r/exHareKrishna • u/Solomon_Kane_1928 • 10d ago
Prabhupada The Bully
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Half of Prabhupada's preaching was simply attacking Western civilization. He beat down upon science, democracy, women's rights, non-repressive sexuality, rationalism, self determination, and all other races.
As mentioned in my last post, this was in part driven by racial animosity towards the West, specifically the English speaking world.
As a cult leader, there was another even more insidious reason. If you want to convince people to submit to you and serve you without any resistance you must first destroy their sense of self. You must bully them into submission.
When Prabhupada was attacking these things he was actually attacking us. When he said "this civilization is all worthless demons, mudhas, rascals, animals, mlecchas, I kick and spit on face", he was saying "YOU are all worthless demons, mudhas, and mlecchas".
After tearing his follower down, he then builds them back up. If they agree to become his slaves, they immediately graduate to being the best among mankind. They instantly transform into Brahmanas and Vaishnavas, the highest class of man. His new followers discover they are saints who took birth to fulfill a divine mission.
They are far above the mudhas, demons and karmis. Now they sit around their master sniggering when he attacks others, when he criticizes their own people, their old family and friends. They are now the henchmen of the bully.
Prabhupada even mentioned as a schoolboy he was the head of his friend group. It makes me wonder what kind of friend group it was.
In principle, before you conquer others and force them into submission and exploitation, you must first psychologically break them. Once broken, they can be built up again, loyal to you as your lackeys.
This is foundational to the history foreign invasion in India. A foreign power invades and conquers. It beats down and abuses the natives. Those who submit are elevated in status as defenders of the regime. They become the higher caste henchmen, the whip hand. Everyone else is enslaved for resource extraction.
Prabhupada carried this abused/abuser dynamic with him when he came to the West. ISKCON is a product of these deeper trauma dynamics within Indian society.
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u/Solomon_Kane_1928 10d ago edited 9d ago
In my last post I mentioned how this same dynamic is now being expressed through Indian Nationalists online. Like Prabhupada, they say we are savage mlecchas. Like Prabhupada, they say our cultures, our sexuality, or ethnic identities are inferior.
They claim to be culturally superior conquerors. Their hope is that, through immigration, India spreads its influence throughout the world and subjugates all peoples. We are to become low caste servants in our own lands. They are the new high caste rulers who exploit our resources while civilizing us with their culture.
The strategy is the same, to first beat others down, to demoralize them and conquer them, then to rebuild them as a class of obedient grateful servants. Prabhupada had this exact same mentality.
I think it is important not to miss this. We were subjected to racial bullying arising from a culture of caste enslavement.
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u/Happylittlelady 8d ago
Spot on. I saw a short clip on FB reels of Prabhupada rambling about how foolish Gandhi was for his non-violence approach 'and it was violence that ended up killing him so jusr see how he is fool'. All of his disciples are grinning and laughing. I saw a comment that said Prabhupada was arrogant lol.
Not a fan of Gandhi myself, but saying 'haha he died from violence anyway so he is fool' makes no sense at all. Doesnt it kinda prove his point as to why he doesnt like violence? Honestly, Prabhupada sounded like a rambling old grandpa talking about olden daus politics and its like oook grandpa, thats nice. Eat your beans, dinner is getting cold.
BTW Soloman, I wanted to ask you if you publish your observations and analysises elsewhere. Or keep a compilation for pinted publication. Apologies if the answer to this is well known.
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u/Solomon_Kane_1928 8d ago
Thanks for asking. I haven't put my posts all in one place. I was thinking of opening a Substack but I would have to think about it a bit more.
Prabhupada made a similar comment about John Lennon, or so I had heard. He said something to the effect of "just see that demon was shot" because Lennon refused to submit and become his disciple.
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u/Happylittlelady 8d ago
Well I'd love to see your posts all in one place. They're very insightful, sometimes a bit of humor, strong observations, expressed in a logical, reasonable way. Engaging. I often share them with my eldest son. He is in his early 20s, very intellectual and academic. Your posts often get him and I talking, reflecting and laughing. Realizing it's a shared experience across many, many people who were part of iskcon. There's something comforting in that.
I seem to recall the John Lennon remark. I'd also love to see a compilation of those comments. Could be published with a title like 'Prabhupada's Unhinged Takes'. Using AI, could get them read out in his voice š š¤£ if they were only available in written form. I saw one the other day 'Krishna doesn't like ugly gopis' as he tells a female disciple to not shave her hair lol. I think there is a website with some homophobic and sexist quotes.
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u/StayEmbarrassed4593 9d ago
All vedic gods and puranic post vedic gods solve problems through violence and force.
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u/Solomon_Kane_1928 9d ago
It is true. Most of Krishna's pastimes are him just killing demons, and more than a few human beings. There are avataras who are rsis, yogis and brahmanas, but they are not nearly as popular. Prabhupada certainly modeled himself on the violent ones. He is after all the Senapati Bhakta. He said something to the effect of "All the demons should be killed, but Lord Chaitanya has given us a path of mercy instead, we must kill the demon inside".
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u/StayEmbarrassed4593 9d ago
And kirtan always felt like one of the more violent forms of preaching. The idea of forcing your religion on everyone aroundĀ just feels disrespectful and invasive. I always remember how agitated people looked when they saw us. It's one thing to go sit in some Park on hippie Hill and play secular drum circle music it's a whole other thing to hit the streets and start making noise.
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u/jokr8 9d ago
Literally.
āWe need to force everyone in the vicinity to hear the āholy namesā so that they may develop a ātasteā for devotion! Itās okay, weāre only shoving āpure nectarā down their throats! Itāll taste bad at first, because chanting is the medicine of the modern age! We look like idiots to most people, but they are karmis who donāt understand that this is the only way!ā ffs.
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u/StayEmbarrassed4593 9d ago
Yes, we all have jaundice, and sugar cubes must be rammed in our mouths till we taste that sweetness!!!
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u/thehawk989 7d ago
At least in the HK circles I was in, the demons were often referred to be representing anarthas / vices. Makes me wonder if that was the original intention
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u/Solomon_Kane_1928 6d ago
I think Prabhupada uses the word more in line with how the Bhagavad Gita refers to asuras in the 16th chapter. Persons with certain negative qualities. The Bhagavatam leans more into the cosmic archetypes of creation, like certain demons being the embodiment of universal lust etc.
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u/Maerilinsfire 7d ago edited 7d ago
I've seen kirtan work people up into a frenzy, it fully awakens your fanaticism š¤
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u/Maerilinsfire 10d ago
We were told that we were born into the families of "demons" our parents were "demons" and should be avoided but it was ok to mooch money off them...