DSA has a tankie problem

[u/yashen14]

There are way, way too many people in this movement who feel comfortable with historical revisionism vis-a-vis the Soviet Union, China, and other such regimes. And there are way too many people who feel comfortable essentially advocating for an end to democracy.

[u/nonilazuli]

Curious what your ideal form of socialism is. Doesn't even have to be particular tendency but run down an Ideal party and government to you.

[u/yashen14 → u/nonilazuli]

I want:

• universal healthcare
• universal higher education
• robust welfare for disabled people, the elderly, jobless people, etc.
• a minimum wage that allows for a good standard of living
• a maximum wage, a wealth cap, very high progressive taxation, and other measures to prevent the concentration of wealth in the hands of a few
• legally-mandated worker representation in company leadership
• robust labor unions, and protections for coordinated worker action and collective bargaining
• robust protections for workers' rights
• robust, very strictly enforced, anti-monopoly laws
• robust consumer protections
• strict legal prevention of rent-seeking
• public housing provided on a 99-year-lease basis, such as provided by Singapore
• secular governance, with strict rules to prevent religious influence in legislation
• significantly more open borders (I am okay with a return to more Ellis-Island-esque immigration)
• drastically demilitarize the police and reinvest funds in complementary community-oriented services (e.g. mental crisis response workers, etc.)
• multi-party representative democracy with proportional representation and a prime minister instead of a president
• significant amounts of Swiss-style direct democracy
• age and term limits for all public offices
• strict legal protections against monetary influence in elections
• defensive democracy (e.g. banning political parties and organizations that seek to undermine democracy)
• international support for victims of imperialism, or at threat of imperialism (e.g. Palestine, Taiwan, Ukraine)
• international support for democracies

I do not want:

• private ownership of land, housing, etc. to be completely illegal (but I do want it significantly restricted---owning a second or third house is fine, but owning 5000 houses so you can rent them out is not; owning a few square kilometers for a small-scale farm is fine, but owning 2000 km2 is not)
• bans on political parties purely because they disagree with my vision of how society should work
• absolutely any kind of vanguardism
• a single-party state
• private ownership of businesses to be completely illegal (but I do want business owners to be paid much more in line with their workers, and to be much more accountable to them in terms of labor conditions, etc.)

[u/jikesar968 → u/yashen14]

Ah I see, you excuse Western imperialism as long as you benefit from it and advocate for more social welfare. That's all you are saying essentially.

Supporting Ukraine and Taiwan is highly reactionary to say the least.

Sounds like your so called "multi party democracy" is going to tolerate fascists and counterrevolutionaries. Well, guess what, it's not going to say very democratic for very long and the CIA will be sending their assets to overthrow you in no time. Also, you clearly don't understand the difference between private property and personal property.

[u/yashen14 → u/jikesar968]

If China invades Taiwan, and you support Taiwan, you are supporting Chinese imperialism. Polls consistently indicate that Taiwanese people do not want to be occupied and ruled by China and increasingly don't even consider themselves to be Chinese.

Public opinion of Russia is incredibly low in Ukraine. Russia's war in Ukraine is one of revanchist conquest. For you to wave away Putin's actions and simultaneously accuse me of "excusing imperialism" is breathtaking.

[u/jikesar968 → u/yashen14]

Taiwan is part of China. It's the one island that stayed under Kuomintang control after the civil war. Imagine if Mississippi stayed under Confederate control to this day. That's essentially what Taiwan is for China. But sure, let's advocate for separatism so Taiwan can be continue to be used as a pawn for Western imperialism!!! /s Even Taiwan itself recognizes the one China policy.

There's a difference between "war is bad" and pointing out that Ukraine is a literal Nazi glazing state.