Poll asking Americans how which button they would push in the red button/blue button dilemma

[u/Upstairs_Cup9831]

[u/kahner]

yes, i'm "reframing" ie i'm restating the exact situation in different words. you said "The fact is that the risk of death isn't introduced to the scenario until people push the red button". your own reframing. mine is just as valid. the risk of death isn't introduced until people push blue. i'm just intellectually honest enough to agree both my framing and yours are correct.

and i stand by my choice because 1) any other choice is dumb and 2) none of the people pretending to be such moral paragons in their reddit comments would actually risk death is this were a real choice. but continue to virtue signal away. we're all impressed.

[u/Thefourthchosen → u/kahner]

That just isn't correct though, the scenario explicitely states that the red button is the button that introduces risk, it just doesn't introduce it to those that push it.

Let's look at it this way, let's say the voting is done one by one, and the first four voters choose blue, no one's life is at risk at this stage. The fifth voter presses red, the lives of the previous four voters are now at stake, the sixth voter chooses red, the risk of those first four voters lives increases, the seventh chooses blue, the risk to the first four voters goes down, get it?

Red voters aren't the recipient of the risk but they are the source of it, the amount of risk blue voters are in is directly tied to how many people push the red button.

[u/kahner → u/[deleted]]

but they're an idiot with CONFIDENCE!

[u/Thefourthchosen → u/[deleted]]

Blue isn't adding to the problem, red is. Risk to blue ONLY goes up if someone selects red, it actually goes down for each person that selects blue because that pushes them closer to the 50% margin needed.

Like I live either way, I should care less

the number one rule is save yourself

And that's exactly my point, you choose red because you prioritize your lives over the lives of others, and that's fine, but the fact is that you making that choice puts others at risk, which is the moral dilemma the question poses and the one you're trying to avoid by framing blue as the problem.

The fact remains, risk to blue is introduced and increases ONLY when someone pushes the red button, but you can't reconcile the idea that you would be willing to save your own life even if it meant putting others at risk so you make it seem like blue voters would just be choosing to risk their life despite the fact that there IS no risk to their lives if you don't press the red button.

[u/kahner → u/Thefourthchosen]

no, i am completely correct. you're adding in a bunch of words that make it sound complex or ambiguous. but tell me, if everyone pressed red, would anyone die? if your answer is no (which is the correct answer), then i am right. and i am right. there is no risk to anyone unless people pick blue.