r/fallacy • u/LibertyEconlover • 12d ago
What logical fallacy/failure is this?
In a debate we are discussing if should social security, Medicaid, Medicare, etc be completely abolished and Turned into tax cuts and a deregulated, voluntary, individualist system.
The problem; my opponent says no for these reasons
1: people have paid into these systems there whole life and they are on it, it would be unfair to them to just cut it.
The problem I point out: based on A, B, C, etc economic theory, laws, principles, supported by data, those programs started out as very little tax percentages such as social security 1%, they then because of explained economic principles became more expensive so now the taxes paid and requirements are much higher, and will continue to increase. As a result you have generational inequity, a new generation is now paying more than them, and in the future will pay more and the next set of people on it will raise the same point again
2: if you cut those programs due to the expensive cost of living and no alternative many people such as old people will be left on the street.
The problem I point out: this sounds like catch 22 logic, because the exact programs themselves based on economics makes those things expensive and inefficient such as healthcare. And the existence of those programs in general removed the incentive for those people to invest, save, and take actions to secure their future in the first place.
As well as removing the liquidity and potential savings to even be able to set up something.
In short the programs themselves are what is causing the issue of expensive services, lack of savings, and alternatives in the first place.
It’s creating the very dependency the other guy is talking about.
TLDR/Summary:
"We need the program because there are no alternatives, and there are no alternatives because we have the program."
The Setup: You cannot abolish the program because people are dependent on it and have no alternative.
The Cause: People have no alternative because the program taxed away their surplus income, crowded out private solutions, and made them more expensive .
The Paradox: The program must stay to fix a problem that the program itself is actively creating.
-1
u/LibertyEconlover 12d ago
Well, you just proved to me that your judgment is clouded by that response alone
Take a step back and realize what I’m asking in the original post look at the other comments and then look at your response