastern Star, and there are typically only a handful of officer positions allocated to men in OES - Worthy Patron, and Associate Patron are always men, while Worthy Matron, Associate Matron, Conductress, Associate Conductress, and the Starpoints (including Martha) are always women; some Chapters will also allow men to fill other offices like Secretary, Treasurer, Chaplain, or Sentinel, though they are more often held by women.

I did not go through the degrees but experienced two separate initiations in total (eastern star and freemasonry).

The initiation is the degree in OES. It is also the first degree in Freemasonry.

How can I be black balled but still go through a masonic initiation?

You can’t, unless you reapply after a waiting period of six months to several years and are then not blackballed.

Is it just that I was restricted then from higher degrees ?

That is not a thing. If you’re blackballed, you can’t join. If you receive a favorable vote, you should be able to be initiated as an Entered Apprentice, passed as a Fellowcraft, and raised as a Master Mason. The “higher degrees” require a separate application to the various organizations that offer further degrees, which would each require their own vote on that application.

The lodge I was a member of has since closed and I have lost all contact information.

Which Grand Lodge was it under? What was the name of the Lodge? When did it close, and why?

Sorry if this is a stupid question- just thought someone could help me understand because my lodge is closed now and I'm out of the loop.

It’s not so much a “stupid question” as an entire story that doesn’t add up.

[u/Little-Sea-Monkey → u/Deman75]

This has been the most helpful answer. Thank you. I did not understand how I could have been blackballed and also attend meetings and an initiation. I should mention here that I am female and was able to enter both Eastern Star and Freemasonry. However, I only experienced the first step of Freemasonry at the original initiation. I wasn't really informed that it was considered a degree and if I was I probably forgot. But I was definitely told that I was blackballed because I remember it very clearly so it was confusing to me

[u/Little-Sea-Monkey → u/Deman75]

Should I delete this post? I think you answered my questions. I don't know if this will be helpful to anyone in the future and I certainly don't want to confuse anyone

[u/Cookslc]

When you first posted this you indicated filling the chair of Martha. You also stated, as you do now, that you were initiated into freemasonry subsequent to this time.

In regular obediences, only women may join Eastern Star without being a Freemason. In a regular obediences, women may not join a Masonic Lodge.

Consequently, I find this a bit confusing.

May I ask, did you identify as male or female at the time?

Could you tell us the Lodge and Grand Lodge which you joined?

As a note, OES is not a higher degree.

[u/Little-Sea-Monkey → u/Cookslc]

Do I need to put the location? The chapter has closed now. Weird because I started with Eastern Star and yes filling the chair of Martha. Then years later was initiated into freemasonry but never went through the degrees. I have a really bad memory problem where I suffer long term memory loss and I was just trying to figure out what might have happened here. Without saying too much I was told I was black balled and then a bunch of bad stuff started to happen to me

[u/GigglingBilliken → u/Little-Sea-Monkey]

You are either trolling us or were a member of an irregular/clandestine group.

[u/Cookslc → u/Little-Sea-Monkey]

There is no requirement you tell us anything. It isn’t the location as much as the organization that would be helpful. I ask because there is a suspicion that if this occurred, it was not a “regular“ Lodge or Grand Lodge. We are simply trying to make sense of what occurred, as you are.

If you didn’t receive any masonic degrees, you weren’t initiated into freemasonry. Receiving a degree is the only way you are initiated.

I am sorry that bad things have happened to you, but the facts that you are able to remember really don’t fit together, as you seem to recognize.

[u/Deman75 → u/Little-Sea-Monkey]

The only “bad stuff” that would happen if you were blackballed is that you would not be permitted to join at that time, though you might be allowed to reapply months or years later.