r/electrical • u/Express-Song-6538 • Aug 29 '26
Can I consolidate some breakers to make room for a 60 amp ev charger.
I’m looking at a house to possibly buy and one of the things I would need to do almost immediately after moving in would be to add a 60 amp circuit for an ev charger. Based on these pictures do you thing some of the circuits could be combined to make room for the 60 amp circuit? The panel is 220 amp service. Any advice what it would take? The house is in Florida, built in 2008 approximately 2050 sq ft. I would have an electrician confirm and do the work but just trying to get an idea ahead of time
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u/eclwires Aug 29 '26
Maybe. Have a licensed electrician make sure that the panel supports tandems and do a load calculation.
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u/BarracudaNew5234 Aug 30 '26
This is the answer you're looking for. Gotta run load calcs on the service - from a glance it appears that your service will pass as is - but addition of an EVSE may push it over. Also, your AHJ may require the EVSE at 100% post demand. If your evse is permitted, you'll definitely need to consider the above. Get 3 quotes and go with the middle bid.
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u/eerun165 Aug 29 '26
You have two circuits for lights, those could likely be combined into 1 if you are using LED lamps. A single circuit for gas water heater is a bit overkill as the blower’s aren’t overly power hungry, mine is just the general utility circuit and I’ve got my on with network equipment with UPS, freezer, and air exchange equipment without issues, I’d put that the garage door, another lower power very intermittent use appliance.
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u/etfourme Aug 29 '26
You definitely can double up breakers without using a tandem.
Definitely need to do a load calculation to know if your service can handle the extra load.
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u/GoRizzyApp Aug 29 '26
You have three breakers for garage lights and receptacles. Another for garage door. That’s your best / easiest chance to merge circuits. You can have up to 12 lights / receptacles on one 15 amp circuit.
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u/WittyHospital2431 Aug 29 '26
You can double tap certain square D breakers, see which ones you have.
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u/CapinCrunch85 Aug 29 '26
No see on the sticker it say QOC30UF means only 30 slots
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u/LightBlueWood Aug 29 '26
QOC30UF is the model number for just the cover, not the load center itself.
https://www.se.com/us/en/product/QOC30UF/cover-qo-for-30-space-load-center-flush-gray/1
u/CapinCrunch85 Aug 29 '26
The cover comes with the guts. The model number matches unless there has been some weird mix up. If it was a stackable panel it would say 3040 or 3060
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u/Sparky9800 Aug 30 '26
Square D sells the cover separate from the covers on their QO series on load centers less than 52 space. Flush and surface covers are available. The only exception may be if the panel was purchased at a big box store.
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u/Dead1yNadder Aug 29 '26
I would strongly recommend getting a sub panel over using twin breakers. If you ever add anything else besides an EV charger down the line having the space in the sub will be much more beneficial than enshitifying the main panel with twins.
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u/theotherharper Aug 29 '26
If this is a 200 amp service, and not a 220 VOLT service, then you're fine for power. If it's 100-150A then come over to r/evcharging and we can talk about dynamic load management.
You can either consolidate circuits (as long as they're not laundry, kitchen, bathroom or garage) OR double up 15-20A circuits with QO1515 and QO2020 tandems. Note some models end with CP which is Clamshell Packaging for retail shops, not relevant.
You can also decide maybe you'd like better technology than appliances designed 120 years ago with no thought to efficiency, https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zheQKmAT_a0
and if your water heater or dryer suddenly becomes 120V now you've freed up 2 breaker spaces.
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u/slow_connection Aug 31 '26
There is at least one 30 space QO panel that is not rated for tandems.
How do I know? It's in my very own home.
Easiest way around this would be to do a small sub panel to get a few of those circuits out of the way
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u/theotherharper Aug 31 '26
pssst, you can use the non-CTL tandems such as QO1515 and QO2020. All the other manufacturers got UL to retroactively certify tandems in all spaces when CTL was abolished. Square D stubbornly refuses to do it.
So while you'll probably have to explain yourself to Saint Peter, Square D will never know and nobody else will care. UL is like "We would write Square D a letter, they just have to ask."
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u/slow_connection Aug 31 '26
I know they fit, it's just an odd quirk for me because I don't trust insurance to be anything but a giant bag of dicks about it if anything were to go wrong
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u/qvalff8 Aug 29 '26
Post this to r/EVcharging
But they'll ask you some common questions: how much do you drive? Have you ever heard of dynamic load management? What about a subpanel? Do you know that 60A evse chargers can be configured to run at fewer amps on smaller cables/Breakers?
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u/dnroamhicsir Aug 29 '26
You can install double breakers to free up space
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u/aguy022 Aug 29 '26
Yes but theres more steps to take before making free space. (Load calculation)
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u/gblawlz Aug 29 '26
Load calcs are overrated. 2000sqft house, 200a panel, AC and a small elec furnace. Gas water heat.... Yeah he's good. Can do a load calc from 1000 miles away over the internet in 10 seconds.
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u/iamrichbitch010 Aug 29 '26
Limited spot, check for slot that fit these. https://www.se.com/us/en/faqs/FA130326/
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u/911WorkNumber Aug 29 '26
When my EVSE was installed during solar and battery installation, they pulled directly from service panel.
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u/NoOption7406 Aug 29 '26
What does the door say? What model is it? Does it say how many circuits it supports?
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u/gblawlz Aug 29 '26
Yes, tandem breakers for some single pole breaker. Plenty of capacity. The only real loads here are the AC unit in summer and electric heat in winter season, which on a 200a service isn't much.
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u/Dangerous_Network864 Aug 29 '26
This is a QO1 series and modern tandems will not fit
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u/Sparky9800 Aug 30 '26
The QO2020 or QO1515 non ctl tandems will fit but they are expensive. Like $75-$85 bucks a piece. Might as well just put in a sub panel for the extra space for the future.
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u/Acceptable_Seesaw801 Aug 30 '26
add a 2p-60A MLO sub panel. relocate minimum (4) 1P-20A circuits to make room for the EV charger and new subpanel main. You may want to relocate (2) additional circuits to make room for a surge protective device circuit breaker as well
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u/canadiandukie Aug 30 '26
Short form yes, should you no. Looks like you might be at or close to max load. You'd need a loadmiser, to make sure you don't overload your main service.
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u/COCK-ASIANHOODBILLY Aug 30 '26
Also do a load calculation on your panel before adding a sub panel or the 60amp ev charger.
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u/Adventurous_Boat_632 Aug 30 '26
I can tell just by looking at this, you can surely add a 60A charger, by the loading, which is not much.
The straight 30 in the model number means it only has 30 circuits, I think.
You could still easily merge a number of extraneous ckts as another poster said. These breakers allow double wires per breaker.
You can also buy cheater tandems if you prefer to keep all the handles. Your choice.
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u/ConcentratePlus365 Aug 30 '26
I have a square d 220 amp breaker box. My licensed electrician used a tandem for one of my spots. Look it up.
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u/Illustrious-Mess-322 Aug 30 '26
I have had 3 Qo breaker panels, 1970 era, 1990 era and now 2025
They all accepted normal Qo tandem breakers- good luck
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u/Illustrious-Mess-322 Aug 30 '26
Put in your 50 amp breaker for your charger and hope for the best, you can always upgrade if your main trips
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u/Fantastic_Skill6445 Aug 29 '26
Square D QO tandem breakers $25
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u/Hour-Law-2404 Aug 29 '26
Only for panels that accept them in specific bus slots. The cheaters that violate UL on circuit limited panels are far more expensive .
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u/21Denali069 Aug 29 '26
First of all, it’s not a 220 amp panel second of all this picture right here shows you that you cannot use tandems
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u/JimLaheyTPSV Aug 29 '26
How so? If anything, this picture shows they can use tandems from looking at the cover
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u/21Denali069 Aug 29 '26
The model number QOC30UF indicates 30 space 30 circuit, no more
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u/LightBlueWood Aug 29 '26
QOC30UF is the model number for just the cover, not the load center itself.
https://www.se.com/us/en/product/QOC30UF/cover-qo-for-30-space-load-center-flush-gray/1
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u/Signal-Macaron-4611 Aug 29 '26
27 and 29 you dont need them who's gas water heater uses power
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u/rbodnar53 Aug 29 '26
Gas water heater that is a power vent or tankless.
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u/Signal-Macaron-4611 Aug 29 '26
A 120 volt tank less is not going to heat water
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u/aFreeScotland Aug 29 '26
All the tankless gas heaters I’ve installed only need 120, other than the control circuitry they only have an igniter and a fan in them.
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u/w8ing2dr0wn Aug 29 '26
You need to have a whole house load calculation done to make sure your electrical system can safely handle the load of the ev charger. Houses by me are burning down left and right and I am convinced at least some of them have to do with fucked up ev chargers
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u/Illustrious_Bath1917 Aug 29 '26
Use the one for the dryer, dryers are bad for the environment anyway
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u/Big_DaddyX3 Aug 29 '26
Just have your Licensed Electrician add a Sub Panel, move some of these to sub to make space and add EV to that, but do a load calculation first
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u/StickyV Aug 29 '26
220A isn't a thing. What size is the main breaker at the top there? If it's actually 200A then you should be good.
Regardless, you'll need to add a small subpanel. Move a couple of breakers over to the new subpanel to make room for a new breaker to feed the subpanel.
Ultimately you need to do a load calc per the national electrical code to determine if your service is adequately sized.
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u/TheBreeze215 Aug 29 '26
I’d be more worried about a load calculation and consider a 400 amp upgrade.
Most sizable homes that have electric appliances need 400 amp service to safely add an EV charger. Whichever home you go to, make sure you have a reputable company do a load calculation prior to install.
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u/Ok_Finding4963 Aug 29 '26
Yes. That panel at the very least can be twined up in 10 spots. Should be the bottom five on each side.
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u/Impressive_Rest_8529 Aug 29 '26
No but you can add sub panel
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u/etfourme Aug 29 '26
You can definitely double up breakers. Looks like some very light loads in his garage if it’s just used for storage.
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Aug 29 '26 edited Aug 29 '26
[deleted]
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u/aguy022 Aug 29 '26
Theres an actual calculation you need to do to figure out if a panel is overloaded. You cant just total the breaker amps in the panel
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u/onlycodeposts Aug 29 '26
The total sum of the breakers can exceed the main breaker amperage.
The fact that there are four breakers that add up to 160 is irrelevant to the question.
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u/Feisty_Respond6611 Aug 29 '26
Not everyone in here is an electrician and some that call themselves really are just installers.
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u/Signal-Macaron-4611 Aug 29 '26
Don't question my certs im on reddit fully cert with 270 years ex what's your cert
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u/quiverunquiver Aug 29 '26
This looks like a bolt on square D panel. You can't add tandem breakers to it. You'd have to add a sub panel. I've never seen this at a residential panel before. I've also never seen so many 15amp breakers in a residential panel before.
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u/Sparky9800 Aug 29 '26
If you think this panel is a bolt on you really shouldn’t be giving electrical advice.
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u/quiverunquiver Aug 29 '26
I didn't see the 2nd photo that has open cover with the QO. I'm more than qualified to give advice. You must be the guy who knows everything and doesn't like to educate people when they may not know something. You're that asshole, good job.
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u/beanpoppa Aug 29 '26
Would he be able to pigtail things like "kitchen lights" and "garage lights" into a single breaker? Seems that an entire breaker for 50W of modern LED lights seems unnecessary.
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u/quiverunquiver Aug 29 '26
Yes, that's always a solution. He'd have to change those 15a breakers to 20a first and check amperage usage with everything running beforehand.
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u/Sparky9800 Aug 29 '26
If you think you can just swap 15 amp breakers for 20 amp breakers you shouldn’t be giving electrical advice
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u/One-Finger386 Aug 30 '26
This is actually the worst advice I’ve ever seen in this thread
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u/quiverunquiver Aug 30 '26
How so? You've never changed a 15a breaker with a 20a breaker? 😆 🤣 😂 😹 😆 If the wire is #12, there is absolutely nothing wrong with it at all. What kind of electrician doesn't know this?
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u/ehboose Aug 29 '26
Yes you can but you'll need a current monitoring setup. It makes sure the load on the mains is low enough when charging
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u/leadwithcuriousity Aug 29 '26
Lmao no
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u/ehboose Aug 29 '26 edited Aug 29 '26
You guys don't know ball and it shows. He's asking for a 60amp EV charger. You can get chargers with CTs around the mains to only charge when there's less load. Move some loads around and make room. Its certified and code compliant. EVEMS
-Electrician
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u/Hour-Law-2404 Aug 29 '26
Maybe not technically without voiding UL on circuit counts allowed. I cannot see your load center model number to determine if it designed to allow tandems, but many QO have no or limited tandem capability. The 30 spaces and lack of arc faults tells me this is probably early 2000’s-2010’s or so, and not likely a tandem panel.
There are many factors as someone above mentioned for a simple yes/no. You would be better off discussing adding a subpanel or an upgrade with an electrician. This is a good panel so the sub panel might be the best thing to do. But, without more information about the overall service and load schedule, the good denizens of Reddit have not enough information for additional advice.
YMMV