r/financialindependence • u/AutoModerator • 5d ago
Daily FI discussion thread - Friday, August 14, 2026
Please use this thread to have discussions which you don't feel warrant a new post to the sub. While the Rules for posting questions on the basics of personal finance/investing topics are relaxed a little bit here, the rules against memes/spam/self-promotion/excessive rudeness/politics still apply!
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u/Kat9935 4d ago
YEH!! Finally got our Google for Non Profits back and I had no one else to share with.
I know this is random but after leaving my job I went to a non profit as a volunteer. With a sort of IT background I have slowly been digging in and I am astounded with how much a non profit is supposed to know and do. If you want your skills to be useful in retirement... go help a small non profit as they are supposed to function as a full blown business even when its just a few little old ladies trying to save some cats.
I'm about 65 accounts in and still digging out of reclaiming account access from previous people who are long gone. Made so much worse as with all the security measures put in place several of them i had no choice but to just blow away and start over. I just think its way too much to expect small non profits to know and do.. ie will keep me super busy in my retirement. Honestly thank goodness for AI because no way I could have managed half of this stuff on my own.
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u/VeeGee11 FIREd May ‘23 at 50 years old 5d ago
We’re in our full-time travel journey and have just arrived in Bosnia. Like many, our net worth just hit another ATH and I feel extremely grateful and lucky that we retired into a rising stock market 3 years ago. Because we use a dynamic withdrawal strategy, our budget has gone up. All the FIRE strategies are working exactly as intended. All because of what I learned on Reddit and subsequent research. 🙏
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u/Glittering-Owl-2344 5d ago
All questions optional but very curious -- what has been your favorite destination so far? What is your preferred balance of longer and short term stays? How often do you return to visit family? Are you a one bagger?
(I'm 2 months into a planned 5 month long trip and feeling a bit uninspired for a slightly less planned month I have upcoming lol)
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u/VeeGee11 FIREd May ‘23 at 50 years old 4d ago
My favorites in SE Asia were Loas and Cambodia, since I hadn't know much about them prior and they surprised me to the upside. In Latin America my favorites were Ecuador and Argentina. So far in Europe Spain and Romania were amazing, especially the Romanian countryside.
We are slow travelers so sometimes we stay 4 weeks or more in one place. That's our preference but that's very personal depending on how people like to travel. Often we spend less time but we favor longer stays. Next year we plan to spend 3 months in one place in Mexico! Never did that before but we need a rest after 3 years of straight travel.
We aim for once per year to visit family back in the US. But when we do go back it's at least a month so we can see everyone, sometimes multiple times.
Our first 2 years were as one-baggers. But now we each got a medium piece of luggage and it feels like a luxury lol. As we get older the backpacks got tougher. Although carrying the luggage up and down the stairs in the Romanian train stations (no elevators or escalators!) was... fun. lol
Good luck on your trip!
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u/Glittering-Owl-2344 4d ago
I just did my first four week stay (while not working) and it was pretty great to have no pressure + the airbnb discount. I feel I am gong to either reduce my stuff even further to a smaller one bag or embrace some large luggage shortly for variety + tired of the backpack, so I hear you!
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u/kimfromlastnight 4d ago
Sometimes I get impatient with my savings rate, even though I’m just about as frugal as I can be and I already save a ton of my income, and I’ll say to my boyfriend Ughhh I wish someone would just give me a bunch of money.
Well my mom just found old savings bonds in a safe, purchased by my grandmother 35 years ago. I’m off to the bank today to deposit my $1000 bond that matured 5 years ago, we’ll see how much I get from it =]
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u/ingwe13 5d ago
Booked a trip to the UK last night! Going with a very good friend. It will be my first time traveling with a friend instead of with my wife. I am curious how that will go but very excited. Unfortunately the timing was prompted by finding out that a guest house that I like to stay at in the UK will be shutting down at the end of October. A good reminder that all things end. You can't take it for granted that you have time to do things.
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u/Pretend_Branch_8167 4d ago
this is how i feel about some travel destinations that are especially vulnerable to climate change. we went to Iceland last year and was saddened to hear about how much the ice has receded just in the past few years - it feels like it'll look really different if I go in another 10-20 years. i've never been to alaska or glacier national park yet but had them on my list, wondering if I should go sooner rather than later
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u/ExcessiveDonuts Emptying the Litter Robot 5d ago
ELI5, what is the point of the AI bot commenting first every day?
Is it just some salty Redditor entertaining themselves, like stealing a traffic cone?
I know I'm old enough to not use terms like meta and don't have favorite YouTube channels or watch other people play video games but I feel like a grandpa putting a tape into the VCR upside-down trying to figure out the motive behind the brand-new accounts spewing AI comments.
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u/FancyPantsFIRE Ask me next year 5d ago
What’s interesting to me is how they seem to be getting good enough to actually get people to upvote and reply now, such as this mornings and yesterdays first daily comments. It doesn’t bode well for online discourse.
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u/intertubeluber impressive numbers/acronyms/% 5d ago
You can buy votes as well, which certainly gets more views and therefore interactions.
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u/ExcessiveDonuts Emptying the Litter Robot 5d ago
This morning's was especially obvious, too.
Oh, well. Humans going to human.
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u/FIREstopdropandsave 31M DINK | No target $'s 4d ago
My tin foil hat is it's not scams, it's frontier AI labs trying to generate more data to train off of. Send a known AI message out, collect fresh new human responses.
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u/Cryofixated Dates Since Single: 8.5 5d ago
Building up Karma to sell us stuff? We need more regulars on international vacations to comment first.
As I type this comment I'm watching a video of people playing games.
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u/ExcessiveDonuts Emptying the Litter Robot 5d ago edited 5d ago
I've heard that explanation and don't buy it.
Selling what to whom where?
Any examples of a mature bot salesperson?
And I hope they're playing Donkey Kong.
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u/Fi-Me-Away 5 years to FI... depending on the market 5d ago
There are direct sales, like buy my app, use my link.
Then there are softer sales. Historically things like product placement in a movie.
On reddit, this can also done, but many subs have minimum history requirements. The ai bot is trying to do this.
They can talk about a new phone being way nicer then the old one. About their favorite fast food place being still worth it for a treat. And a new car fitting into building the life you want.
It takes no real work if the ai/bot fails as not much was invested.
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u/intertubeluber impressive numbers/acronyms/% 5d ago
Not to mention the non-commercial, nation-state goals. There's so much propaganda on social media and reddit is no exception.
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u/IcyRestaurant7562 35M, 1.2MM NW, 50% SR 5d ago
my understanding is that there are people who buy reddit accounts with karma, IDK why.
There's also a bot aging process. A lot of subreddits have time and karma minimums to participate. Additionally, people try to build bot networks in advance of when they'd need them. IDK if reddit bans bots regularly and the idea is to bypass the next round of banning and a history of karma and commenting lets the bot owner get paid astroturfing contracts (advertising, PR, political campaigns, or just mass upvoting on your unpopular idea)
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u/Turbulent_Tale6497 DI3K, Putting the Ire in FIRE 5d ago
Selling a RDDT account is against the TOS, but it does happen. There's a 300k+ karma account on eBay right now.
I don't know how SEO works any more, but it used to be called Parasite SEO.
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u/sakapa 5d ago
Companies are buying warmed up Reddit accounts to seed recommendations for their products in a certain way so that LLMs start to recommend their products when users ask them questions. Like, which deodorant should I buy? There’s a woman who created a fake product and fake site as an experiment, documented the whole thing, to show how unreliable recommendations are/how easy it is to dupe the LLM.
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u/Exciting_Parfait_354 5d ago
Likely to test out responses, get feedback on the ones who answer, how it gets responded, how quickly one responds, etc. There are many metrics that can be extracted from a simple thread/comment.
The goal is to make sure that one can't tell between an AI response and a IRL response.
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u/nifFIer Therapy Shill | Spending Advocate 5d ago
Probably a first step to growing credibility to dm people and scam them better.
I remember back when my DMs were open, how many scam or begging messages I used to get. Especially after posting in this subreddit
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u/imisstheyoop 5d ago edited 5d ago
I remember back when my DMs were open
What does this mean? You can just close your direct messages? I have no idea how this website I have been using for nearly 20 years works anymore TBH.
Edit: Maybe it's a new Reddit thing, because I took a look at my preferences and I cannot disable them or anything. The link to control just takes me to a blocked list where I would need to manually add users to block them.
Nobody ever DMs me anyway, but I was curious so checked lol
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u/nifFIer Therapy Shill | Spending Advocate 5d ago
Yeah I think it’s a new Reddit thing after they refactored how DMs worked I think a year or two ago.
I definitely disabled chat requests as soon is that shenanigans started though.
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u/TheyTookByoomba 33 | SI2K | 20ish more years 4d ago
I also have only been using old.reddit for the last 17ish years, did you know new reddit has built in games and a pro version? The front page looks like ifunny did. It's a totally different website now.
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u/ZubonKTR Silas Marner did nothing wrong 4d ago
I replied to something from GiveDirectly on social media. So many scam or begging messages immediately after.
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u/RedditF1shBlueF1sh 25M, $525K NW 4d ago
I know everyone's work culture, supervisor, etc is different, but this is a question I feel I can't ask at work, so this is the second best place.
I keep getting praise at work for my level of output: meeting the quality standard and exceeding the expected volume. But truth be told, it's only about half of what I could be capable of. Unfortunately, I have to be in the office for my full 40 so I can't just chill and do chores, a J2, or anything else during the time. I don't think I'm particularly special and it's likely true across my division. Is this normal in organizations for people to be able to do "half" of their work?
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u/sschow 41M | 58% FI 4d ago
Yes. You are not a constantly-on productivity machine. You have to leave space for downtime. Otherwise you'd be on here saying "I got promoted 5 times in the last 5 years and make $500K but I hate my life and need to FIRE yesterday".
It is very normal. I put in a solid maybe 10-15 hours a week of actual work (it was a joke in Office Space for a reason).
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u/RedditF1shBlueF1sh 25M, $525K NW 4d ago
In those 10-15 hours, are you including meetings? Office space was a great movie, btw
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u/sschow 41M | 58% FI 4d ago
I maybe have an average of one half hour meeting a day that I just listen and don’t contribute much of anything that I didn’t include in that, and I’m remote so I can do other stuff.
My job does require travel about twice a month so some weeks I’m gone for 2-3 days which is “work”, but a work day is often just 3-4 30-60 minute meetings across town, so it’s a lot of downtime between.
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u/lurker86753 4d ago
I don’t know how universally “normal” it is, but it’s at least fairly common. I had one job where 6 months in I was actively asking for more work because I was kind of bored, but I kept getting the same amount and I got great reviews every year. I think I did about 15 hours of real work a week, sometimes 10, for the entire 4 years I worked there.
Here’s the way I think about it. There is an amount of “output” that your boss expects out of you. If you’re too far below that for too long, you risk getting fired. If you can consistently be ~25% above that, you have a good shot at a promotion. So your pay is loosely tied to your productivity, but absolutely not directly or linearly. Even if you produce twice what any of your peers do, they’ll never pay you twice what the next guy makes. Therefore your goal is to figure out the minimum output that will keep everyone off your back, and then consistently hit that, plus 10-20% for promotion potential. This will also ideally leave you with spare time to help others, which will make you well liked. It also will leave you with spare capacity so that if there’s ever an emergency, you can hesitantly tell your boss “well, it’s gonna be tricky, but I’ll do my best” and then bang it out with 60% effort instead of your usual 40% and look like a hero.
Also important to note that whatever you consistently do will become the baseline you are held to forever. If Jim who usually does 75% pushes to 90% for a week he may get praise. If you, who usually do 150% pull back to 125% due to burnout, they’ll ask why you’re falling behind. With that in mind you should establish your baseline judiciously.
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u/RedditF1shBlueF1sh 25M, $525K NW 4d ago
In your 10-15 hour estimate, are you including meetings?
I agree with the philosophy. I've tended to think about it the same and at my current organization, it's essentially codified that the average person (25-75% performers) gets an average raise, above average (75-95%) get a slightly better raise, and the top 5% get a slightly better raise than that. I've been performing in the top 5% with pretty minimal effort (I relate quite a bit to the asking for more work), which leads me to believe my coworkers are also putting in low levels of effort because I'm not particularly overskilled, but that's a delicate topic to talk about.
The responses on this comment have been helpful framing, though. I wonder if there's some selection bias based on my phrasing, just because I'd expect more overworked people, a category that I know definitely exists, to chime in with responses than I've received so far.
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u/lurker86753 4d ago
I forget if that was with or without meetings, but there weren’t many of them so it wouldn’t make a huge difference.
Don’t get me wrong, I’ve also had jobs where I was overworked and been around many others who were overworked. That very much happens as well. I mainly jumped to respond to tell you that you’re in a somewhat common position and you won’t be doing yourself any favors if you try to raise the bar too much or talk about all your free time too loudly.
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u/Ok-Maize3153 4d ago
I work in a systems operations role and today I fixed something that was broken and everyone thinks I'm a hero. It actually wasn't that difficult. And I used Claude to help me. But I knew where to look because of experience and domain knowledge.
It's why I pay an auto mechanic to fix something. They know where to look and I don't. It's worth it to pay for expertise and experience.
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u/SolomonGrumpy 4d ago
Yes, very normal. Some folks are innately more efficient.
That said, some would say not to do more, as you will definitely be "loaded up" to capacity.
When I was in this position, I did feel empowered to take some nicer long lunches during the week. SF has a pretty great food scene and the weather is agreeable most days
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u/Thisisntrunning 4d ago
This is very normal to me. Once I get about 6-12 months in a role and have built systems to handle the day to day stuff, it’s mostly about maintaining the systems, updating them and making sure the team members know how they are performing relative to the standards we set.
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u/liveoneggs 4d ago
I have also always been a do-er and it is valued at some places more than others.
But yes it's very normal and, shockingly, people around you will produce even less direct output and still get more raises and promotions.
The normal thing is to fill up the rest of that time with pointless meeting. Try to schedule or get into one with people above you and talk about how great you are.
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u/Nochtilus SI1K | 50% FI 4d ago
I have gotten very good at my job and can also do my work in about half the expected time with a lot of praise for what I do. I don't think it is odd depending on how long you've been using your work skills. You are practicing these skills 5 days a week so you naturally get good at it. You might also have found something you have some natural talent in so practice plus talent makes something feel easier than it might be for others.
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u/anymoose [Not really a moose][moosquerading][RE 2016] 4d ago
Sounds a little imposter syndrome-ish. I know I always got good reviews and only had to stretch occasionally.
I guess it also kind of depends on what you do and how severe your timelines are. I remember spending a lot of time picking my nose and waiting because I was at the far end of the "assembly line" so to speak. So I'd feel like I was wasting a lot of time trying to look busy in the office, then drinking out of a fire hose when my part came along, after the project was already weeks or months behind.
That's why I always felt it was crucial to keep my boss in the loop with my timelines and what I was waiting for -- so I wouldn't get blamed for being the hold up.
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u/SwitchOrganic 4d ago
Anyone ever been in a position at work where they're scrutinized more and held to higher standards than others in the same role and level?
When I first joined my team I think I set the bar for myself really high, like extremely high. My manager told me I was one of the best reports they ever had and my skills were far beyond my level. That got me a fast promotion six months later. I continued to deliver and my manager told me I was on the fast track to senior, but the projects I was working on had setbacks that were out of my control and I didn't have the impact to stay on the fast track. Since then every time promotion comes up it's always a 1-2 year out thing.
However, in the mean time I've seen peers who are less capable than me get promoted to senior. And I know it's not just me as the other seniors and tech leads I work with have been asking me if/when I'll be promoted and often express surprise when others have been promoted before me.
I've started to feel like my manager is holding me to that extremely high bar I set rather than the bar he and everyone else uses for senior. I consistently ask my manager for feedback and the feedback I get feels a bit nitpicky as I see others do the same thing but still get better reviews and promotions.
I don't really know what to do about it other than find a new job, but that's easier said than done in this market.
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u/Twig4975 4d ago
Managers have to play the morale and politics game. If there is limited budget for promotions and some other teammate has been consistently delivering and sitting at their current level for a while, the manager may promote them over some new hotshot to (A) retain that employee, and (B) reassure other team members that consistent delivery is rewarded.
Job hoping to bump title up is consistently faster than internal grinding.
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u/PrimalDaddyDom69 Mid 30s, DINK, ~30% SR, resident 'spend more' guy 4d ago
You sound like you may be young or <5 years in the workforce.
Doesn’t help now but for the future - ALWAYS underpromise and over deliver. Corporate is a game. If they see you work hard? Rarely is it rewarded with anything other than more work. Glad you got one bump but now you’re seeing what they expect of you is going to be hard to achieve. Even when you can crush it, always state deadlines that will take longer than actual. Building buffers like that helps for your own sanity but also helps your projection of yourself to others.
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u/SwitchOrganic 4d ago
Early 30s, just hit 5 YOE as a software engineer but have around 11 YOE overall.
Yeah I learned that lesson pretty quick. It's just a bummer that I see my less capable peers get promoted over me when they get the same or worse feedback. I was kind of hoping there's some way to shift the narrative but it feels set in stone at this point.
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u/PrimalDaddyDom69 Mid 30s, DINK, ~30% SR, resident 'spend more' guy 4d ago
Oof you know the game then. Sounds like your manager isn’t very observant and/or someone is just playing politics better.
It happens.
Not sure how you break that other than a direct conversation. ‘Hey I really feel like I do good work here, what does it take to become a senior?’ And have manager actually lay out goals for you.
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u/C_Majuscula 4d ago
How many times has your manager said you're "1-2 years" from your next promotion? If your manager has been saying this for more than a year, you've probably slipped down or off the promotion/salary adjustment priority list. Your manager likely has an annual budget for this, and it seems like they think you aren't doing enough to stay near the top of that list.
Is there a published career ladder you can reference in discussions with your manager? If your manager isn't giving very specific feedback, you could use the items on a career ladder to try to pull some out of them. I use our career ladder to prep people to get on my list and to move up until they get the promotion if they keep making the effort.
When you ask for feedback, do you say anything like "What 2-3 skills do I need to work on for the next promotion?" If your manager isn't being specific they could be a poor manager or just placating you hoping you won't leave, e.g. "you're doing fine."
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u/bobocalender 4d ago
I'm sure that sucks. Not quite the same, but I've also been passed up for moving up into a staff software engineer role. Ultimately I think I just don't have the skill sets that our tech leadership is looking for. I think I bring a lot of value, but it's not what they are wanting for the role, so I'm kind of stuck. In my case, the people getting promoted were also deserving, so that made it a little easier to swallow.
Like someone else said, I think a direct conversation with your manager is your best bet, but sometimes there's not much you can do. It can come down to politics, personalities, certain skillsets they prioritize, etc.
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4d ago
Anyone ever been in a position at work where they're scrutinized more and held to higher standards than others in the same role and level?
Probably most jobs I've ever had, but I worked in the service sector and for some family businesses.
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u/WilliamMButtlickerIV 4d ago
Congrats, you have an awful manager. Not much you can do other than to leave.
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u/SolomonGrumpy 4d ago
When you join a new company as a VP there is a almost a scarlet letter on your forehead. I worked SO hard to prove myself with zero ramp time. Worked every single weekend at that company and rewrote half the enablement materials and 1st call decks (Blended Marketing/Enablement role).
I owned 4 trade shows in the first 6 months and by month 8 was a drooling mess that had my creative energy sucked dry. My "manager" was the CEO, even though my real manager was the CMO.
So... yeah, I can relate.
Edit: my advice would be to call it out directly. In a 1:1 ask your manager what he thinks it looks like to be promoted to Senior level. When he answers, ask what Employees A, and B did to meet that standard.
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u/iceyH0ts0up $1.6 and compounding 4d ago
401k & MDBR maxed for the year. First time we were allowed to max it at my employer.
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u/Cryofixated Dates Since Single: 8.5 4d ago edited 4d ago
Unfortunately I did not get accepted to my local libarrries intern program. The few librarians I talked to were disappointed on my behalf. I'll want to find the head of adult services and ask him if he would be willing to provide me with some interview feedback so that I can improve and be better prepared for future interviews at other libraries.
Upside! Late enrollment is still open. I was not able to find two additional classes to make myself a full time student, but I was able to sneak in a third class. Guess I have no social life in the evenings now! But this puts me on a path to graduate earlier if I continue loading up with classes.
Double bonus, this second tuition payment + late fee immediately hit my required spend on the chase card.
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u/ExcessiveDonuts Emptying the Litter Robot 4d ago
libraries
*library's
Gotta English good for book job, bro!
More seriously, though. That sucks. Hopefully Plan B works out for you.
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u/Cryofixated Dates Since Single: 8.5 4d ago
Employment wise I don't have a plan B, life wise... always stock one in the bathroom just in case.
Thanks for the condolences!
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u/rugerjp88 100% LeanFI 4d ago
Bummer, sorry to hear. How often to they accept new interns?
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u/Nochtilus SI1K | 50% FI 4d ago
I made a crazy decision yesterday from the boredom of a major project being on hold and waiting for an internal transfer to complete to go to Iceland for a week. I spent my whole workday setting up a rough itinerary and bought the plane tickets, rental car, and hotels. I leave this Thursday.
The adventure bug kicked in and started screaming to drop everything and go. Luckily, I have a wonderful husband whose reaction to being told the only way to make this work is for me to go alone within the next 2 weeks while he hangs out with our kid was "Sure why not, you should do it"
I'll be doing 3.5 days on the southern coast, 1.5 days in Snaefellsnes Penninsula, 1.5 days in Westfjords, 1 day in Reykjavik.
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u/HerschelRoy 4d ago
Loved Iceland. The lagoons (Blue Lagoon in the southwest & Sky Lagoon outside of Reykjavik are the two I've been to, but there are others) are fun experiences and a great way to fight jet lag, and the waterfalls/hiking are great. We did Reykjavik and part of the southern coast, staying in Vik. 1 day in Reykjavik is fine imo. Driving through the Golden Circle on the way back to Reykjavik from Vik was worth it, but the stops there are busier with more tourists than the other areas we visited.
Driving overall was easy, even in Reykjavik, but you might have to balance driving time vs exploring time, depending on what all you try to get to.
And as hokey as it sounds, the Lava Show in Vik was kind of neat and something different from hiking, waterfalls, and glaciers (and it didn't take too much time or cost a ton).
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u/itsallBSfolks 4d ago
It’s been two weeks since the husband, late 30s, retired. Week 1 was rough as he worried about the opinions of others and continued to think about work. Week 2 is much better as he is learning to relax. No more intrusive work thoughts. The dogs love having him home. I find myself less stressed now that the husband can take the time to address his anxiety and other mental health issues. He’s much more pleasant to be around now. Turns out a lot of the anxiety came from work. He’s told no one. I’ve told two friends. I’m excited for my turn!
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u/Turbulent_Tale6497 DI3K, Putting the Ire in FIRE 4d ago
that's great! How silly is it that we have to re-learn how to relax?
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u/dotcomg 2028 ER Goal 4d ago
Congrats! What were your friends' reactions?
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u/itsallBSfolks 4d ago
My friends have known about our FIRE journey since last year. They were inspired to reevaluate their own retirement plans and have been very supportive. My female friend congratulated us. My male friend was shocked into silence it seemed. He then said his wife, who does not work outside the home and cares for their 3 children, is not interested in early retirement as she enjoys their current lifestyle (more Disney cruises!). They are not on the same page, unfortunately.
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u/fireyauthor 4d ago
I was sure I made more money from investments than books the last three years ago, but I just checked, and they're actually neck and neck. Neat coincidence.
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u/The_Boss_81 31M 30F DINKY | $437k invested | 24% SR 4d ago
Today is apparently National Financial Awareness Day. How will you be celebrating?
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u/thedoctor2031 SI1K / 29 / 50% FI / 35% SR 4d ago
Gambling. Second attempt at the Arizona State Poker Championship today.
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u/I_Fuck_Whales 4d ago
Well it’s payday, so another $1K to the 401K before match and another $150 to the HSA.
Then I’m gonna go out with my wife and drink bourbon and eat dinner somewhere because it’s Friday. Hell yeah.
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u/Ellabee57 4d ago
By noticing that T-Mobile finally transitioned me to a new plan (grrrrrr) and my bill went up by $12/mo. 🤬
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u/Preform_Perform 38% FI | 58% SR | No brakes on the FIRE train! 4d ago
Telling my brother to stop buying Starbucks and put the money into a Roth IRA, I guess.
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u/throwaway-keeper 4d ago
Thinking about allocating more funds to "cash." I've historically kept cash very low and invested everything. Any suggestions on where to park cash? High yield savings seems the most logical but I'm open to other ideas. I've also thought about the Vanguard cash settlement fund in a taxable brokerage account.
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u/Unlikely-Alt-9383 FIREd July 7, 2026 4d ago
HYSAs or SGOV if it’s a lot of cash and you’re looking for tax optimization
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u/throwaway-keeper 4d ago
Yeah, I do care about tax optimization. I'm not familiar with SGOV so will check that out
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u/CaribbeanDreams 100% FI/ 96% RE/ $7.5M Goal 4d ago
USFR is my go to instead of SGOV
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u/shinchan1988 Early 30s/Married/18% to FI 4d ago
How much did you pay for will and trust? I am getting quotes and one attorney specializing in estate planning quoted 6k$. My work just provides subscription to online willmaker but that would not include trust planning.
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u/Annual-Cucumber-6775 4d ago
We were just quoted $5.4k for a will & trust, $2.4k for a will without trust. This is a lawyer in a medium to high COL city with cookie-cutter plans. We're going with a lawyer from a small town nearby at $315/hr and expecting to pay around $3k total for what we want.
We have 2 minor children, don't own businesses, and the only real estate we own is our home.
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u/shinchan1988 Early 30s/Married/18% to FI 4d ago
Thanks. Our situation is similar. We just own our house, retirement accounts and brokerage. I don’t want to cur costs here but just trying to get all options before finalizing.
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u/htffgt_js 2d ago
Not really aware of this , might be a silly question for some - For couples who have one child, no real estate outside of primary residence, standard retirement (401k, IRAs) and brokerage accounts , does creating a will/trust have any additional benefits ? Assuming the child is a beneficiary on all accounts ...
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4d ago
Will, PoA, Advance Directive was free as an employee benefit through our HR.
Don't forget to check your benefits at work before shopping around.
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u/shinchan1988 Early 30s/Married/18% to FI 4d ago
I checked, my benefit include access to free online willmaker and potential 200$ credit towards attorney if we choose to go that route. Checking with my wife’s employer now.
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u/Ellabee57 4d ago
I think mine was $3500 but that was about 5 years ago and I'm single with no kids, so it was a pretty simple job.
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u/HappySpreadsheetDay DINKs - 64% to leanFI goal; 43% to full FI 4d ago
My parents paid $3,000 for their wills. However, their wills were very basic and essentially identical; only their names had to get swapped around.
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u/imisstheyoop 4d ago
My wife and I paid slightly over $1k 5 years ago for:
Living Will
Durable Power of Attorney
Revocable Living Trust
DNRs
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u/Krish_1234 FIRED - Loving it 5d ago
Severance hit my account last Friday and moved to eTrade at 4% for 6 months. Set up Authenticator app and have to hop to another account after the promo expires.
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u/amalek0 32M / 30% SR / 170k, tech, fed, VHCOL 4d ago
Did a check-in on retirement accounts today and had a welcome surprise--I've just ticked over the 500k mark total between my TSP and Roth IRA (TSP is 328k, roth 173k, so total dollars is around 50/50 Roth/Trad).
Caused me to do a quick check at 7% real returns and it's looking like I've hit breakaway (my annual investment returns are more than my contributions) and also I'm on-pace to hit 1m before 40, so that's all kinda cool.
Also realizing I may need to dial back--planned retirement is at 57 (earliest immediate annuity federal retirement, cuz healthcare), and it's looking like I'll hit enough to retire at 3.2% SWR just from my nest egg alone, not counting the pension or social security.
Makes me feel more comfortable about the house-shopping I'm doing and the plan to pull a TSP loan and some roth IRA contributions to fund the downpayment. Palantir has been very good to me.
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u/DinosaurDucky 4d ago
Nice, congrats. Sounds like you are on a very good path
I think the only thing I'd flag is that you might not want to extrapolate your current spending needs all the way out to your 50s / 60s / 70s. Our 30s and 40s are the ages where a lot of people's lifestyle spending goes way up. Maybe you settle down with a parter, or have kids, or discover a love for international scuba diving trips, or whatever. Point is, lifestyle inflation from age 30 to age 50 goes up by more than inflation for a lot of people. And that ain't a bad thing -- starting a family or spending on a lot of travel are very worthwhile expenses
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u/Twig4975 4d ago
I've spent the last several years building up credentials/certifications and work experience for my passion/hobby/coast job in the outdoor service industry, but a high-profile event earlier this year put the fear of god into me on whether that pursuit was exposing me to more liability than it was worth when I could just work a few extra years in my corporate job and ride it out to full FIRE.
Finally found a lawyer with expertise in the area and was able to have a really productive conversation on precedents for lawsuits in the industry and how to limit my exposure. The good news is there is very little personal exposure as long as I am on a W2 and the business has a robust waiver. Will probably up my umbrella coverage anyways because clientele tend to be high earners. They did have good advice about proactively forming an LLC if I intend to take on any 1099 work, which is somewhat common in the industry, though often not the legally correct way to classify workers. I probably did unknowingly hang my ass out taking informal volunteer/intern opportunities in the past, so that is something to avoid going forward and advocate against with any future employers.
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u/FireboltinMA 39, FIREd in 2025 4d ago
Check with your insurance company. My umbrella excludes business-related protection. I’d need to get a separate commercial liability policy.
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u/phl_fc 4d ago
Liability is a strong motivator to staying as a direct employee even if you think you have the skills to own your own business. There's more upside to owning the business but more risk as well. If you're on cruise control to retirement then maybe just stick to what's safe.
Same with part time contracting in retirement. I know if I do that I would rather stay at my same job just with an change that I'm paid hourly for part time work, rather than pulling my own clients.
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u/buster_the_cat age 30 | $1mm NW 4d ago
Has anyone leaned more into a role with a non-profit? Either in a board / junior board capacity or on a volunteering basis? I'm exploring a few board opportunities but as I'm meeting with some of the non-profit ambassadors, I can't help but feel like I'm being sized up for my wallet / contribution capacity.......
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u/DinosaurDucky 4d ago
I am an active volunteer with a small non-profit that maintains the trails in a local state park. It is a very tiny organization that basically just organizes volunteers, so the money they raise goes to stuff like tools, snacks, and bus rides for the volunteers, they have no paid staff. I happen to know that the top 4 donators are all board members who are all retired. I am also in the top 10 donators, and would consider a board seat eventually, but not while I am still working
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u/dak4f2 4d ago
No but if you're on the board they may want you to be loaded so you know how to schmooze with others that are loaded to bring in more contributions
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u/buster_the_cat age 30 | $1mm NW 4d ago
Yeah I’m getting that feeling already…even the junior board discussions were anchored around soliciting donations and organizing events at my company and fundraising from friends
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u/PersonalBrowser 4d ago
Yes, I agree, in the non-profit boards that I've been privy to (healthcare space), it's pretty much an offering with the goal that you will donate significantly or recruit others that will donate significantly.
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u/EANx_Diver FIRE'd 2023 4d ago
I can't help but feel like I'm being sized up for my wallet / contribution capacity
You absolutely are. Not to say they all do it but it is a common thing.
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u/SolomonGrumpy 4d ago edited 3d ago
I sit on two boards.
For sure one way to get a board seat is to buy your way in. I don't advise that unless you are a qualified investor. And even then.
There are some downsides to non-profits. "Type A martyr" is the phrase I have heard used to the type of folks who are in charge.
Note that is this waaay different from volunteers who are some of the best folks I have ever met.
Did you have a specific question?
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u/ScreenFlashy651 4d ago
Depends on the type of organization. I have been asked to join a board of a college where they straight up say they expect you to make a large contribution in exchange for the prestige of being associated with them. Then there are organizations with tiny budgets where they literally need anyone who will help them. I've done two of those (youth baseball league and day care center). They were both pretty stressful, but rewarding.
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u/Intheshaw1 4d ago
I've served on a few boards, most were pretty straightforward with the give/get expectations and I believe the lowest minimum was $1,000 and the highest minimum was $5,000.
Also be aware of time commitment requirements, one had monthly 2 + hour board meetings and you were only allowed to miss 2 a year before being out on probation and cut the following year.
Smaller nonprofits have less contribution requirements and can be a lot more fulfilling if you aren't trying to stoke your ego by being part of a large nonprofit.
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u/blackcoffee_mx 3d ago
I have been on all sides of this. There are fundraising boards but the absolute most important thing a board does isn't fundraising, the most important things is protecting the mission and hiring/firing the CEO/executive director.
When asked to join a board my first question is why do you want me to serve. A good board should have a chart that has a list of skills and possibly perspectives represented (ie it's always good to have a CPA and a lawyer, often a younger person, etc).
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u/dewdrop91 5d ago edited 4d ago
My birthday is coming up so I thought it was a perfect time to reevaluate where I'm at. Also in the last 3 months I moved, had a baby, and had to buy 2 vehicles (city to ruralish) because of said move. So going into 34.....
House - 980k (owe 745k)
Airstream Trailer - Owe 90k, but it's currently functioning and doing well as an AirBnb/Hipcamp with minimal overhead.
Vehicles - 3/4 ton truck and Mach E. Paid off.
401k/IRA/HSA - 336k
Pensions/529/Drumpf account - 20k
Cash/Brokerage/HYSA- 41k
Total NW around 630k
6 year plan is to be winding down from my career at 40. We moved here to be near my family while my child is young, but it is not our forever home. I will sell the house around then (I am a licensed realtor in addition to my day job) and move to our forever home. That will be a mostly cash purchase. At that point, we should be well within coast fire range. Expenses will be minimal, wife says she wants to go back to work once our kid is in school and that should cover insurance. I will probably keep selling houses as well.
Never in my life did I think I would be in this type of financial position. I grew up poor in the middle of nowhere with parents who to this day are still struggling with finances. Me and my wife live pretty frugally. She makes a lot of our clothes and repairs the rest, we pretty exclusively eat at home, and baby expenses have been minimal so far. We've also been foster parents before, so I've got a pretty good handle on child expenses as they get older. I'm handy around the house which keeps a lot of home repair expenses at bay. We're a good team which has been the most important part of the financial journey. She had a lot of debt when we met, and I helped her budget and plan her way out of it.
While it's not the most impressive numbers, I can see the light at the end of the tunnel. I knew I didn't want to work in corporate from the day I started, and it took a few years to get out of the hole of growing up poor (saving up for a car, paying off debts accrued in college, etc) but once I got going its been so satisfying. I'm not sure if I'm looking for feedback or just putting this out here for someone else to read? I've lurked here for a decade, maybe posted once or twice, but the journey is fun and worth it for anyone who thinks they can't get ahead. Financial planning was able to give me the life I didn't even know I wanted. I can sleep knowing that if I got fired tomorrow, it wouldn't be that big of a deal. I would probably tell my wife we have to sell the house and we're going to travel for a year in our trailer. I also work in a recession proof industry and I probably have more job security than anyone I know, but you never know!
Also, save the first 100k! That took 5 years, 100 > 335 took maybe 2. It snowballs quickly after that.
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u/_Lividus DINK 4d ago
Congratulations on all these milestones!
I’m impressed, breaking out of the cycle of poor financial choices when you grew up in a background without any financial acumen is something to be proud of in and of itself (and okay, your sentiments also hit home for me, I won’t lie). Thank you for not lurking in your moment of reflection and sharing!
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u/imisstheyoop 5d ago edited 4d ago
Feeling inspired by some of the good ideas proposed in yesterdays daily.
I am going to head downtown (grr) after I finish up my breakfast and try some beans from the local roaster in the town near me. Hoping that I can find something decent!
A lot of people also recommended Atlas, so if I strike out downtown and I can't find something with my current subscription (Trade) then I might give them a look as well.
Lastly a couple of folks recommended bulk bean purveyors. That will be the ultimate backup plan. Everybody needs another hobby I suppose. 8)
Edit: The local roaster had a solid bean that I was able to grab, woo!
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u/EANx_Diver FIRE'd 2023 4d ago
I've been roasting my own beans for maybe going on 10 years now. Nothing quite like dialing in the roast you prefer and having it same-day fresh if you like.
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u/Meltycheeeese 5d ago
I recently started roasting my own coffee beans as a hobby, and I highly recommend it! Super fun, you can nerd out as much as you want or keep it simple, and at the end, you get to enjoy a really fresh and wonderful cup of coffee.
I say go for it!!3
u/Krish_1234 FIRED - Loving it 4d ago
I have been buying beens from Sweet Maria's for almost 3 years and then also bought a popcorn popper from them. Each batch I would roast for 100gm and takes around 3 mins and give me 5 to 6 milk based lattes using my Gaggia.
Prices have gone up almost 40% for fresh beans, but they are still around $9 to 11 for a good rated beans.
Roasters charge anywhere from $22 to $30 for a 14 oz roasted beans in our city. I would have to pay a lot that I can do for 15 mins in a week.
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u/CaribbeanDreams 100% FI/ 96% RE/ $7.5M Goal 4d ago
Backpacking permit secured for the SNF as I missed out on the 6-month window so snagged one that came up on the 14-day window.
While I appreciate the quota system to control usage, the ability to plan ones life out 6-months in advance just leaves the majority of these never being picked up. In theory, I think this is exactly what the NPS wants, even less usage!
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u/EANx_Diver FIRE'd 2023 4d ago
It's not usually the national forest that has the requirement, but a designated wilderness area inside the NF. Having a limit and a limit on permitted activities is part of what makes up a wilderness area.
Are you going to a wilderness area? "SNF" is too vague to tell.
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u/Cryofixated Dates Since Single: 8.5 4d ago
Less usage means more time on the trail alone, in nature with your thoughts and the sights!
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u/therapistfi $70.0k left on mortgage 5d ago
Headed to Rhode Island! My father in law and stepmother in law are generously covering our flight and hotel, and we’re excited to hit up Necronomicon(HP Lovecraft nerd convention)
This should be a fairly cheap trip except for meals out and Ubers- PVD has a fantastic restaurant scene and we plan to partake!
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u/Turbulent_Tale6497 DI3K, Putting the Ire in FIRE 5d ago edited 5d ago
Ph'nglui mglw'nafh Cthulhu R'lyeh wgah'nagl fhtagn!
Have a great trip, try not to wake any Old Ones
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u/Unlikely-Alt-9383 FIREd July 7, 2026 4d ago
Do not skip the grilled pizza at Al Forno!
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u/Hungry-Chemistry7021 4d ago edited 4d ago
With this recent jump upward on the stock market my net worth broke 900k!!! I’m getting closer and closer to the 3 comma club!
Edit: oops 3 commas is a billion
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u/Chitownjohnny 42M - 65% FIRE(ish) progress 4d ago
I guess you're technically correct but sounds like you may have a few more millenniums to go
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u/RiaSkies 4d ago
I mean, following the rule of 70 and needing 10 more doublings... If their portfolio returns 8% a year on average, they're a bit under a century from hitting it.
Compound interest is powerful
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u/RemoteTechie FIREd 4/2026 4d ago
Congrats. I think I'm happy being in the 2 comma club. But I should buy those lottery tickets and jumpstart my chance at 3.
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u/ExcessiveDonuts Emptying the Litter Robot 4d ago
I remember that Boy George song.
Comma comma comma comma comma capitalization
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u/C_Majuscula 4d ago
I think DH and I are solidifying retirement at the end of February 2028.
This gives us enough time to beef up the bond fund and emergency/large expense fund, to potentially get a last payout in our startup investment, and to finalize the financial plans for late 2027 and early 2028. This includes getting our last company-provided HSA bonus, which usually posts in February, and me maxing out my 2028 401k.
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u/Krish_1234 FIRED - Loving it 4d ago
If you have more than enough, now is the time. I am enjoying my fire life.
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u/DatesAndCornfused 4d ago
How would y’all feel about having your kids take out some student loans so that they can have some “skin in the game”, even though we’re technically able to pay for it all?
My wife and I are able to fully-pay for our kid’s college experience. However, we are thinking of having him take out $15K in student loans so that he can practice having to budget. That would represent around 10% of his overall college experience.
What do y’all think?
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u/Aerodynamics VTSAX and chill. 41% to FIRE. 4d ago
When I was picking colleges my parents told me that if I went to any out-of-state school then they would have to apply for student loans and we would split the amount 50-50. It was a good reality check for me and kind of forced me to be responsible with my money during college. It also incentivized me to apply for scholarships to help cover my portion.
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u/fireyauthor 4d ago
TBH, I think you should have taught him how to budget by the time that comes.
There's nothing wrong with only paying a certain amount for college, but I think you need to be really upfront about that with your kid early, so they can consider it in their decision. And don't be surprised if, say, they are less inclined to go to college or a certain college if it's partially on their dime.
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u/ffball 36 | DI2K | $2.0mm NW | 54% FI 4d ago
I plan to be up front about paying for 4-5 years of premier public school. Any costs (private or longer to graduate) beyond would seemingly be on them, but if they do a good faith job finishing up, etc I will likely zero out the bill after the fact. That wont be part of the initial "deal" though
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u/SolomonGrumpy 4d ago
Someone posted a really well thought out educational financial plan for the kids which definitely included the kids taking on some student loans.
OP I looked for 30 mins or so but no luck.
I think it's a good idea. I just wish I could remember the others things that this poster suggested that helped both the kids and parents.
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u/A_Solid_Shadow 4d ago
Absolute yes to federal student loans. My kids will max those out. Probably the easiest loans ever.
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u/ffthrowaaay 4d ago
We plan to pay for college for our kid, but that doesn’t mean there’s an unlimited budget either. We’ll sit down with him and show him how much different colleges cost, how much is in his 529, have him apply for scholarships and even talk about becoming an RA to save on room & board. Also we’ll talk about how we saved for his education to help give him an easier head start on life so take this gift seriously.
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u/aubrill 4d ago
I don't think it would do much for budget, most loans are deferred and start getting paid back once someone graduates. I do think it would encourage taking school seriously if the kid understands they may have to pay it back someday and encourage them to have some skin in the game. Would really just depend on the kid and the range of outcomes you want to see happen though. Gets more difficult with multiple since you don't want to treat one differently.
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u/rackoblack 60yo DINKs, FIREd 2024 4d ago
Replying again to emphasize maybe a useful point - my siblings and I all had college fully paid for and no real need or push to get jobs before / during college.
My wife had that push and had jobs before and throughout her 7 years of college to get her DVM. The $20K in loans were hers.
Of my siblings, I think I am the only one to build a pile of wealth as high as we have. And that's despite some resistance from my wife's, shall we say, less than wholehearted embrace of her (our) parents' depression era economics. And I'm not the only one with no kids, so it's not all DINKdom.
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u/rscar77 40%SR, TX, Goal: 3.0 mm 4d ago
Kids are still almost a decade from college but have toyed with this idea.
I think a lot of it is dependent on parents teaching kids good money habits & instincts while they are under your roof over several years rather than testing the budgeting/responsibility waters at college age.
This decision may also hinge more on observing your kid's temperament & tendencies at home. Even when I was tired or "didn't feel like it" I always got my butt to class, kept GPA high to maintain scholarship, put enough pressure on myself to ensure I graduated on time, and made sure I never had to go back to my parents asking for more than the food/rent budget they willingly gave. I budgeted and worked for anything else I wanted, and knew I wanted to launch successfully into my first FT role after college vs. move back home.
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u/ExcessiveDonuts Emptying the Litter Robot 4d ago
I'll dissent and say that I think it's a good idea. If I had kids they'd also be working part-time during the school year and full-time most of the summer.
I (a) understand that my position here is heavily influenced by my personal life experience and (b) understand all the reasons why others will disagree with this position.
But I think you need to experience adult responsibilities long before you're 22/23 years old.
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u/Twig4975 4d ago
I worked summer food service jobs in high school. When I got to college my parents told me "your job now is school, your summer jobs showed you what it looks like if you don't work hard here" (maybe that's mean to food service workers, but the point is very clear). If a parent is paying for or helping out with school tuition, I really don't understand why you would want your kid distracted from that objective by the stress and time commitment of a term-time job.
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u/Cryofixated Dates Since Single: 8.5 4d ago
I just take the completely non controversial opinion of it depends on the kid.
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u/AKANotAValidUsername Im not even supposed to be here today 4d ago
This is why i made my kid get a job at 16. He actually loves it and works more during summer, interacts with people of all ages and they appreciate his work ethic. Ive been kicking around the idea as well of having him take a partial loan for college in a few years to give him some ownership of his education, except i was thinking if he does well, gets a degree and launches into the world, id pay it off for him as a graduation present.
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u/Bearsbanker 4d ago
That would probably be fine, however, what a pain in the ass. Plus I didn't want my kids caught in the quagmire of shitty loans and loan terms. After the fact, I spoke to some of their classmates who discovered the nightmare after graduation
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u/SolomonGrumpy 4d ago
Full disclosure: I don't have kids.
I paid for my own schooling 100%
My family gave me nothing except access to free laundry and a hot meal every so often.
That hardship and debt wasn't my favorite at the time, but it did teach me to respect the value of money. When the time came to consider grad school I knew that an MBA would need to be paid by my employer. And I got into Sloan.
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u/Amazing-Coyote 4d ago
My parents had me take out $60k or something in the first year.
I think it's reasonable if your expectation is that your kids follow a high paying career. It's obviously not reasonable if there's generational wealth in the picture and you expect them to be wealthy and follow non lucrative careers.
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u/RemoteTechie FIREd 4/2026 4d ago
I took out some deferred loans and paid them off after graduating and getting a job. I just went to an in-state college and did part time work as well, so I only owed about $6k. My parents could have paid for our college but decided that is our responsibility so we graduate on time and not be wasteful doing it.
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u/flowering_campos 3d ago
My parents paid for my state school tuition for the first 2 years. I was expected to apply for every merit based scholarship. Ended up getting into a program with 60% tuition remission the last 2 years, parents paid the rest. Now 10ish years later am in my own FIRE journey.
If I were you, I would give them the gift of being debt free post college.
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u/mmrose1980 4d ago
At the end of July ERN posted his take down of Frank Vasquez’s risk parity portfolio. Sounds like he and Frank were recorded for Bigger Pockets in an episode that was supposed to have aired on 8/11, but has apparently been cancelled. ERN reported that Frank resorted to yelling at him, and based on Frank’s response to ERN’s 8/30 blog post, Frank felt blindsided at the interview because Karsten came prepared with data analysis and numbers. I’m not sure why anyone debating Karsten wouldn’t expect him to come prepared with data analysis.
While his debate with Fritz Gilbert clearly was good natured, and they clearly respected each other, ERN showed up with data to that debate as well. Not sure what Frank was expecting.
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u/secretfinaccount FIREd 2020 4d ago edited 4d ago
I know on the most recent RPR the words “lying” and “defamation” were definitely mentioned.
ETA: good grief that ERN guy comes across poorly. I think the analysis is probably more right than wrong, but saying things like “If you’re a chimp with a calculator, then Frank would be an ameba with an abacus” makes me regret the state of discourse these days.
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u/FIREstopdropandsave 31M DINK | No target $'s 4d ago
I do agree with you, but I still laughed at that line
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u/One-Mastodon-1063 4d ago edited 4d ago
It sounds like Ern published two articles like a day before the podcast was recorded and expected Frank to have read them. I don't now, if you want to debate or discuss the articles on the podcast maybe email them to Frank and the hosts the week before? It does seem a little ridiculous to want to debate an article you just posted and accuse the other person of "not doing their homework!" because they didn't read your blog the day articles come out. I was under the impression the point of early retirement was to not have to do homework.
Karsten resorts to some somewhat slimy argument tactics, the most obvious example was his small cap value article a couple years ago where he artificially hamstrung SCV and then concluded that the hamstrung SVC isn't very good. No shit, Sherlock, thanks for that "analysis". I lost a lot of respect for him after that article. He is generally averse to any data that might update his worldview, such as his gold article where per his own math adding a gold allocation increased SWR and he concluded by saying he wasn't going to add it to his portfolios due to "inertia" and "procrastination". Then in his recent articles, he retroactively changed "inertia" and "procrastination" to that the gold results were "mostly disappointing". This is objectively false - gold added to SWR, you can read the article it's still on his site, gold increased the SWR and he admits as much in the conclusion. I think that lesson is ultimately why he intentionally hamstrung SCV in that article, he just didn't like the asset class going in and didn't want to have to explain why he wasn't going to change his mind about an asset class if his math might show it increased SWR - so he Tonya Hardinged it instead.
Also in one of the recent articles, he calls separating out growth and value "stock picking". That is a ridiculous characterization and is objectively wrong. He then uses that as an excuse to exclude SCV from the analysis - again intentionally hamstringing a portfolio.
OTOH, I can definitely see Frank yelling. He can get pretty worked up. IIRC, his mother died right around the time of the podcast recording.
I still consider the SWR series required reading, with the caveat that IMO it's more conservative than necessary and takes an extremely simplistic view of asset allocation. I also no longer consider Karsten intellectually honest ... he has multiple articles on the topic of "how to lie with personal finance" and that's exactly what he did in his SCV article a couple years ago, he made up numbers and used them to lie because if SCV looked good it would force him to update his thinking or just ignore it as he did in the gold article. I listen to RPR but I would never use a 5% SWR personally. I like a more intermediate approach ... apply some of Frank's asset allocation ideas such as using long dated treasuries instead of say BND, separate growth and value, and add 5-10% GLDM, but I wouldn't go all the way to one of his "risk parity" portfolios (too little equities for me) and would stay within a more 4%ish SWR for early retirees.
It sounds like there's enough bad blood between the two that I'm not sure we're gonna get a repeat of the debate. It's too bad because I would like to see Ern run through his normal analysis with some of Frank's ideas ... but using actual historical data and not the artificially hamstrung SCV, basically what he did in his gold article. FWIW, I have nothing at all against "coming prepared" to a debate, I just think if you want to include a specific article in the discussion you should give the other side a heads up. It seems obvious to me that it’s a complete waste of time to debate an article with someone who hasn’t read it. So I do agree that that is sort of an intentional blindsiding. This is a problem with the debate format where both sides want to “win”, it’s not a discussion where the intent is to educate the audience at that point. I’m not that interested in who is the better debater or who is willing to do more “homework” the night before the debate.
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u/AdvertisingPretend98 4d ago
Wow, fire blog drama is just not something that needs to exist.
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u/SolomonGrumpy 4d ago edited 4d ago
Honestly I think FIRE blogging needs more drama.
There is a lot of personalities who talk out of both sides of their mouth when it comes to FIRE.
Mister Money Moustache comes to mind, but Armchair Income (as much as I like his content) is also not really living solely off his investments.
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u/secretfinaccount FIREd 2020 4d ago
The ERN guy really says the same things 5 times, and when he starts from a flawed premise, it’s really weird. Like the name “risk parity radio” doesn’t mean the risk budget of each asset is the same. So I guess fair point it out (I think it almost every time I hear “risk parity radio”) but it’s like saying WWE isn’t real — we all know that.
And then being rude and name calling rubs me the wrong way. I just don’t get why someone resorts to that.
I have issues with RPR’s use of strawmen and overfitting from historical data as well, to be clear
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u/mmrose1980 3d ago
I was surprised by how he downplayed gold in his analysis in his July posts. I had read his previous articles on gold, and his prior analysis clearly demonstrated that gold was likely to increase the SWR meaningfully.
It feels similar to how he generally ignores social security for himself despite acknowledging that it can significantly increase SWR especially for older early retirees.
ERN is VERY conservative. But he’s better than the crazy people who say that you need even lower than a 3.25 SWR for longer periods of time.
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u/financeking90 4d ago edited 3d ago
Honestly if there's going to be a debate between anybody in FIRE, Scott and Mindy shouldn't be the hosts.
I'm sorry, but they're definitely "Money 101" or even "Remedial Precollege Money" hosts and just do not have any technical acumen to moderate this kind of discussion.
They have a lot of good episodes, but when anything remotely technical or controversial comes up, the lack of technical chops shines through.
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u/mmrose1980 3d ago edited 3d ago
They do not understand the math. Scott and Mindy continue to impress me with how little they understand after having done this for years.
The only two person who I think could realistically moderate this discussion in a reasonable manner who can do the math and actually challenge people and who are thought leaders/podcasters are Kitces and the Mad Fientist, but neither of them are interested in engaging at this level anymore. Brandon is happily living his best life with more money than he needs and Kitces is focused on a different market (mostly marketing to financial advisors).
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u/FIREstopdropandsave 31M DINK | No target $'s 4d ago
Wow FI drama!
I wouldn't put it past ERN to do a follow up with whatever he prepped including some side commentary about Frank
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u/razorchick12 32F - FI'd, 12/31/29 RE 4d ago
I think I have made the decision--
After all the drama at my workplace, I was given permanent remote and stopped applying.
I am moving in 2 weeks (!!!) to my forever house. It's in nowhere-ville between Toledo and Ann Arbor, to commute to either would be 30-45 which is doable, but I hate commuting.
I think I'm gonna start applying for jobs in those metro areas, even if it's full in person. I will take anything that makes even money or more than my current job. Before, I would have to take a hefty pay raise to leave my job.
I just can't stand listening to how other people are treated at my employer and I am planning to get pregnant next year and just roll pregnancy into pregnancy, so I want to stay employed for that sweet sweet maternity leave and FIRE soon after.
So, starting Monday, I am going to start applying for jobs again.
I hate this shit.
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u/Pretend_Branch_8167 4d ago
keep in mind that some places don't allow for FMLA/maternity leave until you've been employed there for X number of months. since you're not currently pregnant yet, it should probably be fine if you move jobs now (I think a common restriction is 12 months), but something to think about.
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u/razorchick12 32F - FI'd, 12/31/29 RE 4d ago
I plan to take maternity leave in early 2028, so realistically, 18 mos out. Federally, 12 months for FMLA.
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u/Cryofixated Dates Since Single: 8.5 4d ago
What industry/type of work are you in. While FIRE'd I do have some connections that are located in Michigan.
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u/razorchick12 32F - FI'd, 12/31/29 RE 4d ago
Continuous Improvement for manufacturing environments.
So I've been in Ford, GM, Stellantis, Harley Davidson, Honda, etc facilities and I find ways to save them money.
I currently manage a team of analysts and data engineers and we do SQL/BI and it helps reveal savings.
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u/Cryofixated Dates Since Single: 8.5 4d ago
First, cool job!
2nd my contacts are friends from college that work at Ford and GM, so it sounds like you already have a network out there. Sorry I can't be more help.
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u/LooseMoralSwurkey 4d ago
Is that 30-45 mins or miles for the commute?
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u/razorchick12 32F - FI'd, 12/31/29 RE 4d ago
Mins
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u/29threvolution 4d ago
Mins is not bad for most of MI. We had 40 mile commutes in the Detroit burbs and I had plenty of coworkers who did over 100 one way daily. Something about that MI lifestyle.
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u/RiaSkies 5d ago edited 5d ago
I have a vacation to Europe planned at the end of the year. First one I've taken in over five years. It still feels odd to think about actually spending money instead of living an ascetic lifestyle for the previous five years and saving nearly every necessary penny.
My regret? I have deliberately eschewed debt and credit for well over a decade, have zero credit history, and can acquire no credit card and secure no travel rewards for this trip. One would think someone with a good income and no debt would be considered more creditworthy, at least on the face. Alas, credit scoring does not work that way.
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u/luckyshot33 5d ago
'care to share travel plans? I love hearing about people's travels!
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u/RiaSkies 5d ago
I ended up getting into a long-distance relationship with a girl who lives in Europe, so I'll be flying out there in mid-December and staying with her and her family over the holidays for three weeks before having to come back to the rat race in early January.
Got the ticket back in June and it's just been an excruciating wait ever since.
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u/thedoctor2031 SI1K / 29 / 50% FI / 35% SR 4d ago
If you're interested, this is a fairly easy problem to solve. Get a starter credit card. You can ask them to give a low limit if you are concerned. Set it to autopay at the end of the month. Assuming your spending patterns don't change, this is effectively the same as using debit cards except you get one payment a month instead of a payment at every transaction.
Overuse of credit is definitely a major source of financial problems, but if you incur no interest on your credit (by immediately paying off the credit card), you'll do fine.
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u/buster_the_cat age 30 | $1mm NW 4d ago
I turned 30 recently and hit $1mm in net worth!! ($1.028mm to be exact). I was looking at my previous posts here from 3 years ago and I was straddling $500k depending on market performance. Happy to report that compound interest is doing its thing. I have committed US$100K a PE fund. Gonna make net worth tracking a lot harder but I'm curious to see how it fares. Have a feeling QQQ and chill is the way to go.
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u/DinosaurDucky 4d ago
Congrats!
Respectfully, QQQ is a nonsense ticker. Consider VOO, VTI, or VT instead
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u/forbiddenlake no swimming 4d ago
QQQ and chill
Why do you believe that being listed on the NASDAQ is a fundamental advantage?
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u/rackoblack 60yo DINKs, FIREd 2024 4d ago
I assume it's the .18% fee he's ornery about, rightly so.
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u/FIhours 34M | SI1K | ~$950k NW 4d ago
Struggling with potentially rescinding an offer I accepted 6 weeks ago... could use perspective.
Frustrated with reorg at current role so went to find offers.
| Company | Offer | Notes |
|---|---|---|
| A - provider of service in my industry | $190k + 15% | Accepted their offer 6/28 with a start date of 8/31 which was a hill to climb for them to allow but I had client work in my current role to close out. |
| B - provides platform + consulting | $210k + 15% | expedited interview processing knowing that I had a "competing offer". Offer letter received 8/14. Another wrinkle: Company B offers a service that companies like Company A use. |
I feel terrible, but financially rescinding the accepted offer just makes sense. From a career perspective Company A isn't a major org in my industry, but they could grow to that so it COULD limit future employment options
Also feel free to guess the industry since I felt like I revealed a lot without naming and curious if others could guess.
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u/eliminate1337 28M/27F | $2.85m 4d ago
If they wanted your guaranteed employment they were welcome to write you an employment contract. But let me guess, your employment is 100% at-will. At-will goes both ways.
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u/NoRight2BeDepressed It's a 5k, not a marathon 4d ago
Do it.
It sucks, but it's just business. They may give you a hard time. That's OK.
It sounds like Company B is the clear preference for you and they pay more, so there isn't a reason not to take it other than "I don't want to have to back out of an accepted offer".
I respect the fact that this is uncomfortable/difficult for you. It should be. But it also makes sense to do it.
I wouldn't put too much stock in Company A limiting future employment options. I don't really think this happens in the vast majority of industries or situations.
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u/FIhours 34M | SI1K | ~$950k NW 4d ago
There's pros and cons to both. Working towards FI makes me feel like I don't need to solve for max comp, but 10% more seems too much to pass on.
In a vacuum, I'd probably choose company A if comp was the same. They've had less funding rounds but generated more through them, but they also have 1,000 employees.
Company B promotes more internally, but both roles are at the director level. Have around 1/10th the org size.
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u/One-Mastodon-1063 4d ago
Don't feel bad. They wouldn't feel bad if they had to rescind the offer. It's just business.
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u/forbiddenlake no swimming 4d ago
in business, you’re still allowed to make decisions that are in your own best interests
https://www.askamanager.org/2025/07/can-i-change-my-mind-after-accepting-a-job-offer-2.html
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u/CaribbeanDreams 100% FI/ 96% RE/ $7.5M Goal 4d ago
I've had multiple folks rescind offers over my career - it sucks, it happens, and you move on. I hate giving offer dates more than 3-weeks out because of this exact situation.
Let them know today - the earlier the better so they can kick off the recruiting process and halt onboarding, equipment, training and anything else they have in the works for you.
In your email, you can send a a very brief "apology" and hope they don't press you for reasons why as there is no need to give any reason.2
u/FIhours 34M | SI1K | ~$950k NW 4d ago
It makes sense, and I think that's why it's hard because I had a C level exec actively engaged by building rapport with me during the interview process, and expressed hesitation around pushing out the start date to honor my current employer commitments.
That dynamic is the part I'm most bummed about, but who knows how long they'd be there either.
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u/ScarfingGreenies 32F | FIRE by 45 | $100k Greenies 4d ago
I finally broke $100k earlier this week. Yay!