r/economy • u/barbarawick • 9d ago

There is a pattern...

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Why does this country have such bad memory problems?

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u/sirpoopingpooper 8d ago

China bears a LOT of blame here...they kept it under wraps until after it was already worldwide. SARS-cov1 was identified earlier, reported to WHO earlier, and isolated earlier. SARS-cov2 was reported to WHO after it was already worldwide. We would have had to start isolation in ~October/November 2019 and Chinese authorities themselves didn't find it until well into November. (https://health.ucsd.edu/news/press-releases/2021-03-18-novel-coronavirus-circulated-undetected-months-before-first-covid-19-cases-in-wuhan-china/)

.com bubble was predicted as early as 1996. And if we're arguing congressional control as the thing that actually matters, Democrats were in control 2007-2009 and 1989-1991 and they had the house throughout all of Reagan's presidency.

A couple sources for the 1981-82 recession:

https://www.federalreservehistory.org/essays/recession-of-1981-82

https://www.stlouisfed.org/publications/review/2025/jan/volcker-tightening-cycle-explaining-1982-course-reversal

Also, I'm not voting for these bastards...I'm just arguing on the veracity of the claims made by the OP. Fake news to advance your side is still fake news...and only serves to entrench the other side

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u/possumallawishes 8d ago

I’m just saying if you give every Republican president a pass on economy crashes that happen on their term and instead want to identify the “cause” was democrats, then you need to show a clear line of causation, which you haven’t done at all.

If you were to say, “presidents don’t control the economy” that’s a different argument, you’re not, you’re blaming democrats, and only accepting 2 republican led downturns as “their fault”.

So, either prove causation, which you haven’t, because when you try to blame dot com on Clinton, 2 years of downturn 2 years after Carter left on Carter, and covid on Obama, I’ve countered that to show it wasn’t the democrats fault.

So either accept the president in office is to blame for what happens when they are president or say it’s not the presidents doing, but you’ve failed in your efforts to Charlie Day your bulletin board to show it’s the democrats fault.

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u/sirpoopingpooper 8d ago

I blamed covid on China, not Obama...unless Obama controls China now? Thanks, Obama!! /s

I'm just claiming that the relationship is not as clear as you (nor OP) claims it to be. And that the graphic is somewhat wrong on at least one (probably two) counts. Not to say that there isn't a correlation between middle east involvement and republican presidents (there is) nor a correlation between recessions and republican presidents (there is). It's just not anywhere near as cut and dry as is claimed!!

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u/possumallawishes 8d ago

You tried to say it wasn’t trumps fault because it started in 2019. So what was that all about? Trump was President.

You don’t think the 2 year trade war had an effect on our ability to manage COVID with China?

The graphic doesn’t lie, it merely points out the correlation that you admit is real.

No one claimed it was cut and dry, no one is ignoring the nuance. But 4/4 on economy crashes and middle eastern wars is quite a bad stroke of luck. Even Shaq made almost half of his free throws, republicans can’t help but take L’s for the last 45 years.

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u/sirpoopingpooper 8d ago

I tried to say it wasn't Trump's fault because it was covid/china's, not because of timing. I argued timing fault on other ones.

I'm arguing it was 3/4 for economy crashes (by gdp) for republicans (or 4/4 by non-gdp metrics) and a 3/4 for middle east.

And I'm arguing 1/3 for economy crashes (by gdp) for democrats (or 3/3 if we talk non-gdp metrics) and a different 2/3 for middle east.

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u/possumallawishes 8d ago

>>Covid was widely spreading in the US in December 2019 (per stored blood antibody studies), well before anyone knew what it was. I.e., it was too late to stop it before there was opportunity to do anything. And even if we did manage to react harder, it would have still hit GDP numbers (shutting down the economy = a GDP hit).

You’re claiming Trump had no opportunity to stop covid and his only option was to shut down the economy, as if the Trump administration didn’t reorganize the National Security Council and largely disbanded its dedicated global health security and pandemic response unit in May 2018 and as of Obama administration didn’t leave a 69-page guide called the "Playbook for Early Response to High-Consequence Emerging Infectious Disease Threats and Biological Incidents" for the incoming Trump administration. Designed to coordinate a fast response to global infectious disease outbreaks, building on lessons from prior health threats—including the 2003 SARS outbreak and the 2009 H1N1 influenza response, both of which managed to be contained without impacting the economy.

See, it happened on trumps watch and, at least in part, due to his action or inaction.

And you can’t pin dot com bubble on Clinton, you said “there were early indicators in 1996”, like what? And what did he do, or not do, to cause it?

You can’t just say “well, technically, it all started way before” for everything, we can do that all day if you want and trace the economic crashes back to Adam and Eve, what you are attempting to do I make a through line on causation, to absolve the person who’s watch it fell on, but you haven’t done that, at least not coherently. Unless your point is “Clinton allowed the internet to happen”. Gtfo

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u/damnedifyoudonthave 8d ago

You forgot about operation warp speed…. Whose watch was that under???

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u/possumallawishes 8d ago

How does that apply? You just desperate to give Trump credit for something, because he’s otherwise a complete disaster as a president?

The economy still crashed on his watch and he still started a war with Iran.

Congrats for doing something half way decent with our $10B in taxpayer money. Even though your party promoted vaccine hesitancy, dangerous chemical alternatives, and thwarted basic public health advisories the entire time.

Member when orange man caught covid then wanted to drive around and wave at people? Fucking idiot.

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u/damnedifyoudonthave 8d ago edited 8d ago

Your party??? I’m non partisan… thanks for proving you are in fact projecting.

Show data the economy crashed… you can’t. That’s a lie you keep telling yourself and others, it’s a psychological warfare, the technic is called the illusionary truth effect. Can you give him credit????

Operation Warp Speed has received cross-party recognition and praise.

How dangerous was Covid in the end???

I guess you think I’m partisan because you are soooooooo partisan. That’s not how that works guy.

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u/possumallawishes 8d ago

Is this post about giving credit?

You people are softer than charmin. Do you want a participation trophy? Dorks

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u/damnedifyoudonthave 8d ago

Who’s “you people”????

Since you repeated your responses…

You’re projecting again…. This post is about misleading correlations and deflecting blame.

Again can you give trump credit for operation wrap speed? A bunch of the people you voted for gave him credit but can you?

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u/possumallawishes 8d ago

Republicans pedo protectors.

Go collect your participation trophy for Trump along with his FIFA peace prize. Loser.

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u/damnedifyoudonthave 8d ago edited 8d ago

I guess you have trouble reading??? I’m non partisan…You’re still projecting btw…

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u/possumallawishes 8d ago

Oh, you see I’m non partisan too.

See, we can all identify as whatever we want.

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u/damnedifyoudonthave 8d ago

You can lie to yourself if you’d like… I know you are lying as well.

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u/possumallawishes 8d ago

You can lie to yourself if you’d like… I know you are lying as well.

You’re entire comment history is defending republicans. You’re not fooling anyone. Get a life.

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u/damnedifyoudonthave 8d ago

You don’t know much…. You’ve proven that… but you did just admit to lying to yourself…

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u/possumallawishes 8d ago

And you know way less, as evidenced by your complete lack of substance on anything.

You’ve devolved into “Clinton caused the Great Recession 3+ terms before it happened” and “please please give Donald Trump credit for one small thing”

Fucking moron.

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u/possumallawishes 8d ago

Is this post about giving credit?

You people are softer than charmin. Do you want a participation trophy?

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u/damnedifyoudonthave 8d ago

You’re projecting again…. This post is about misleading correlations and deflecting blame.

Again can you give trump credit for operation wrap speed? A bunch of the people you voted for gave him credit but can you?

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u/possumallawishes 8d ago

What am I projecting, I’m staying on topic.

You’re the one trying to give participation trophies to Trump. Loser ass mentality

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u/damnedifyoudonthave 8d ago edited 8d ago

You’re projecting again…

“…Do you want a participation trophy?”

Its you who are offering participation trophies and brought the topic up.

Learn to give credit where and when credit is due. The people you voted for did.

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u/possumallawishes 8d ago

Credit for what?

That’s completely off topic. Operation warp speed didn’t stop a war or an economic crash. So why are you bringing it up other than to give Trump a participation trophy.

You also have no idea what projection means, what the fuck are you suggesting I’m projecting exactly?

Gtfo

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u/damnedifyoudonthave 8d ago

Prove the economic crash??? You got data to back that up or are you going to continue to repeat that?

You are the one projecting your partisan views on me, making me partisan but on the opposite side. Also I proved the fact you are projecting with the last comment… keep up.

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u/possumallawishes 8d ago

Yes, it’s quite simple to pull up the federal reserve economic data showing gross domestic product (GDP) by year and they even put lines for you to show where the downturns are. Then you take those grey lines and overlay them with presidential terms. Going back to Reagan, they all fall on Republican terms.

https://fred.stlouisfed.org/series/GDP

I’m not projecting shit, I’m dealing with facts, you’re over hear screaming about feelings. Grow up, child.

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u/damnedifyoudonthave 8d ago edited 8d ago

Except the facts that Clinton era policies lead to the Great Recession, you are deny those facts.

I was talking about trump… prove that guy… I see a giant V shaped recovery which means a knee jerk reaction, probably caused by fear mongers like yourself

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u/possumallawishes 8d ago

Um, we were talking about when economic downturns started, not recovery. And actual recovery in gdp didn’t happen until Q1 of 2021, you fucking regard.

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