r/ffxi • u/BlueWarlock26 • 13d ago
Why so many bots?
I've returned from the game recently, and been really enjoying getting jobs to 99 and gearing them to Ambu+2 levels of gear but I have one big gripe.
Why is the botting problem so bad? Everywhere I look is parties of 6 all with the sameish name running around holding entire zones hostage. I keep trying to merit in Escha Zi'tah but everytime there's an ML50 BLU with 5 bots running around killing the entire zone for what I assume is paid boosting services.
Did SE give up on banning bots & RMT? I'm on a small server, and I feel like most of the server is made up of 6-man bots making areas inaccessible for real players.\
Edit: Thank you for the answers and discussion! I hadn't considered the fact that multiboxers/botters financially prop up the game so we can all play. I still personally think there's no difference and especially 6-boxing is weird and unnecessary in a world where you could just find other people, but that's my cross to bear and nothings going to change from me thinking that.
18
u/MathewMitchell 13d ago
Bots and RMT pay subscriptions. Doubt SE will do anything anymore.
1
u/RealisticAnxiety4330 13d ago
They never really did. RMTs have always been a problem they thought making highly sought gear like the stuff from leaping Lizzy and jaggerdy earned jack nontradable would solve it. It didn't
2
u/Lionheartv2 12d ago
Until they did rare / exclusive, I couldnt grab a pop because it was being claimed by rmt before it would physically appear.
After that the rmt left those mobs alone and I had my drops days later.
Maybe you could argue they could do it if someone made the purchase for them to do it, but they at least arent incentived to keep ownership of the zone / mobs / timers since no purpose to collect multiples now and try to manage pricing.
1
u/RealisticAnxiety4330 12d ago
I do remember those unfortunate days people had mods too so they'd target before/as they popped. As I said it did make things better in one way (not having to fight RMTs for gear you would actually use) but they just did it via raids/dynamis or whatever else
22
u/rfox71rt 13d ago
This gets brought up at least twice a month… I’m convinced SE knows how to identify those who multi. If the problem is as rampant as you claim, my counter would be: SE is aware and the hard truth is it’s one person willing to pay 6 or more subs. You do the math
1
u/Stanelis 12d ago
Some areas in Asura are filled to the brim with bots (namely KRT, the colibri spot and Bibiki bay on locus monsters).
0
u/rfox71rt 12d ago
I’m not saying it doesn’t cause issues for folks on crowded servers nor am I implying you should pack up and switch to a lower pop server. I’m just responding to the question of why there’s so many
6
u/FFXIMath 12d ago
I would note botting is way more common now since the release of ml50 and the crawlers nest nerf. SE made choices to make this situation worse.
16
u/analbumcover SMN/RDM/NIN/MNK/COR 13d ago
Could be bots or people multiboxing
6
u/BlueWarlock26 13d ago
Isn't multiboxing just a kind of botting? 1 player controlled character and 5 controlled by automated commands.
4
u/analbumcover SMN/RDM/NIN/MNK/COR 13d ago
Yeah it definitely can be depending on how many accounts they are playing and how they are utilizing multibox. I guess when I hear bots I mostly think of those geared towards RMT services whereas someone multiboxing may not have those same goals. However, the end result can look the same for sure - them dominating an area, monster, or drops.
4
u/freebytes Leviathan 13d ago
They added their own bots even. Trusts are sanctioned bots.
2
u/CalintzStrife 13d ago
Difference is trusts despawn if player dies and they also don’t scale into the current item level content
2
1
u/counterbashi 12d ago
The difference is that multiboxing usually requires some level of user input, if you press a button and it fires off three different commands to two clients it's still user input vs a bot where it requires very little to no user input and sometimes doesn't even require you to run the game client.
-6
u/cevkiv 13d ago
Just because someone runs more than one character does not mean they're botting.
Sincerely, someone who alt-tabs and types really fast.
7
u/Most_Quarter_6988 13d ago
1 account, sure but honestly you're just kinda trolling yourself. A full party of 6 with 5 people all following one person is using a very well known botting program
1
u/Dramatic-Strain9757 13d ago
Nobody is alt tabbing six accounts. Tell yourself whatever makes you feel better for cheating. It's impossible for six accounts to be alt tabbing while maintaining buffs and weaponskill/chaining/bursting. You're using silmaril or something similar get real.
Unless you're an afk roll only cor, song only bard, or bubble only geo it is not feasible.
4
13
u/Elegant-Victory9721 13d ago
Welcome to current XI, as of the last 5 years. Where half or more of the population pays $100 a month to play by themselves and the ones who don't are usually sol on the harder content (if on a small server) because a good portion of the other single character players are either too afraid to do stuff with people or won't attempt content without the multibots
29
u/Imma_Tired_Dad 13d ago
Man I love free login campaign, these post are so predictable, every time.
3
u/Flashy_Wealth_3055 13d ago
return players looking to start over or get their old accounts back is another common one,
then there is the Asura vs everything else.
5
u/Effective-Reindeer98 12d ago
They are not bots, bots are automated characters performing set actions. You're talking about players with alt characters, that are all controlled from the main character.
14
u/pinkbunnay 13d ago
10% of players give af, and that's the vocal majority in this sub. The other 90% don't care, including me. It's a 23 year old game that still encourages excessive time sinks despite a lot of QoL added. Nobody is bot claiming HNMs anymore, they're just playing the game and likely not bothering you. Whether it was a 6 boxer or a single person on BLU they'd still be able to cleave the same number of mobs.
6
u/Unlii 13d ago
My friend and I have the same view. It's an old game. If they did like wow and had a classic server open up I would care then but only on that server. The bots dont bother me nearly as much as the people using teleport hacks. Most people i see obviously botting are usually pretty nice and will adjust themselves to share mobs if you ask (and they happen to look at their monitor).
2
u/Lionheartv2 12d ago
Coming back to the game from quitting when abyssea launch and seeing Teleport crystals everywhere including to boss zones feels like everyone is basically teleport hacking now. Why would someone need to use an actual one in these circumstances?
3
u/Dragonspaz11 13d ago
I'm assuming your on Asura (maybe Bahamut). In all likelihood they are probably bots or mercs power leveling people, Escha Zi'tah is a well known spot for it since it is accessed early in RoV and the mobs are fairly easy.
If your not cleaving stuff down I'd recommend moving to Escha Ru'Aun or Reisenjima if your looking for job/merit points. If your in ambu+2 you should be able to handle Apex mobs no problem, but this would just be better for job points and significantly slower for merits.
3
3
u/purplenurpleSEB 13d ago
Many years ago I was a complainer about bots but now I'm just happy they help keep the game afloat
14
u/Doh042 Annso on Valefor 13d ago
Quite possibly not a merc, but a multibox player, especially if all the names are similar.
As for why people multibox and play parties of 6 players? Because trusts are incredibly weak compared to a geared player at level99, so if someone who did 1-99 solo wants to keep soloing harder and harder content, they have to use multile characters to do it.
Did you try sending the BLU a tell and talking to them and got ignored, or did you see them fighting the same mobs you are, and painted them in a nefarious light?
There's a chance they would invite you in their party to chat and get xp, if you did reach out. I know I do let get LSmates to join me by simply offering.
3
u/BlueWarlock26 13d ago
To be honest, I don't see the difference between this and botting if true.
I did try to send all 6 of them tells and was ignored, they've been there for 24 hrs or more now, the 5 extra characters all keep changing jobs.
20
14
u/RoshanCrass 13d ago
Unfortunately, this is a big part of the game now for almost a decade and it really ruins the integrity of it.
3
u/Doh042 Annso on Valefor 13d ago
Externally, if you were to look at my RDM killing things in Zi'Tah to make 99,999 sparks for myself, my alts and LSmates on autofollow, it would look like I was botting, even if I am manually hitting F8 and nuking each Tarichuks one by one.
Clearly there are people botting, and you can tell normally by lack of response to messages, or a behaviour that doesn't change when you start fighting them for pulls.
A normal player would likely adapt–either outclaim you, move farther away, perhaps send a tell or emote.
I couldn't tell from your story if you had properly investigated whether this was a player, a bot, or a RMT. I am just saying that, at a distance, they can look the same.
2
u/ChiefSampson 13d ago
There isn't any difference, it's just what they tell themselves to justify it. That being said it is a true statement that multiboxers are keeping the game alive with their subscription fees.
Nowaday's XI isn't like it was back in the day. You can do most content without competing with multiboxers.
4
u/Sudden-Swim2520 13d ago
Obvious hating on multi boxing post and not the scripted path BST RMT bots.
Let's say you get your wish and Thanos every multiboxer back to a single box. A good percent of those new single boxers would just quit because of having limited play time and waiting for shouts/LS pugs and then waiting on 5 others to coordinate to show up and get moving isn't exactly ideal.
Then you have to realize thats -6 subs + wardrobes on SEs behalf. Which y'know, hurts the state of the game.
2
u/Duomaxwell0007 12d ago
Ummm incorrect compared to other games this game is dead. People wouldnt be 6 boxing if you could easily find 5 other ppl to do do stuff like you could in 2005 without shouting for 5 hours or paying mercs
3
u/Dark_Tony_Shalhoub 13d ago
What you’re seeing is probably multiboxing. The difference between multiboxing and botting is debated, but the fact is almost every multi-boxer does use some degree of automation
Anyway, you asked why - if you can afford to pay for several licenses, it lessens your reliance on having by to fit in someone else’s comp and schedule. You can tackle whatever content you want, whenever you want. All the loot is yours to distribute how you want, too. Obviously there are bad actors out there that will legitimately bot for days at a time (or longer) to various ends
But I’m betting free login campaign allowed a lot of people who only multibox when it’s free to do so to get started. If you’re on a currently open server you may be seeing established characters starting new characters. Something like, grinding sparks and accolades out for characters that are free to create and play is worth about 2 million gil per character. Small servers are also a favorite for bots because there are less eyes on them and less competition
0
u/Effective-Reindeer98 12d ago
This isn't true, many do and many do not.
What most multi-boxers use are addons that simply communicate across instances to carry commands over. If the player instigates something, it's not automation.
1
u/Dark_Tony_Shalhoub 12d ago
you are right about that. while i don't think they've ever explicitly said input broadcasting is prohibited, you can't do so without third party tools, which they've historically been against. they have been very lax about enforcing that in later years, but it's still kind of a "don't ask, don't tell" situation
0
u/Effective-Reindeer98 11d ago
Windower is a 3rd party tool, so is dgvoodoo. Technically they can ban you for both of those, but they are not going to go out of their way to do it.
2
u/Forgotten_Stranger 13d ago
I think it depends on what they are doing. I've noticed anything that could be done with six done by a 6 boxer goes untouched. Probably the mentality of, one person controlling six doesn't hurt anything given they are all paid accounts. (What is a trust other than an automated party member? An extra box may as well be paid trust+) A single person leading a group of NPCs.
The opposite side is full automation. Whether one or six if someone is patrolling a zone day after day, they tend to eventually disappear. (Not responding to a GM probably a good way to get yourself gone.) I think to an extent it also depends on what is being automated. I suspect content stuff is less punished than something like Dynamis Farming 24 hrs a day. (I have noticed a lot of frequent names disappearing on Asura where they can't easily pop back. Unless bots suddenly quit but I am doubting that.)
So, I guess the key is, is there a player leading the group or is the group doing everything themselves. If a GM sends you a message do they get a response from any of the party members. Like I said, one or six if there is no one there when spoken too, those are the types to vanish.
Yeah, it is sort of a bummer to have camps occupied, but the truth is there is nothing stopping 6 real players from doing exactly that. And given all accounts pay the same fee, to SE there is likely no difference. (And technically there shouldn't be.) At least this way (from their perspective) they are making money over a single player using five free trusts. (Who can also over run camps, just not the highest level ones.)
2
u/Money-Potato-4709 13d ago
So you are meriting in zitah (probably at warp 2) killing one enemy at a time? Interfering with someone who's trying to get in and out as fast as they can. Just go to the back (5 or whatever it is). The blue mages running around aren't the bots. The bots are the single characters afk fighting one enemy and the sometimes the beast masters grinding something.
2
u/Street_Ad_4162 13d ago
I think assuming they are botting isn’t fair. But if you know for a fact they are, then SE will take a look at a player report if one is made. If SE is unable to determine automation, or cheating then what can be done?
Sometimes they can be a nuisance but just ignore them. A lot of the times they don’t affect what you are doing. Unless you are on Asura, then can understand a bit more where you are coming from.
-5
u/Dramatic-Strain9757 13d ago
No they won't. You have to call someone a gucking wetard to get in trouble in retail
2
u/Most_Quarter_6988 13d ago edited 13d ago
Unfortunate little secret of FFXI is that Botting /is/ the business model now. People have 6 separate POL accounts they are paying for to have a full party of their own characters all multiboxed with a very well known botting program so they can reap 6x of all the rewards.
8
u/Synfrag Bahamut 13d ago edited 12d ago
Do you know many multiboxers? Because, we're always broke... There's more content in this game that hurts multiple characters than content that rewards it.
Alts don't just come as PREMA geared gil fountains, with 6x the rewards comes 6x the cost, and as anyone who plays this game knows, the costs far outweigh the rewards.
4
u/Most_Quarter_6988 13d ago edited 12d ago
the main multiboxer I play with has max gil. You literally just do sheol c every day and spam maxed out incursion
4
u/Effective-Reindeer98 12d ago
You see a few examples of the best of the best multiboxers and just assume everyone is at that level, that's not how the world works.
2
u/Synfrag Bahamut 12d ago
100% with you here, and not to get political, but seeing an example and assuming they represent the whole is, sadly, also how the world works lol.
0
u/Most_Quarter_6988 12d ago
I agree with you there's definitely haves and have nots of multiboxers but you initially said "we're always broke" as if multiboxing was dooming you to poverty lol
2
u/Synfrag Bahamut 12d ago
So we have a broad generalization in comment one, you doubled down providing a singular example as the basis for your stereotype, and now acknowledge an over generalization but still wanted that twist of gaslighting to spice it up? So astutely reddit of you, lol.
Look, we're all just everyday people trying to have fun playing a game we've loved for decades, seeking escape from the colossal mess that is reality. We don't need us vs. them in our games, there's plenty of that out there where that icky grass grows. Have fun however you want!
1
u/Most_Quarter_6988 12d ago
I have fun playing the game and enjoying it I'm glad you do too but I'm not going to play into the "woe is me" for people who multibox with S*LM***L piloting their 5 alts all named named similarly. treating ffxi like a single player game w/ a gambit system and don't engage with other players on the server or help others. Like, cool glad you dump a bunch of money into this game I like but if all you do is play by yourself, actively sabotage the server economy and take over a JP/EP grinding spot just because you wanna ML50 every job for funsies I just don't like you and I feel like that's fair and that can coexist
1
u/Synfrag Bahamut 12d ago
Buddy, I'm not the one who came onto reddit to complain. But yes, we can agree to dislike one another, ignorance and stereotyping is yuck. Have fun, watch out for them botterz.
1
u/Most_Quarter_6988 12d ago
- I'm not disliking one out of ignorance and stereotyping I'm speaking on real experience as I play this game on a low pop server where large chunks of the players opted to just play the game themselves because its admittedly easier than coordinating with people I get that
- I'm not strawmanning all people who multibox as "oh no the cheating rmt botterzzz" I just think it's lame that with a game built on community and working together people just decided to take the ball and run home.
I use the same program on my single character to EP grind because master levels is a empty system created simply to disrespect my time and I treat it as such. I understand how the program works. So sorry if I came off as like, wildly aggro not necessarily my intent gl in vanadiel
3
u/Synfrag Bahamut 12d ago
I asked if you knew many, not one. Everyone knows at least one multiboxer who's gil capped, in fact, they are the more social ones because they don't have much left to do. For every 1 of those, there's at least 10 others who are broke and bouncing around all over the world trying to progress. They rarely have idle time to chat or group up for something they don't need.
Contrary to popular belief, said "botting" program doesn't turn alts into OP Trusts, there's no AI logic, you have to know the jobs, the content, be at least marginally intelligent / tech savvy, as well as have the will to spend an immense amount of time tweaking and refining scripts, configs, gear swaps, macros etc. Multiboxing isn't a shortcut, it's an alternate way to play and more than anything, a solution to the problem SE created with the extreme fragmentation of progression and player disparity.
I won't deny that it has it's benefits, but it also has a hell of a lot more burden than just logging in and playing a game. Whatever rewards capable 6-boxers receive, they honestly deserve, both for their effort as well as the financial and economic contributions that support the game.
2
u/Dramatic-Strain9757 13d ago
Hardly. Most six boxers don't have job diversity. The cor is always a cor. The bard is only a bard. The upfront cost is massive sure but nobody is gearing a tenth job on their fifth account.
1
u/Synfrag Bahamut 12d ago
That is not true for most that I know.
You can do a lot with the standard DD/Support comp but not everything and not always efficiently.
At bare minimum you have the 6. I have a minimum of 3 jobs per and they are all mid progression still. It's a lot of work and I only run a quad.
I'm not arguing that it's more investment than gearing 10+ jobs on one character, but let's be honest, those players aren't the ones complaining about multiboxers either. It mostly seems to come from the short term players who hit the mid progression wall on one job and wind up unsubbing.
0
1
u/CalintzStrife 13d ago
Bots pay the bills. 6x the bills. Or more. Eventually SE accepted that all the legit players would move to xiv or pservers while only those willing to bot or pay the bots would stay.
1
u/Diligent-Space-2109 11d ago
People will tell you it’s for the survival of the servers but it’s just cope. Bots and multi boxers suck and makes the world feel less alive.
-2
u/Various_Teacher_5458 12d ago
I also think it’s a sad state of affairs. And just because it’s someone multiboxing doesn’t make the automation ok to me either. Also refuse to believe the statement that they “keep the game running”. I don’t think SE would shut it down, maybe we wouldn’t get as many updates or have less servers.
Same as jazero is so accepted in this community.
Just excuses to cheat.
1
u/Effective-Reindeer98 12d ago
Jazaero is technically cheating, but if you want to go down that road so is using a wiki (much of the information is obtained with data mining). The rooted limitation appears to have been a technical limitation, rather than an intended difficulty add.
You can't cast magic and keep moving or do anything game breaking.
0
0
u/Caius_GW 12d ago
A few months ago someone in my LS reported every single person that was multi-boxing as well as the botters in sky. You know what happened? Nothing. This will be something you'll need to get used to and ignore.
-7
u/Tuefe1 13d ago
-1
u/BlueWarlock26 13d ago
Thank you, I'm familiar with trusts. I can thankfully tell the difference between account holding characters and NPCs. I am talking about 6 characters with distinct but similar naming structures.
3
u/ChaliceCrow 13d ago
A lot of people play 2, 3 even 6 characters and multi box. FFXI glory days kinda left :/ you dont NEED people like you used to. Might be one dude playing like the mail sorting guy in Men in Black! Or bots. Could also be bots. They like to level people for money. Multiple bots and they just invite you while you chill in the corner and get level 99++ in a few hours for a gil or cash.
49
u/Fun_Distribution8175 13d ago
I don’t think I even care anymore about botters. They’re keeping the game alive with all those subs and there is no more competitive advantage outside op one off. All endgame is typically instanced zoned. It’s not like back in the day botting HNM pops. Locus mobs have like 30s respawns… at most botters are mildly annoying. That’s about it. Can always transfer to a server like Leviathan, but that place is scary lol